Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to want to know what parents can do about the teaching crisis?!

294 replies

BrightRedSharpie · 22/04/2016 17:40

I'm in Scotland, btw, but I know there is a similar problem in England.

My DD's school is really understaffed. The P1 teachers have both been off all week, which has caused absolute havoc. They have had different teachers for mornings and afternoons because there are also no supply teachers available. P7 had to be split up for a teacher to come and take the little ones.

2 classroom assistants are also off on maternity leave, which either isn't or can't be covered. That's left 3 classroom assistants for around 300 children.

I know the school are doing their best. I've written to my MP and MSP. Is there anything else a concerned parent can actually do?

OP posts:
lurked101 · 25/04/2016 17:17

That's faintly ridiculous tbf.

araiba · 25/04/2016 17:17

as has previously been said, stop being that twatty parent and support the teachers

also, dont vote tory

witsender · 25/04/2016 17:20

When I was teaching 1:1 was sacrosanct. Those TAs weren't there to support anyone other than their charge, and had I tried to pull them into general classroom support and duties they would have very politely told me that no, they were not able to do that. Had I pursued it, they would have referred me to the SENCO, who would have told me that they, not I, set the work for those TAs. They were not a classroom resource so not to be deployed by me.

witsender · 25/04/2016 17:21

Is that you Xenia?

capsium · 25/04/2016 17:47

Really? I could equally say that when parental responsibility is lacking, we are receiving cohort after cohort who lack basic skills that the majority possessed 25 years ago, and that having to cover areas that were previously taught by parents is putting pressure on the time available to teach other things.

Ah, there we have it, 'parent's fault'.

Yet children spend increasingly more time in education than ever before. Parents spend less time with their children - they spend more time in nurseries, pre-schools and schools. When children come home, homework is set, often from preschool age. Yes, I think parents do have less time to teach their childre what they would like to focus on, simply because more time is devoted to what educational establishments dictate.

TheSolitaryBoojum · 25/04/2016 17:51

That's one of the points mentioned though, the Governments (of all political colours) constantly deciding what children should learn rather than letting teachers make those decisions.
KS1 20 years ago weren't fretting about beginning sentences with an adverbial, but the majority could do shoelaces and cut out a hexagon, and a dozen other lost skills.

capsium · 25/04/2016 18:23

Capsi u had sympathy with you until you started in about professional practice being lacking

lurked if you re-read my post in question you will see that I talked about 'when' professional practice has been lacking. I didn't say that experiences, similar to mine, happen in every school, however I will say my experiences are not particularly unusual.

They are worth talking about because the mind-sets that create experiences such as mine, need changing - it doesn't take much either. People kid themselves that using children's specified individual resource on other children is beneficial all round, when it is not (unless agreed and declared) - it is detrimental to the child, in ways I spelt out and it breaks the system (funding is diverted away from those who need it most and trust is lost).

melonribena · 25/04/2016 18:24

Witsender, I agree with you. 1:1 is absolutely non negotiable in my school. It is given and no one would query it.

wibblywobbler · 25/04/2016 18:37

I would have a lot more time and respect for teachers if every one of my daughters' primary school teachers addressed her issues and supported her and if her secondary school teachers had phoned me and informed me that she was struggling instead of letting me find out by accident and then actually doing something to support her instead of leaving her be. Soon after that school ended up in special measures, no wonder.

I would certainly have more support for teachers if the teacher in charge of pastoral care hadn't brushed off her being punched in the stomach by a boy and being doubled over in tears as 'he must just fancy her' and her year 4 teacher describing him as merely being rather spirited. That teacher had lasted a very, very long time, right up to retirement.

There are plenty of rubbish teachers out there, some ineffective, others just on power trips.

10 years of issues has left me with a rather low opinion of teachers and schools.

wibblywobbler · 25/04/2016 18:39

Really? I could equally say that when parental responsibility is lacking, we are receiving cohort after cohort who lack basic skills that the majority possessed 25 years ago, and that having to cover areas that were previously taught by parents is putting pressure on the time available to teach other things.

25 years ago more women were SAHM and could help their children learn the basics before they started school and families were under much less pressure. If a child is not at the level they should be at these days when starting school, then you need to look at the adequacy of childminders and nurseries

TheSolitaryBoojum · 25/04/2016 18:58

So is the answer to the OP that parents can do nothing about the teaching crisis, and the only thing that teachers can do is either to survive whatever comes our way and meet whatever demands are made of us, or leave?
How will parents feel about a situation where their children are largely taught by job-shares and supplies, or by teachers who last a few years and move on?
Or doesn't it really matter? Does it not have a noticeable effect on your children?
Perhaps it doesn't.

