To wonder about the obsession of joint finances?

[Organon8]

Inspired by another thread, what is the obsession with having joint finances with your partner/spouse?

So many people display such horror and shock when you tell them you have separate finances.

I have heard to plenty of stories where one partner has cleared the whole account and no action can be taken against them.

People are free to have separate finances, it does not indicate a less strong marriage or partnership.

I have separate account from my DH. He pays for all household expenses, bills and childcare from his own account. It works for us

[Cutecat78]

We have separate finances.

I get maintenance from (2) exes OH pays his ex. We have no DC together.

We split bills, although OH earns a lot more than me and lives away during the week.

He's in the Navy so when he is away I have complete access to all his money (Mwahahaha).

Some of the guys he goes away with have come back from 3/6 month patrol to fine their bank account emptied

[imwithspud]

We don't have a joint account but we do have joint finances. We can both access each other's online banking as and when we please and we (usually me as dp isn't good with techy things, or money managing) check our balances a lot and are constantly transferring money to and from our accounts to pay for various things. All the major bills come out of dp's account, sometimes he might not have enough in there so I will transfer some from mine to his. Food shopping is usually paid for on my card so sometimes if my account is a bit short I'll transfer some money from his to mine.

It would probably be easier for us to have a joint account to be honest and we have actually been meaning to get one but we haven't got around to it yet.

This works for us, I keep an eye on it mostly to ensure rent and bills are all paid as dp isn't good at that sort of thing and we are both still 'allowed' to buy things and treat ourselves provided there's money to spare.

[mrsmugoo]

We're married so what's mine is his and his is mine - all money is our money regardless of which account it's in.

I can't get my head around marriages where one partner is off buying designer clothes and has expensive hobbies but the other only has pennies to play with.

[JizzyStradlin]

Finally, iof you are married, your finances ARE shared by law so why on earth would you not want to share it anyway? Eg if your DH/DW suddenly gets a lot of debt, you are also responsible.

NO NO NO NO NO NO. I can't believe we got five pages in without anyone correcting this.

You are NOT responsible for the debt of a spouse simply by virtue of being married to them, not in the UK anyway. You can certainly be affected by any debt they have, but creditors won't be able to make you responsible or force you to pay it because you're not the person who owes it.

So if your spouse owes 30k on credit cards that they're not paying off, you can't be made to take on any of this debt, but you're probably not getting a joint mortgage with them. You're potentially affected, but you don't owe a thing. If they owe 30k on credit cards and you have equity in your jointly owned home, their share is potentially up for grabs. Yours isn't, but of course this potentially has an impact on you too. But if they owe that 30k on credit cards and you have no joint assets, you're not responsible for their debt at all and nothing of yours is up for grabs.

[JizzyStradlin]

To move on topic, I'm interested to hear what people consider separate finances. OPs don't sound as separate as she thinks.

Equally, DH and I have never had a joint account but I would have said our finances are linked. To me, separate finances is things like not knowing what the other person earns or what their investments, pensions etc are. Having a prescribed formula for who pays what and one 'owing' the other if this is deviated from. I don't think it necessarily requires entirely equal contributions, one partner's contribution might come in the form of eg childcare rather than money earned.

[madamginger]

DH and I have totally joint finances. He earns about 3 times as much as me, as I work pt and was at home with the children when they were little.
Neither of us are huge spenders and I don't need to justify to him what I spend our money on.
It's worked for us for 16 years

[Organon8]

OPs don't sound as separate as she thinks

How do you define separate finances?

[MrsSteptoe]

I'm always slightly cautious of being flamed, but I guess I can always hide the thread. Apolos in advance for the long preamble.
DH and I have both done the same jobs since we knew each other. Our earnings have remained exactly the same: I earn approximately four times what he earns (most years, he doesn't even pay tax), because I went into something that pays enough for me to pay my way. He, on the other hand, went into something that he thought was glamorous in the 1980s, and now is too scared and lacking in confidence to try something else so he keeps trying different ways to make the same thing work.
On the basis that I don't much like what I do, and it exhausts me, and he has chosen not to challenge his comfort zone and extend what he does in order to give him a reliable income, I have never felt bad about (a) maintaining separate bank accounts, and (b) asking him to pay up to half the bills.
When he can't meet his "half" of the bills in any given month - and there have been many of them - I always pay it. When there is an unexpected bill - the new boiler, for example - I always pay it without question. When he needs cash for his business to buy stock, I keep a record and make him pay it back, otherwise I'm just paying for him to have the illusion of running a business. If DH wants to go to the football or something, he has to pay for it. If he's skint, he can't go. I see it as the price he pays for not being more resourceful about earning money.
Neither of us lives an expensive lifestyle. If I want DS to do a course of some description, or go on a trip, I pay for it.
Re childcare, I have handled daytime childcare while DH looks after DS in the evenings when I work. I have him most of the time during the holidays. DH is an absolute rock about being the person to get up with him in the mornings and get him off to school.
Half interested to know what people think. Half thinking I should duck for cover.
Entirely thinking most people will think the post is too long and not read it.

[KayTee87]

We have a joint bills account and savings account purely because it's easier for us but we have our own accounts for personal spending. Wouldn't dream of making everything joint.
My grandparents have always had separate finances paying the bills equally between them - they've been happily married 68 years this year so it's certainly not an indication of a weaker marriage.

