To take breeder to small claims court?

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We bought a pedigree dog 5 months ago.

(Before this turns into a bun fight - we have always had rescue dogs, our old boy is a rescue)

The breeder, who is reputable and has bred dogs for a long time promised to provide pedigree papers.

He has come up with excuse after excuse, now us and the other owners are at the end of our tether.

Trading standards have said he is in breach of contract and we have a case but realistically what are our chances of having this resolved by either a partial refund or getting the papers?

KC registration means very little, anyone can put two poor examples of the same breed together and register the puppies so long both the parents were registered, it does not guarantee the dogs used were good representatives of their breed or that the puppy will be, nor does it guarantee that parents were in good health and not carry any genetic defects. It does however mean you can be sure that the bitch was not too old or too young to be bred, and be fairly certain that the bitch is not over bred or has not mated with a close relative, which is if nothing else a very minimal starting point in trying to reduce poor breeding practices and discourage puppy farming.

The big thing these days is not only to look for KC reg but also to ask to see current health certifications (look up what the breed requires), so many people just seem to think that KC reg means they will get a good dog from a reputable breeder and it does not. There is so much information available these days that I find it shocking that so many people are still willing to spend hundreds if not thousands of pounds on something without doing their research and doing their best to ensure they are not just taking on one giant vet bill or a dog that is going to spend half of its life suffering. It is still not a 100% guarantee but its a bloody good start and gives you a much better chance of gaining a healthy pet that will have a long and happy life.

It is also amazes me the amount of people that still believe that because it is a cross it is naturally going to be healthier, THIS IS A MYTH! Many of todays dogs especially many of the ones that seem to be popular carry many of the same genetic issues therefore the chances of doubling up on a faulty gene and producing offspring with genetic illness' is just as high. If you buy a cross you should still expect the parents to be tested for hereditary genetic defects. I am also baffled by the amount of money people are willing to spend on crossbreeds that only a few years ago people struggled to give away just because they have been given stupid names and false descriptions because they are too lazy to do proper research. If you take a Pom and cross it with a Husky to create a 'Pomski' you are not guaranteed to to get a tiny dog with with bold Husky markings, the chances are you may well get a big dog with pom colouring and anything in-between. You are however almost certainly going to get a horrendously vocal dog that has ridiculous exercise requirements but tell everyone how small they will be and how that will mean they need less exercise than the husky (!!!!!), show them a cute puppy and stick a silly label on it and all common sense seems to go out the window and you can charge £1,500 - £2,000 (how much they go for near me). I didn't pay that for a pedigree from a highly decent and reputable breeder.

Anyway apologies I'm going off topic but as you can guess this is something I am highly passionate about and it really boils my blood.

So back to the point.

Looking for a KC 'Assured breeder' is probably one of the best routes you could take these days. A few years ago an Assured Breeder didn't stand for much but this has come on in leaps and bounds in recent years. To be an assured breeder these days your property is inspected every year and photographs taken of where you raise your pups, breeders have to provide you with the documents to claim your papers, they have to give out extensive puppy packs detailing the breed standard, breed characteristics and a list of common breed ailments and required health tests, if the breed requires specific health tests the tests must be kept up to date and the breeder is required to permit you to see current health certifications which you can also check on the KC site using the registration names. They are not permitted to allow puppies to leave any earlier than 8 weeks of age. If you purchase a pup they have to provide you with a KC document to fill out and send back whereby you have to tick the boxes of whether you were informed of all the things they are required to tell you with an additional comments box for you to compliment or otherwise raise any concerns about the breeder or their practices etc so that breeders can be monitored and ensure minimum standards are maintained, any breeders not meeting the requirements will be struck off the list and that is just scratching the surface. I'm not sure if this is also an assured breeder requirement or just something my breeder did but my recent puppy purchase included a testicle guarantee so that should my puppy's testicles not descend they would cover the cost of the neutering. Retained testicles often have a genetic link and I think this highlights the confidence they have in the fact they believe they are not using dogs with known flaws in that area. I was also made to sign a contract to say that if I was ever unable to keep my dog for whatever reason that the dog would be returned to the breeder as she always wants to know where her dogs are and who they are with to ensure they don't end up in the wrong hands. She also refuses to breed for the overly squashed face that has become more popular in recent years and causes breathing difficulties despite it deviating from the breed standard. If more breeders were like her the world of dogs would be a much better place.

@WhoTheFuckIsSimon I know this post was posted a long while ago but if you get this message/still use this account please can you contact me regarding this. warm regards.

@WhoTheFuckIsSimon can you post a link to the Plushcourt case? I can't find any details online! Thanks

@WhoTheFuckIsSimon
I'd be interested in the link to this case as well please

Sorry, only just seen these messages. I can’t find a direct link to the website inread previously. It was on the OurDogs magazine website. I can sort of find it but you now need to be a subscriber to read it and I’m not.

See photo, about 4th from bottom.

Basically the Plushcourt Podengo breeder sold a podengo bitch fully KC registered to a couple and had said when the bitch was old enough they’d be able to breed from her. When they came to do this they found she hadn’t been registered on the right part of the register (I’m not a breeder so not much of an idea about right terms). They went back to the breeder who said she’d never said that the bitch would be registered for breeding. And produced documents saying the buyers had signed agreeing to this.

But the signatures were forged. Couple employed a handwriting expert to say it was blatant forgery and they won in court when they sued her. Kennel club then had a hearing and gave her a bollocking/final warning.

But she was still being less than honest when she sold me a dog. I’m convinced my dog had been previously sold (was 6months old) and returned for being nasty. As I got in the car she said “be careful with him round your husband, he isn’t used to men”.

Within 3 mins of being home he attacked my husband. He attacked my husband every day for the next 2 years. He bit me, my mum, my sister, my neighbour, he bit dh 100plus times. Breeder ignored me. Didn’t return emails or phone calls. I spent £1000 plus on dog behaviourists. Ended up being pts when he ripped my husbands eyebrow off.

She sold me a dangerous dog, knowing I had a primary school age kid....who thankfully was the only person the dog never bit! Looking back I should have driven 5 hours back with the dog and taken him straight back!

We had a dog who was the daughter of a massive court case- old bailey I believe

Breeder sold her dad impressive pedigree- but papers never arrived- apparently over bred and couldn't get the registration.They bought the male to breed with their 3 females.

Turns out the breeder had multiple unregistered litters. It went to coourt- not them but other buyers The court case offered them (and many others) full refund for return of the dog. they felt they couldn't return and kept him (he was 2 by then- they got some less compensation)

He bred with 1 of their 3 females as we bought the un KC reglstered offspring.

@WhoTheFuckIsSimon
Thank you that's very helpful information.
@Largeyellowdaffodil was that the same breeder as above?

Just be aware that if the breeder has no money, or none you can get hold of easily, any judgment you get is pretty pointless. A judgment does not mean you will get your money back or recoup your own costs.

Are you intending to breed her?

Shocking you would pay money and leave with a puppy and no papers!

This is the fault of the buyer for going blindly into paying money for a live animal and not doing their research.

You get papers WITH the puppy, or you leave.

Why would you not know this when you've decided you get a dog. Ffs.