To cry over state pension age speculation rise to 75-81

[feellikeahugefailure]

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/georgeosborne/12179375/Work-till-youre-75-or-even-81-under-Government-review-of-state-pension-age.html

Where has it all gone wrong? My parents could buy a home one one income for 3 times annual wage. Dad retired at 55, mum never needed to work and has been claiming a state pension for over a decade since 60. I do a similar job to my dad.

Where I live the average house price is 13 times my wage. My pension I've been paying into for over 10 years will if I keep paying into it for almost 40 more years give me 2'000 a year if it does averagely and 1'000 if it does poorly, and it probably will do poorly. Then no state pension until I'm about to drop dead. Can't afford a house or to put money away for retirement.

question: if we 'stayed' in europe could raising the retirement age significantly above other EU nations be challenged in the European Court?

I just cannot make sense of the whole topic.The reality does seem scary.
It worries me, not for myself as I am already retired, but for the future generation.
When I am in a hospital ward in my late 80's (hopefully) I could have nurses who are 67/68 struggling to lift me and help me with mobility.
Our children and grandchildren may be taught by teachers who have been in the job for almost 50 years.
What are the implications for public safety if our lorry drivers and train drivers and pilots have to carry on working until they are in their late sixties?
Also, if the older workers are "job blocking" how can our younger workers get a job and ever gain promotion?
These are just a few random thoughts. I am sure you all have many other ideas. All in all, the entire topic presents us with more questions than answers.

Honestly I already see people in the few years before retirement, struggling to do their job.

Many of the jobs that people are worrying about, lorry drivers, nurses lifting patients etc will soon be automated

Things like firefighters there will still be some kind of fitness test and if you don't pass it you won't get in whether you are 20 or 80

The problem is not how will you do x y z job when you are 77, more that there will be fewer jobs
Would that lead to a well paid minority and a large unwaged underclass?

Perhaps govt feel that older people living in poverty and excluded from the benefits of a modern technologically advanced society would cause less social disruption than younger people who are shut out of the good life?

Nurses don't lift patients now. As a midwife I i wont even help someone with an epidural move up the bed. On the general nursing side I believe hoists are u used for lifting. On manual handling we are told were must never move a patient.

It's more the long shifts and being on your feet.

On the question of European law, currently there is no law on retirement ages other than that it should not be sexist (indeed I believe that was one reason the UK equalised male and female retirement ages back in the 90s was because it was sexist not to do so). There is nothing in EU law to set out state retirement age and each country decides what pensions it will pay and on what basis eg British people who retire to Spain have their pensions frozen by the UK Government - they don't get pension increases.

I believe today's news is that there may be no major changes to tax relief on pensions such as abolishing all tax relief on contributions, despite recent speculation, but we will have to wait until the budget to be sure.

The bottom line for women however remains that most of them save nothing like enough for old age and end up utterly screwed as they unwisely hope to rely on a husband's pension or ended up muggins at home not earning. Never be that muggins.

At my place of work we have a few nurses who are in their late 60's still working although not in the most physical roles.

And as a Nurse, I can say we most definately do lift patients even though hoists do help in a lot of cases there is still a lot of physical help that needs to be given. We often need to hold up a hugely oedematous leg so that a colleaugue can dress it. Even just rolling a very heavy patient ( for pessure area care or changing pads)who is terminally agitated and fighting against you can be physically exhausting and most likely not something a 70+ year old could do. In my job we also have to manoevre heavy mortuary trollies and push deceased patients on their beds to the mortuary so we do need to be reasonably strong and fit.

Yes but in 20 or 30 years time conditions in many jobs will likely have changed
Many pps don't seem to take that into account

Yes conditions do change. Jobs get more mechanised. But some manual labour is unavoidable. Jobs are also these days often very stressful requiring a high level of productivity. People do get tired more easily as they age.

suzanne have you ever seen the cartoon 'The Jetsons'? The way you envisage the future is remarkably similar.

Could always sign this...you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/state-pension-at-60-now

Apple I didn't realise the jetsons portrayed a dystopian scenario where a large unwaged underclass weren't able to access the benefits of technological progress

I only remember flying cars

i don't think we'll have robot nurses and teachers any time soon.

Someone laughed and said that AIBU would explode if everyone had to take in their parents and care for them like in the past.

But again this comes back to
Households need two incomes to afford the mortgage and are working full-time.
No one would be at home to care for the elderly parents.
Unless you have old person creches (on the same site as childcare) where you can drop your dependants off at 7am get to work, work 9-5, pick everyone up at 6pm. The elder care could be funded by selling a house?
This sounds horrific, but disturbingly plausible.

I started paying into a private pension as soon as I started working, 27 years ago. Ive always thought that the state pension wasnt enough to live on. Theres not a chance in hell that I'll be relying on the state to fund my retirement.

'Japan came up with a public, mandatory long-term care insurance system in 2000. The universal elder program is funded half by general tax revenues and half by a combination of payroll taxes and additional insurance premiums paid by everyone 40+.
The family remains the key source of caregiving, but the system supports the adult children with subsidized services whose fees and co-pays are relatively moderate. Among the most popular services: adult day care, home help, respite care and visiting nurses'

www.nextavenue.org/what-japan-can-teach-us-about-long-term-care/

Yes women of my generation are spending time caring for elderly relatives. I see it with a lot of my friends. But I don't think this will happen with the next generation.

I work in HR & Pensions. I remember when auto enrolment came in and I had streams of people coming to see me to complain they couldn't afford to pay the 1% ... as they put their iPhone or latest Samsung Galaxy on the desk.

I dread the next 25 years and hearing stories about people who prioritised material goods and a specific lifestyle over saving for the future and how badly off they are. People absolutely have to take responsibility for how they spend/ save their money while they're working.

Obviously there are exceptions and people who are genuinely struggling to make ends meet now. But if you are paying for a smartphone or Sky, you can afford to save more for when you want to stop working. If you want to live for now and have your iPhone/ Sky Movies, fine, but then don't complain about that choice when you want to give up work and can't.

Tbh, if you want to build your own pension, you need to save £100k, not £400.
Yes of course, it all adds up but it's nowhere near the same scale...

Chicaguapa - one of my colleagues (aged 52) moans that she hasnt ever been able to afford to pay anything into a pension and will have to work until she drops. She's smoked 40 B&H a day for the last 30+ years!

There already elderly crèches. It's called day care.

When my mum went it was £16 for four hours. Will be much more now. Unless you have no money then you are minded for free.

Pension is paid for by contributions, it is not charity. There just isn't enough in the kitty to pay it to people who have not paid in, but that doesn't stop us. Unsure why, Brussels I presume?

It is now very difficult to get into day care. There is not enough available.