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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU to be the only person concerned that the PTA treasurer seems to have gone missing....

583 replies

PTAmissing · 16/05/2016 07:06

With all the PTA money?

She's been treasurer for years, no children at the school anymore.

She usually attends roughly 1 of every 4 meetings. She hasn't been to one for 6 months. She won't answer the phone or the door, doesn't reply to emails or texts. Chair went to her house and she didn't answer the door although it looked like she was in. We have no access to the money or accounts and the school is lending us money to get back off her at some indeterminate time in the future.

We have the school fate soon and she has all the info on stalls etc not to mention the money we need to buy things! She owes one of the parents about £50 for things they bought from their company for the PTA xmas fate.

Nobody else seems concerned! I really got angry about it at the last meeting and said this is ridiculous, we have no idea how much is in the account, we can't get hold of her, we have no working float. Apparently she has family drama at the moment and thats why she's unavailable but she still wants to be treasurer. I raised the possibility that there could be something dodgy going on and got shut down by the chair who said its not possible as there are two signatories on the account (because she couldn't just forge a signature???)

AIBU to think they should be taking this a bit more seriously given there is over £7000 (at the last count) of money that has been donated by the parents fgs, not to just sit in an account that nobody can get into?!

OP posts:
mari652 · 16/05/2016 09:59

This sounds so bizarrely like a situation I was involved with. I had known her from a similar, but smaller, committee role before and knew she was very slow to get stuff done - could hardly believe it when I realised she was not only an accountant but also a senior lecturer on the subject !

She was nice, everyone was nice and didn't want to start getting heavy but it was getting towards a critical stage, like the OPs. As the newly appointed Secretary, I was the one saying that we really had to do something, so I turned up at her house and politely insisted we talk. Turned out she was having awful medical stuff going on in the family, had let this slip and was so far behind it had become a big psychological 'pit' for her. She was not coping in many other ways as well and this was, understandably, way down on her priority list in her state. She let me take everything away and my husband and I had an into the early hours session of trying to untangle things.

No fraud, but barely any records either. My husband was temporarily co-opted on to the committee as acting treasurer and produced a simple working set of accounts with a million queries and caveats but it did reflect what the situation should have been.

It is a job that hardly anyone wants and people with experience do get strong armed into taking it on. Our solution, after matters had been straightened out, was to have a retired gentleman who was looking for something to keep his mind active as a bookkeeper and a committee member as named Treasurer, with a legal oversight role.

Also, seems a bit mad for the OPs Treasurer to have all the event files in the first place, though - I would have thought those should be with the Secretary ( as we did) or the Chair.

nonicknameseemsavailable · 16/05/2016 10:12

our PTA has a max 2 year term for a treasurer - I thought that was standard to try and prevent issues.

Werksallhourz · 16/05/2016 10:12

Do you have anything in your constitution about absence, op?

I'm involved with a number of associations and groups, and almost all of them have provision in either the constitution or standing orders that if there is an absence of six months from a role, then a reelection for the role is triggered.

Clutterbugsmum · 16/05/2016 10:31

She can not audit the school accounts unless she works for an financial auditing company, even then she will have no say in where she goes to audit, even an accountant needs to be independently audited. And you have to change auditing company every so often to stop this type of issue.

Is this a Independent school or a LA school.

Original poster
PTAmissing · 16/05/2016 10:33

LA school.

I'm sure the head said she audits their accounts! Will double check

OP posts:
CaptainMarvelDanvers · 16/05/2016 10:35

Do you have a CVS in your area that you could ring and ask for advice? They exist to give support and advice to community and voluntary organisations.

Andbabymakesthree · 16/05/2016 10:40

What do the other PTA members say? I'd be saying no confidence in chair. I'd be raising with governors too.

LemonBreeland · 16/05/2016 10:52

I would imagine your constitution says that you need a treasurers report every meeting. Most have this to make sure people don't run off with money.

Sunnymeg · 16/05/2016 11:48

I'd definitely be telling the Head that you intend to go to the Governors, as if the governors are unaware of the situation it will force the head to investigate if he hasn't already . I ended up as PTA treasurer when the previous one left suddenly. Nothing untoward had happened, she was just a bit disorganised, although it certainly looked suspicious at the time. Our PTA has a rule that you can't be treasurer if your child is in their final year. It means that there is time to sort out any irregularities before the treasurer disappears. If your PTA insurance is through PTA-UK they have detailed information about how they expect the accounts to be run. I would be encouraging the chair to check that the accounts are up to the relevant standards (I expect other insurers have similar expectations) my bet is that the chair is unaware of her own responsibilities and only wants to play nice with the treasurer.