TheSolitaryBoojum · 25/04/2016 19:02

I don't really know why I'm worried to be honest, my children are finished with compulsory education and I love being a supply teacher. So the more teachers that go off ill, the more work for me.
And if I don't like a school, I just don't go back.

CitySnicker · 25/04/2016 20:11

Do children with 1:1 dedicated support ever get the opportunity to work independently then?

capsium · 25/04/2016 20:22

City yes, usually. A Statement or ECHP is reviewed every year, which means the type of support given is reviewed and can be changed. Often it is part of the plan to develop independence in various ways (teach the skills required, give progressively more opportunities to work independently) and this can be witten into the Statement or ECHP.

My issue is when a change happens in provision ad hoc and is not included in the planning (on the Statement / ECHP), when this is not discussed, when the level of independent work a child achieves is not recorded in any detail or disclosed in the annual reviews.

CitySnicker · 25/04/2016 20:28

But depending on the nature of the need...wouldn't some ad-hoc independent tasks work better than planned ones? If the child was having a 'good day' for instance...for any number of reasons.

TheSolitaryBoojum · 25/04/2016 20:36

For some children there is a problem with learned helplessness, that they are so used to not being able to manage anything without help that they stop attempting to do things independently.
Not just children with SEND, you see it in all sorts of situations including teenagers that won't cook for themselves even if they are hungry, or KS1 who won't write unless it's scaffolded for them, or the ones who are so used to being spoonfed information that they can neither pick up a spoon or think for themselves at university.
Sometimes the 1:1 support doesn't realise it's happening, that they are actually facilitating a child's helplessness and dependency. When I needed a child to attempt something with less support, the 1:1 was usually asked to prepare materials and resources that her pupil needed, or to do the paperwork required to assess progress. So she wasn't working with the child, but wasn't being used inappropriately to support someone else.

capsium · 25/04/2016 20:38

CitySlicker the possibility of that scenario can still be written into the plans and what should be recorded is the frequency in which this independent working has been able to happen. Lots of 'good days' may indicate a change in the level of overall need. If the level of need has significantly lowered ,it might be more appropriate for the child not to be in receipt of Higher Needs funding and then resource used to support them is not individualised but taken from the school's nominal budget.

minifingerz · 25/04/2016 20:40

"wouldn't some ad-hoc independent tasks work better than planned ones? If the child was having a 'good day' for instance...for any number of reasons."

My ds doesn't have an EHCP but he does get some one to one support. He can and does work independently but he needs a vigilant adult to observe him doing so as his ability to cope with frustration is poor - if an adult isn't monitoring him he often goes off-piste, not always in a way which is going to be obvious to an adult who is sitting focusing on another child. And once he's off track it's harder to get him back on when there is a delay in it being noticed.

FarAwayHills · 25/04/2016 20:42

if all those mothers went back to full time work too then we would be generating a lot more tax too so it would be win win all round

Oh hadn't thought of this. Problem solved Grin

CitySnicker · 25/04/2016 20:45

So it's a bit of a catch 22 from the school's perspective? Truthfully state that child is working more independently and more often and lose funding. Manipulate results, keep funding, upset parents....I'm tired tho so hold hands up if I'm missing point.

capsium · 25/04/2016 20:48

CitySlicker manipulate funding, act illegally, upset parents, brake funding system, lose trust, undergo more stringent accountability checks and paperwork, lose portion of nominal funds put aside for SEN as it is diverted elsewhere...

capsium · 25/04/2016 20:55

^ that should read 'Manipulate results' and 'break'. Typo.

TheSolitaryBoojum · 25/04/2016 20:55

Or give child and 1:1 a corner of the class. Forget about them and concentrate on the rest.

lurked101 · 25/04/2016 20:58

I think your spot on. I also think that although capsi has every right to be upset with they way her situation was handled, the rules that any change has to be discussed and planned well in advance (even small ones ad hoc for the benefit of the child) will be one of the reasons people are leaving. The weight of planning and discussion for that eventuality must be huge, and because the responsibility lies with the teacher for planning, monitoring and recording could well mean that it holds the child back because there isn't enough time to dedicate to that one child.

Oh once way to keep teachers, remember that we have families too and that we are not "on call" weekends and evenings. Before email parents would maybe call if something was urgently wrong, I've had rather nasty ones in recent years for not replying on a Sunday so their 15 year old knows what to do with their course work.

capsium · 25/04/2016 21:08

The planning need not be onerous. ECHPs and Statements often include detailing the provision for giving opportunities to encourage growing independence and monitoring of progress. This is not all left to the teacher either, educational psychologists, speech and language therapists, occupational therapists, physical therapists, paediatricians and parents are just a few of the people that contribute.

Swipe left for the next trending thread