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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

So pissed off at tories putting military youth groups into deprived area schools

351 replies

trashcanjunkie · 10/03/2016 22:36

We live in Newcastle. Yes it's a deprived area. I feel aghast at the fact the only half decent comprehensive school in our area has a cadet group based at school, with fucking army wankers there recruiting kids. The whole army campaign to get them young and 'make them better people' boils my fucking piss. They're cannon fodder who will likely get shipped out to oil wars, and left up shit creek without a paddle, wanting for basic kit etc. Then they either get blown to pieces, die, or come home horrifically injured or psychologically shattered. Now the government are rolling out another military type program and are putting money into sending them into schools in deprived areas.

Fwiw I've nothing against youngsters learning discipline or survival skills etc. I just have an issue with recruiting cannon fodder from 'us plebs'....

OP posts:
Nottodaythankyouorever · 10/03/2016 22:52

mintchoc you are aware officers operate on the front line too aren't you?

Just about to say the same thing.

Marmitelover55 · 10/03/2016 22:52

I loved Sea Cadets back in the 80s - certainly didn't join the navy though.

blueemerald · 10/03/2016 22:52

crumblybiscuits I'm afraid I find that opinion a tad naive.

Original poster
trashcanjunkie · 10/03/2016 22:52

I am aware, crumbly, but I'm also horribly aware of the instances I've mentioned. I personally know people who've lost both legs, other medical discharges and seen the psychological effects on others. I do take the point that people have amazing opportunities, but I have three boys, and I'd really hate for any of them to join. The report I heard this morning was on radio four - it was a school boy report on cadets or similar (the ones mentioned up thread who'd previously only been in public schools) coming to his school. The box pops of the pupils thoughts made my blood run cold... "It's going to be great, you get to play with real weapons"

I just feel that at 16 or even 18 it's too young to know the real consequence of taking another life. And it's the way the army have targeted young people who have low expectations of their life choices.

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crumblybiscuits · 10/03/2016 22:53

As it is the army is always going to hold an appeal in under privileged areas as it's good pay and a secure job that doesn't require any qualifications. They will also fund things like degrees which lots of people wouldn't be able to achieve otherwise.

CaughtUpNearTimbuktu · 10/03/2016 22:55

Well yes trashcan that's what could happen if you sign up. However cadets don't get sent to the front line. Cadets get all of the fun, the discipline and opportunity without any of the risk

Original poster
trashcanjunkie · 10/03/2016 22:55

There was an excellent documentary on a similar situation in America, and the poor mother who'd lost her son I think.... Sorry too late at night... Brain broken..... Can anyone remember it? I think maybe Michael Moorcock did it?

OP posts:
TrojanWhore · 10/03/2016 22:55

You do realise this is a Brown policy from 2008, that has not been rescinded, rather than an initiative by either the coalition or the current government?

Original poster
trashcanjunkie · 10/03/2016 22:56

I know caughtup.... But then how many join up as a result? (I don't know figures, again my experience is anecdotal)

OP posts:
CaughtUpNearTimbuktu · 10/03/2016 22:56

The army, and indeed the navy, have always historically picked their infantry and seamen from poorer areas. Its because if the combination of "you can see the world" "we can train you up to do x y and z" and "we can give you the structure you may be lacking in your life"

Original poster
trashcanjunkie · 10/03/2016 22:57

No, was it Brown? Ugh, it still boils my piss.

OP posts:
crumblybiscuits · 10/03/2016 22:58

blueemerald Why? DP is in the army in a specialised role which is not front line but he has done a tour so I am probably biased and a bit blinded to the other side on this topic. His recruitment was the making of him. He has a skill that will keep him comfortable for the rest of his life.

Kummerspeck · 10/03/2016 22:58

I don't think CCF necessarily leads into military careers but it is a great thing on a CV. Both of mine were in a school cadet force, both went on to non-military careers but it may have helped them in encouraging skills, teamwork, planning, etc that they would not have got otherwise. I'd have thought it should be welcome in areas where young people have fewer opportunities

CaughtUpNearTimbuktu · 10/03/2016 22:59

Surprisingly few do. Some see it as a UCAS booster, others (like me) wanted to but our health conditions forbade it, the majority just did it as something fun to do, and it us brilliant fun.