[mrsmugoo]

Kaytee - presumably you both have access to a comparably equal amount of money in your personal accounts though?

[JizzyStradlin]

See the rest of the post you quoted OP!

In your case, you mention having jointly contributed to repairs, furniture etc. If you were splitting the cost, that would be for something you both contributed to, which is joint. I'm also guessing you jointly own your home if you pay towards repairs? The more joint assets you have, the less separate your finances are. Additionally, the fact that your DH basically pays for all major expenses suggests you're being financially supported by him. Which to me means your finances aren't entirely separate. Or do you have one of those arrangements where he does the paying for both of you and you do the saving, so neither of you is supporting the other as such?

[MewlingQuim]

I think it doesn't matter whether finances are joint or separate as long as there is transparency and fairness.

DH and I have separate accounts for personal stuff (phones, clothes, hobbies) and a joint one for all house stuff (mortgage, utility bills, council tax, food etc).

A friend has entirely separate accounts and she pays mortgage and childcare while her DH pays 'everything else'.

Except he doesn't.

My friend ends up also paying for food, children's clothes, house repairs etc and is left skint while her DH spends what he likes or saves it all, she has no idea where it goes

Plus, in our household, mortgage and childcare are the most expensive costs we have, and 'every thing else' added together wouldn't even come close.

I couldn't live with my friend's situation.

[PitilessYank]

Mrs. Steptoe-your arrangement and the justification for it is very interesting and it makes sense.

Question-do you ever get the sense that your husband resents it, and also, do you think that you feel trapped in your career due to his situation?

[PitilessYank]

are very interesting, not is.

[KayTee87]

Mrsmugoo he earns around 10k more than me but has some higher personal bills than me, still probably works out that he has more spare but Im comfortable. If I couldnt afford something that I needed I suppose i would ask him to split the cost but it's not happened yet. We are lucky and it wouldn't work for some couples but definately don't think how a couple manages their finances is an indicator of their marriage, just of their circumstances.

[chilipepper20]

We have completely joint finances, but I know it's not the only way. It works for us, but may not work for you.

[NewLife4Me]

There's only one way to do it

What's his in mine and what's mine is mine, and we both manage it in one form or another. Both are pretty frugal types really.
Not argued about it since kids were little and then it was about how we were managing it not who had what.

[Wigeon]

To those with separate finances, do you feel it's fair that if one partner earns £50k and the other earns £25k, the one on £50k has far far more spending money than the other one?

If they want to go to a restaurant, do they have to go to Pizza Hut all the time, because that's all the £25k person can afford? Even though they could afford a nicer restaurant if they pooled their money, and the £50k person can go to more expensive restaurants if out with a richer friend.

What if the £25k person loves, say, kitesurfing (an expensive hobby) and the £50k person loves baking (a much cheaper hobby)? Is that just tough for the £25k person that they can't afford the hobby they love?

What happens if one partner stops working for a bit? Does the higher earner have to bail them out? Or do they just have to be very frugal while they aren't earning?

These are real questions I wonder about - I just can't get my head round separate finances for long-term, committed couples, although of course everyone has the right to organise their finances how they choose.

[Organon8]

Additionally, the fact that your DH basically pays for all major expenses suggests you're being financially supported by him. Which to me means your finances aren't entirely separate

He chooses to pay all major expenses, I have around 40K more than he does. So I am not financially supported by him!

[mrsmugoo]

Yeah but Kaytee it works for you because you've basically got roughly equal disposable cash. So joint or separate finances is basically the same thing as you're financially about equal.

I just don't see how a marriage/partnership can really work if there is massive financial disparity and one partner hoards their own personal money.

I just seems so utterly alien to me.

[MrsSteptoe]

PitilessYank Good question. No, he doesn't resent it. He realises that to some extent, his lack of earning capacity is the result of his choices. We do get in a bit of a pickle sometimes because I will over-consult on stuff in an attempt not to make him feel like because I'm paying for things, I just do it my way without asking him. Yes, I do feel a bit trapped, and occasionally resentful, because if I were alone or with a more solvent partner, I would work fewer hours and it would be less punishing on my health. But I also think I'm quite stuck in a rut with my choices, and I shy away from the challenge of finding something new to do, so he's not the only one to have to accept his choices.

[Avidreader12]

It's true what Jizzy said that your not liable for your partners debt or that creditors can force you to pay it but they can force your partner to become bankrupt and the trustee in bankruptcy to force a sale of a family house to pay off partners debt from his share of the house even if you and any children are living in. So yeah basically everyone would be affected.

[HermioneWeasley]

We have a joint account and each have our own as well.

We do this because DW has zero interest in managing our finances.

I try to engage her - I talked to her the other night about an investment I was considering, she looked up for Mumsnet long enough to ask "will we starve" and then went back to it when I confirmed not.

[JizzyStradlin]

He chooses to pay all major expenses, I have around 40K more than he does. So I am not financially supported by him!

Of course you are, that's what it means when someone is paying for you. Having more money than him simply means you don't financially depend on him, ie you could pay for yourself if you needed/wanted to. Different things.

You're not affected if you don't own a home avid!

[KayTee87]

Mrsmugoo I said it wouldn't work for everyone. I was just stating what we did and said I didn't think how couples arrange their finances was an indicator on how good it bad their marriage was. If one partner had no money and the other had loads it would be pretty disgusting for the partner with money not to share of course.