To want to cry

[Fineflowersinthevalley]

I'm a single mum with a 5 year old and a 2 year old and they won't sleep, the 5 year old eggs on the younger and it can be 10 at night before they give in. I've reached breaking point and I have no idea what to do. It doesn't matter what I say or do. Tonight I've taken things away, cancelled a trip out and shouted. A lot! Made no difference. I'm frightened of my feelings tonight, I feel like hitting them to keep them quiet they've just started again with the I want game and I'm feeling so stressed I feel sick and panicky. I adore my children but I don't think I want to be a mum anymore :(

Hang in there. This is the hardest part of it in my experience. Sleep deprivation and the hard work it takes to actually put them to bed.
I am going to get flamed for this probably but I have found that cosleeping worked miracles for me. Why don't you all sleep in one bedroom together? DCs started sleeping so well once I started this. It was like a complete opposite of the situation I faced after first baby. I can't explain most of it but it worked so well. I suspect the reason was mainly that hey copy each other and like you said they egg each other on. So I went through bed time routine with both, put them into their respective beds and simply switched off the lights. It had some kind of settling effect on them. Probably that they are no longer curious about what is happening in the next room ? I don't know. My youngest slept through the night from about 3 months (except a couple or so feedings which weren't that hard as I was just besides him and nearly always kept snoozing myself during the feeds).
Try and change the routine slowly if you can? Also, It's very easy to say this for me and I am sure you are working extremely hard to not loose control but if you loose temper near bed time, it tends to take toll on their sleep routine IYSWIM? Makes them agitated and is counter productive . You are already working harder than so many.

I treat it as a military exercise and there's only going to be one winner. Take no prisoners, scare them a little if you must (my friend has 'the stare') and bribe the hec out of them. If you can get the 5yo onside and divide to conquer, that's no bad thing. Get the older one to help put the younger to bed then reward them with some snuggle time and 'grown up TV'. No sugar after 6pm and star charts are a pre requisite. Basically, throw everything at it.

Single parenting is the survival of the fittest and not for the feint hearted. Can you join up online with some other single mums to network?

I would put youngest to bed first and then make a big deal about the older being a "good big brother" and not waking the younger as you get him ready for bed.

Do you calm things down at home OP in the build upto bed time?

I get where your coming from I was a single Mum to 4DC including a new born baby and breastfeeding it can be really hard.

What's worked with all of our 5DC is calming everything down for about an hour before bed time,so no sweet treats or sugary drinks something calm on the tv then I'd do bath time,bath,wash hair,brush teeth get them dried and dressed,all of mine have supper and then I'd take them upto bed.Then I'd tuck them into bed and read a bedtime story or 2.

Mine go up at different times now because they're all older but being as yours are both so young and close in age it may actally be easier to put them to bed at the same time.Calming everything down upto an hour before bed time so that they get used to a bedtime routine and know what to expect,taking them to bed together tucking them in and then reading them both a story or 2.Mine used to fall asleep whilst I was still reading the story or just as I finished it.

Like another poster suggested black out blinds/curtains are a God send,a night light if they need a light on rather than a overhead bright light can really help them to settle alot quicker as well.
I've also found making sure there aren't things like a Tv/Ipad ect in close proximity in a child's bedroom to young children when your trying to get them to settle to sleep helps alot.

If you stay in the room until they fall alseep try to be as boring as you can,no talking to them,making a fuss of them,making eye contact it really does work the boredom seems to make them fall alseep alot quicker and they're more likely to sleep through the night as well.

Don't forget it could be four steps forward and then two steps back but don't feel defeated you can do this and a good nights stress free sleep will be so much better for you and your DC.

for you OP, I know what it's like and I'm not a single parent myself (just do all bedtimes/night waking as DH can't)

I agree with pp and say bribe bribe bribe bribe.

If it helps to tell yourself it's not 'bribery' it's a 'token economy' then go with it!!!

Reward charts do honestly seem to be the way forward, I would make the first couple of rewards something that can be 'earned' quickly - so eg three stickers (one per night) will lead to X treat this coming weekend... hit it hard early on and I suspect you will then be able to drop it in a few weeks.