Original poster
trashcanjunkie · 10/03/2016 23:00

yes I know caughtup.... And I totally see the plus sides... But the downsides are horrific. And then there's the issue with homophobia... Or there has been. Very archaic attitudes. Why have that in schools?

OP posts:
CaughtUpNearTimbuktu · 10/03/2016 23:02

trash can I suggest, with the greatest of respect, you get your head out your arse, stop reading crap newspapers and don't prevent your children from participating if they want to.

Alohamora · 10/03/2016 23:05

The Army (or any other cadet force) Cadet Force does not recruit to the services.

Any person who chooses to join any of the forces does so of their own free will knowing the risks involved and the vast majority will never have been near a cadet detachment.

My eldest was a cadet and is now an instructor and is not in the Army and has absolutely no wish to join up. Cadets is his hobby and he enjoys it. All the instructors are volunteers, some may have military experience but many do not.

Jeeves93 · 10/03/2016 23:05

Very few cadets actually join the armed forces - I don't know the actual figures, but it isn't a lot. Based on experience, the average cadet unit might have 1 cadet per year join the forces. For the vast majority, it is not a route to the forces, it is something fun and different to do in the evenings. Yes there is military based training, but there is also first aid, map work, expeditions, community work etc.

MrsWigster1991 · 10/03/2016 23:05

I'm from Newcastle and I think YABVU. As an ex sea cadet and civilian instructor I can tell you that cadets offered me many opportunities I wouldn't have otherwise had. I went all over the country, learnt new skills and became the person I am today. I spent 8 years of my life building up my self confidence and skill set.
I actually miss my cadet days. While my school mates went out and caused trouble I was learning how to drive boats, fix engines and first aid etc. It also taught me discipline something loads of kids need

Genvonklinkerhoffen · 10/03/2016 23:06

Is it compulsory? I clearly know the answer to that

Damn the government, giving children opportunities. What a bunch of fuckers letting these poor children do things with the rich kids.

I don't think crumbly is naive at all. No one is forced to join the infantry. If they don't get the scores to join a specialist corps, they don't have to join.
Some soldiers who join have never even been to a dentist or an optician, it's no surprise the army turns their life around by simply giving them a pair of glasses. Op, your opinions are outdated and probably fairly offensive to service personnel. Just in case you haven't read the national security strategy, the majority of risks don't involve going abroad and getting blown up. Perhaps you should have a look?

Original poster
trashcanjunkie · 10/03/2016 23:06

Grin it was radio four you bugger. And I hope to high heaven the dcs don't want to. they already are doing bloody contact rugby when they're with xp so they're turning their brains to scrambled egg

OP posts:
blueemerald · 10/03/2016 23:07

crumblybiscuit I think I misinterpreted your statement to mean 'you get to choose what do you in life' (as in telling a 15 year old who's only doing 5 GCSEs and has a reading age of 9 to apply for a sixth form that requires 7 GCSEs minimum. Example from my work today) rather than choosing a role within the armed forces. Apologies.

I agree that the cadets/CCF can be a great thing for young people but I am very opposed to recruiters in schools, especially when they so blatantly target certain schools.

StrumpersPlunkett · 10/03/2016 23:08

Trash an all I can say is a v good friend of mine was having a total nightmare with her 14 year old daughter sneaking out to do drugs and have sex with strangers she met on the tinternet. Social services involved all kinds of hell going on.
Daughter is signed up to cadets and given new regime at home and it has been the making of her. She has turned her life round, she will get good grades for her exams and is now interested in staying on in education through a levels and is hoping to go to university to study nursing.

Honestly couldn't say a bad word about the scheme. Sorry.

crumblybiscuits · 10/03/2016 23:10

Oh I see blue, sorry I should have specified I meant you do get a say in where you're posted and they don't look at you and think 'you're poor so you can be infantry.'
Gen put it better than I did in my original post.

Original poster
trashcanjunkie · 10/03/2016 23:11

If it's offensive to service personnel, I'm pretty sure they can handle it. That's not what I'm after doing, I'm pissed off that it's the only way some groups of young people get to have all those experiences treasured by some of the previous posters. Why can't there be a group that offers them, without the military tinge to it? I'm all for kids learning to sail, etc.... Just not with drill sergeants etc.

OP posts: