My Ds has brought this poem home from school and been told to learn it. Please come and give me your thoughts on wether I should speak to the school.

[MTPurse]

As the title says, Ds has came home from school today with a Poem to learn, He has to learn it to be read out between a group of them(apparently he was chosen to read it as he is good at drama/being dramatic).

This is all I know, I have no other info on what it is about and why he has to learn it yet

Now I am not into poetry at all so maybe I just don't 'get it' but I really think this is completely unsuitable for Children due to the context. I am not a strict parent at all but Guns , Knives, Swords and Violence have no part in my family life and I will not allow my ds to play cod and stuff like that, in fact we have had numerous arguments about this.

Personally, I get the humour in it and think it would be fine on a staffroom wall but aibu to think it is not suitable for children?

Here is the poem:

The Lesson

Chaos ruled OK in the classroom
as bravely the teacher walked in
the nooligans ignored him
his voice was lost in the din

'The theme for today is violence
and homework will be set
I'm going to teach you a lesson
one that you'll never forget'

He picked on a boy who was shouting
and throttled him then and there
then garrotted the girl behind him
(the one with grotty hair)

Then sword in hand he hacked his way
between the chattering rows
'First come, first severed' he declared
'fingers, feet or toes'

He threw the sword at a latecomer
it struck with deadly aim
then pulling out a shotgun
he continued with his game

The first blast cleared the backrow
(where those who skive hang out)
they collapsed like rubber dinghies
when the plug's pulled out

'Please may I leave the room sir? '
a trembling vandal enquired
'Of course you may' said teacher
put the gun to his temple and fired

The Head popped a head round the doorway
to see why a din was being made
nodded understandingly
then tossed in a grenade

And when the ammo was well spent
with blood on every chair
Silence shuffled forward
with its hands up in the air

The teacher surveyed the carnage
the dying and the dead
He waggled a finger severely
'Now let that be a lesson' he said

Roger McGough :

I'm feeling quite nostalgic for poems having read the couple on here. I still love the poem, but I think it's place in education has probably shifted, it would suit better as a discussion piece for older students, kind of like war poetry was for our generation (80s born)

I taught that back in the 90s and the class wrote newspaper reports based on the events of the poem. We had discussions about teachers being driven to extremes by pupil behaviour and about how the classroom environment should be happy and safe for teachers and pupils. I did it with years 7 and 8. All the kids loved it and produced some very creditable work. Roger McGough is an accessible poet and I have never met a class yet who didn't find his poetry 'a breath of fresh air'.
I think year 5 is too young though and, when I was teaching, nearly 20 years ago the school Massacres in America hadn't happened.

I consider myself quite open minded about material used in education and literature for young people. But I hate this poem's intense imagery within a modern context and I would feel no more comfortable with my 10yo reading it than I would about allowing him to watch an 18 cert film or playing a violent video game. I'm no prude but there's enough of this going on in the world without adding to the darkness. I get that it's supposed to be black humour but I'm afraid it totally bypassed me as my head filled with Peshawar and Dunblane etc. as I read it.

Tbh I'm shocked that people are shocked. It's been taught for over 30 years. It's not news.

My favourite school poem is about stalking....

"Escape me? Never, beloved!"

As a teacher in the 80's and 90's I used "You Tell Me "with primary school pupils including this poem. The children loved it and it was great for discussion. I would not use it with primary children now. The world has changed.

What about Dunblane? I teach Year 5 a couple of times a week. I wouldn't use it. Personally I don't think it is appropriate especially in events in the last thirty years. I would be unhappy if it was my child and would discuss it.

I actually think it's highly unlikely that a parent having an issue with this poem would be allowing their child to play COD.

I have a dd in year four. I don't believe it will be appropriate when she moves into year five. Agree with a previous poster that it's not at all cartoonish it's graphic and unpleasant and I cannot begin to imagine why a 10 year old needs to be exploring these themes and having that imagery in their mind.

Schiopl was an 'unassailable haven of safety' in the 70's?

Really? Out of control bullying, children beaten, sexual abuse,
see Kes.

It's a terrible poem. Not just the subject matter. It's very badly written.

Likewise tiggy just because something is 'art' does not make it appropriate for 10 year olds. Would you allow your 10yo to watch Clockwork Orange - one of the great controversial film masterpieces of the last 50 years?

I mean there's a huge difference between junior school and GCSE/ A level.

It's a v badly written poem and no way would I be happy with my 10 yo studying it. The imagery is far too graphic.

It's called metaphor.

Well, you are a load of humourless mumsnetters.

Well, you are a load of humourless mumsnetters.

not really. It just isn't that funny.

and isn't poetry in my view. It could be considered in the category of humorous verse like Odgen Nash but Ogden Nash is much funnier and scans better.

if it was my son, i wouldn't be impressed, would have a conversation with him before he learned it, and would be more concerned that he is not learning about the power of real poetry.

Blu - when I say that schools were considered "havens of safety, I mean in the context of the poem, which is about a teacher killing his entire class.

There was certainly violence and bullying towards individual children at school at the time the poem was written - there was corporal punishment at home too. However, what was complely absent in those days was the deliberate targeting of schools for mass murder; the slaughter of entire classes of children, picked off by a gunman like fish in a barrel. It is this that has changed and has made the subject of the poem no longer a subject for comedy. Lines like "The first blast cleared the backrow" and allusions to "blood on every chair", while undoubtedly funny thirty years ago when it was unheard of, are now chilling echoes of reports of Dunblane and other school massacres.

That is why, in my opinion, the poem is no longer "suitable" for our present time, Tiggy - many poems, novels and plays do not stand the test of time. Standards change and things that were once considered subjects for entertainment or comic treatment cease to be so, in tune with changed sensibilities.

If this thread is anything to go by any kids reading it at school had better enjoy it and be intelligent enough to understand the satire or risk being ridiculed, accused of having no sense of humour and told they're clearly not clever enough to understand it.

Nope, not appropriate at all.

I think it's brilliant on many levels. I hope ds delivers it beautifully and everyone listens up. It's a lovely poem.

I am a poetry fan, not a teacher.

Irony anyone?

I think many of us on this thread are poetry fans, Monty.

I dont have an opinion why the teacher gave the poem to the children. Roger McGough is one of our important poets and highly respected. His style is outlined in thios article. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_McGough
Try a close reading of the poem.