I do feel your pain, one night a few months ago I yelled at DD (then 2) in the middle of the night after she'd kept me awake for 2 hours randomly from 2 until 4am for the third or fourth night in a row. Screamed at her and then I sobbed (and apologsed to her for the whole next day; I felt awful). It was my lowest parenting point. But in a way, things got better from then on, as in a way I think she had a little 2 year old epiphany that Mummy has her limit and I also realised I couldn't go Back There again (I scared myself).

She got a bit better, I got a lot more able to remain calm, because I was so horrified by what I had unleashed!!!

But yes, reward chart and separate them as much as poss, and go easy on yourself, it's hard and you're obviously a good and very caring mum

I'm not a single parent but my DP is never home before 8pm, so I do bed time for my 1 yo and 4 yo by myself, so can partly sympathise. My two share a bedroom also, so if one of them plays up, it can become a nightmare! The only way I can get it to work is to get them both ready for bed together (bath, pyjamas etc) then
I start putting 1yo down first (6:45 ish) - teeth, story, cuddle, bed and settle her, while 4 yo sits with a cup of milk and watches tv. I know the arguments around tv before bedtime but it works for us! Once DC2 is settled, DC1 and I go and do her teeth, then sit in my bed together for story and cuddles before she goes into her own bed. I've usually got both of them down by 7:30 / 8:00. Not as early as I would like all the time but at least they're both in bed and I can get on with my evening! It works 9 times out of 10, I'd say. I think DC1 likes to feel she's being treated as a 'big girl' by being 'allowed' to stay up a bit later and having about half an hour of 'mummy time' each evening. HTH?

Some great approaches on here but I think fundamentally it's down to what queenofthepirates says. I have zero tolerance for last minute demands for water, wees, attention for an itchy knee, whatever.

You need lovely calm wind down with lots of repeated routine and cuddles and clear boundaries. And then an absolutely gimlet eye. Once the sleeptime hour has struck, they must know that you are so utterly in charge that there is no way they are setting foot out of bed. The routine has finished and you leave the room (or stop engaging but stay in the room or whatever you decide to do) and from there on in you will not give in to sobbing, wailing, begging, whatever. It's all just a ploy. You know they are safe and cared for - they now need to do their bit and settle down.

Thanks everyone last night. Using suggestions from here I gave my 5 year old 5 tokens (coins) at 6 pm and explained bad behaviour (which I listed to him) would cost him tokens. Whatever he had left tomorrow would be swapped for stars to save for outings. He was over the moon! He's now asleep with 5 coins, every time he looked like slipping g I've only had to say do you want to pay me a time. For that and he's stopped instantly, hoping this continues :)

Oh well done OP! Best feeling in the world is when they go quiet and you can finally relax That's a really good idea I'll use that when DD gets older if she ever stops sleeping! Enjoy the peace (hope it lasts for you)

Fantastic news, long may it continue 👍🏻

Im a single parent to only one child that doesn't sleep. Hang in there sleep deprivation is a form of torture

Wow, so glad token system helped tonight. It's a great sign that bribery (sorry, I ean incentives :) is something your oldest will respond to. Total consistency is the thing and focusing on the positives and praising/rewarding any teeny achievement in the settling down/going to bed department.

Be prepared for honeymoon period (ie tokens are new and fab and exciting right now, but in a few days/week or so, they may just be old hat. But don't do what I did, which is if there's any deterioration in bedtime behaviour, I assumed it wasn't working and changed tack instead of sticking with it. Make rewards easily attainable so they stay motivated.

It is total bloody agony to have sleep refusers. Unless you've been through it, it's impossible to understand what it does to a person. It WILL get better though. Keep rewarding and rewarding more and praising any improvement.

I used to do a 'fake' bedtime for the oldest child when I was a nanny. The only way I could get the 3 year old to bed was if he was convinced his 6 year old sister was also going to bed when he did. She used to enter into the spirit of the thing and understood why we were doing it. Once he was settled (pretty quickly if he thought he wasn't missing out on anything his big sister was up to), she came downstairs again and got on with her stuff a bit longer. Honestly, anything that works, within reason - just do it!