GhoulWithADragonTattoo · 16/05/2016 12:08

I would be concerned that there is either wrong-doing or negligence going along here. It may extend to others such as the head (second bank account signatory and allowing treasurer to audit school accounts also) and the chair (lack of willingness to act). I would be tempted to call the Police.

Original poster
PTAmissing · 16/05/2016 12:16

Other PTA members pretty non plused apart from one woman who also works in finance.

She is pushing for a deputy treasurer to take over for a while too.

I seem to be the only one concerned about theft Hmm

OP posts:
Original poster
PTAmissing · 16/05/2016 12:18

I mean honestly the situation is ridiculous, we have a whole list of things the school would like to purchase, we can't make any decisions because we're guessing how much is in the bank! Planning to fate whilst guessing how much we can spend. School is ordering BBQ meat for us and invoicing the PTA for it.

Nonsense situation.

OP posts:
GhoulWithADragonTattoo · 16/05/2016 12:22

Go to the Police. They will at least force them to take some action. Especially if head (and poss chair) are dodgy too. And I suspect they are.

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 16/05/2016 12:24

It's a long, long time since I was involved with schools and governors (and even longer since I worked in auditing/accountancy) but as far as I can recall schools sometimes have 'voluntary funds'. These are different from the budget, which mostly comes from the LEA (or did before academisation took hold). They're just small sums which can be used to subsidise the cost of school trips for children from poor families, for example. Different again from the PTA funds. It might be that she's been auditing the voluntary funds. She certainly wouldn't be auditing the main school budget, I would have thought.

Oldraver · 16/05/2016 12:28

I would ask the head what would happen if there isnt any/enough money in PTA funds for the the goods they are stumping up for. The meat must be a fairly substantial amount.

Original poster
PTAmissing · 16/05/2016 12:31

No head is very straight down the line. She wouldn't be involved in anything untoward at all

OP posts:
Original poster
PTAmissing · 16/05/2016 12:32

Meat will be paid for out of summer fair profit presumably

OP posts:
GhoulWithADragonTattoo · 16/05/2016 12:37

Successful fraudsters are the ones who seem completely trustworthy.

cozietoesie · 16/05/2016 12:38

If the 'drama' is such that it's made her take her eye off things so comprehensively then she shouldn't be in charge of things. It's not fair on the other members of the association.

BitOutOfPractice · 16/05/2016 12:40

I'd be worried too OP

It's probably a situation like mari652's where she's let it slip and now it's all too big to tackle and she's embarrassed to say. I hope that's it anyway

steppemum · 16/05/2016 12:48

go to head, and say you are so concerned you will report either to charities commission or to police unless something is done.

Action required - that all monies and accounts are handed over to someone else for the foreseeable future. If she is genuine, and no problem, she can have the job back when the crisis has passed.

If head is unresponsive, I would resign, and write a letter to governors, and then pass to police.

ChangedToday · 16/05/2016 13:00

Surely the Head as co-signatory should have access to the accounts. Even if they don't get the statements they should be able to go to the bank, request statements, (possibly?)withdraw and definitely pay in funds. I was treasurer of a voluntary body for several years, and the other signatories could all do exactly that. There are some actions such as signing cheques that required two signatures, but basic bank transactions were possible by any of us. And in future: get more than two signatories on the books. We has a community accounts and such changes did not cost anything. Of course you will need the missing signatory to approve the addition of signatories I think....

carrie74 · 16/05/2016 13:05

I'm a PTA Treasurer, have been for quite a while, and am an Accountant. Because our income is below the minimum, we don't need our accounts verified by an independent examiner for Charities Commission purposes, so I wouldn't necessarily be worried about non-auditing (although I do file our accounts every year with Charities Commission).

I would be worried about non-contactability though, and would find it unusual that a non-parent would have the role (apart from anything else, it must be a nightmare getting things co-signed - I'm forever hunting people down in the playground to counter-sign cheques at drop off! And providing floats as well...).

Again, not showing the bank statements - I'd be perfectly happy to do this, but have never been asked, so don't bother. They come to me, I reconcile them and file them.

I think someone else needs to take on this role, and be a parent of the school. I really hope all is ok, and nothing untoward has happened, but yes, I would be a little concerned.

LagunaBubbles · 16/05/2016 13:16

Surely the Head as co-signatory should have access to the accounts. Even if they don't get the statements they should be able to go to the bank, request statements,

This. Can the Head do this? Then at least you would all know how much money is there.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 16/05/2016 13:21

I've sent an email to the chair with my concerns

I think you're very wise to have put this in writing - but then I'm probably influenced by the time I saw this happen and the treasurer had taken the lot

It could well be completely innocent, but it's the inaction/lack of concern by others which would bug me most, especially when you really need access to the cash. Sorry, but I couldn't personally work with this kind of disregard for finances and would have to get myself off that particular committee Hmm