To feel a bit put out by receiving an invoice?

[TiredAudreyTwoShoes]

We recently asked three builders for quotes, we've had them all in and placed the job. I was rather surprised to receive an invoice from one of the unsuccessful builders for their time and labour in preparing the quote and associated drawings.

I wasn't advised that there would be any costs involved in receiving a quote and I didn't ask for drawings (the other builders didn't offer or supply them as it's only a small job).

I feel really put out, before I go back to him to say so, AIBU?

Charging for a quote is fine, but they needed to be up front about it from the beginning. Having not mentioned it previously, they can't send an invoice and expect to be paid.

I do a hobby where people often go to a shop to try on equipment but then order it online as it's cheaper. The shops still help try on because it's a specialised product and people will come back to somewhere that gives good service, and pay for the equipment to be regularly maintained etc.

The thing us Mari, if you flip it on its head then there will be time wasters providing quotes when they have no real intention of putting in a realistic quote for the work. There is no simple solution. What needs to happen is proper scoping of the opportunity before the quofe/pitch is made to mean you only go if a real chance of winning. Sounds like your DH does this well if he's winning the majority of his jobs.

Zikreet, you're right, there is no easy solution, and while I came in this thread defending tradesmen I imagine my DH would laugh at my idealism and ask who on earth will pay for three quotes to know they're wasting two thirds of that money (my response would be people who end up paying less over all cause they're not subsidising your unpaid time)
I probably have more of an axe to grind with regards to my own profession and it's even more useless business model which means that my professional time and expertise is routinely regarded as a loss leader. Bitter? Moi?

Sounds like a lucky escape to me - if he puts extra charges without warning to people he hasn't got jobs from I'd wonder what other little extra would creep in on top of the quote.

I know how you feel Mari!

zikreet
That's how life works though Mari. I'm a lawyer and also can spend hours/days on proposals we don't win.

No comparison once you factor in a lawyer's hourly rate vs a joiner's hourly rate, or the different employment set-ups.

Unless he told you there was going to be a charge for a quote there's no way I'd pay up, likewise I'd not be using them as if they're not up front about that what other goal posts would change.

mari would love to know what profession you are in-think you might be in mine-headline consult/routine prices vs back of house/drug costs?!

The builder is being unreasonable,
I'm a travel agent, id love to charge everyone that sits with me designing the perfect holiday for 2 hours (on a Saturday afternoon) then books online.
Doesn't work that way does it?!
It's business, travel agent, builder, joiner it's an associated cost.
Send him a letter explaining this!

I'm an editor. I email back and forth with potential clients, then do a sample edit free of charge with my quotation. If I don't get the job, I certainly don't pass on the cost to ther clients! I suck it up.

All businesses have to have admin time, quote time, invoicing time - not all hours are chargeable hours.

This is an interesting discussion as I'm in the process of obtaining 3 quotes for some building work we want. I've seen the building regs plans and it's a big job for a builder to spec and quote for. I feel bad that of the 3 I've requested, 2 of them will have wasted their time. I'm not sure what the alternative is though.

chicaguapa When I had a big extension done to my house I got one very detailed quote from a builder who I knew I liked and wanted to work with on the understanding that I'd send his quote to a quantity surveyor to check over. The builder was happy to put a lot of time into the quote/schedule of work as he knew he was practically guaranteed the work. It meant the quote was accurate.

I paid about four hundred pounds for the quantity surveyor but it was well worth it. He pointed out a couple of issues with the builders quote that we could sort out before he started the work. Having the QS look at the quote gave me peace of mind that the quote was fair and accurate.

I thought it worked out better doing it this way rather than getting three less detailed quotes.

Just out of interest OP, if they were the most professional, and recommended by friends, why didn't you go with them?

Bigger companies have teams of people who work for weeks just preparing a bid for piece of work. Its detailed and lays out strategies and materials etc, and easily used by someone else (the internal team) who get the job.

I lead the department that does the very technical aspect of this for an IT company. I fly around the world meeting clients before they've paid us a penny. Speculate to accumulate!

Unless you were told you'll be charged, ignore the invoice OP.

Tell them to naff off, decent builders never charge for quotes.

It's economies of scale. Bigger companies that have entire departments working on quotes or tenders can often afford to absorb the upfront costs but they will factor speculative bids into their overall budgest/pricing strategy.

Smaller companies regularly have a clause that states if you don't go ahead then you are billed for the quoting stage. If you do go ahead, the quoting stage is factored into the end cost.

Different businesses have different models but time taken to quote has to be factored into your costs or you're undervaluing your work.

Different businesses have different models but time taken to quote has to be factored into your costs or you're undervaluing your work.

But it is an odd thing where, depending on the profession, the public is prepared to pay some people for initial work, but expects others to provide their time free of charge. Since the costs have to absorbed somewhere, either the tradesperson will take the hit, or paying customers will pay more. A better/fairer system might involve prospective customers paying people for their time, whether it results in work or not. Unfortunately entrenched precedents and customer expectations might make this difficult. Not offering quotes and other initial work free might mean losing out on jobs.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine we decided not to go with them as the costs for their suggestion came in at almost double the other two.

Don't pay a penny. Filippin' chancers....

The architecture firms that design those massive museums and office buildings? The contractors who build them and subcontract specialist engineers, etc? All submit massive, time consuming pre qualification and proposal packages. For free. They employ entire departments who only work on writing and summiting proposals in hopes of getting a job. For free.

Upsi but it's not really for free because on the days when the departments are working on those proposals, the staff are still getting paid. The salaries come from somewhere and where they come from is increasing the costs at the other end. But for some reason, some people are happier absorbing increased costs at the end of a project rather than paying for time at the beginning.

fascicle I completely agree with you.

It's called overhead. You figure out your rates by including it, regardless if you're s single builder or a 1000-person construction company.

A sole trader, or a small business, particularly in certain sectors, will feel that overhead more keenly than large businesses, which are likely to have access to more lucrative contracts, and be better able to spread the costs. Plus, some work is more price sensitive than others - difficult for e.g. somebody working on their own in a trade, doing small jobs in a price competitive market, to absorb costs so well. They might end up working extra hours to make up for it.

There is a difference between an estimate and a,quote. For a big job an estimate might be free but I certainly would not expect a full worked up quote to be

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