To think it's wrong you get punished more for being naughty?

[Timri]

I have 2 DC, DS is very kind and loving, a gentle, good little boy. DD is what is referred to as a character she is a good girl, she can be kind and thoughtful, but she can also be bossy, demanding, basically a little madam at times.
She hit another DC at school, for not moving out of her way when she asked them to. The teacher punished her by putting her on Red (traffic light system) and I took her screen time away for a week (she is in reception) and talked with her about being kind etc... So she went back to school, and for the next week teacher said she was a model student. Teacher said she was actually quite funny, how she strained to sit as straight as humanly possible etc. So teacher put her on gold.
Now, here's my thing.
I understand she has been rewarded for good behaviour, I understand that the teacher has done it to show her that being well behaved is better than being naughty, and has done it to encourage her to keep behaving well, fine.
But DS has never been on Gold. And he's such a good boy all year round (he burst into tears 'confessing' to me he'd been given a warning for breaking a pencil just before parents evening. That's the worst thing he's ever done in school)
I used to see it at school myself, the children who were good all the time were left to it, the disruptive kids were punished for being good for an hour (or so it seemed).
I am a bit put out on DS' behalf. He seemed really happy for DD, and kept telling me, quite excitedly 'DD must have been sooo good to get on gold' and then, a little wistfully, ' I'venever been on gold'
I don't know if I'm over reacting or not, and DD was so pleased to be put on gold, and it really did reinforce to her that good behaviour is better, but just seem to be showing the opposite to me

Eastpoint
Clever DS you have there ! Don't kid the kidders as my Dad used to say.

I know what you mean OP.

I remember being at secondary school and the whole class being made to give a round of applause because one girl had turned up everyday to school that week. She was also presented with a certificate in assembly and allowed to spend that Friday afternoon as 'free time' on the computers.
It was great that she had stopped truanting but the rest of the class who turned up everyday were ignored.

Eastpoint, I completely disagree. IMO trying your best is by far the most important thing, and achieving what you are capable of goes hand in hand with that. Some students will be easily capable of getting As without too much effort and some work really hard to get a C. Equally praising / rewarding all students who get a B seems ridiculous.

That said, I can't imagine why a teacher would tell a child off for under-performing.

Yanbu, ds was desperate to go on gold, and is a good boy. Other children who were challenging went on gold and he didn't understand in the end i told him to ask his teacher what he had to do to get on gold as he didn't understand, he was on gold the following week. He's In yr1

I agree. At school we were all obsessed with getting merits and commendation certificates. The school bully always seemed to be getting called to the front to get his latest certificate. They went up in colours. He'd collected them all while I was still on the lower half. I was always punctual, never missed a day, never caused any trouble, always got As and Bs on my work. This bully not only 'opted out' of homework but seemed to get a merit if he got through a single lesson without beating anyone up. The injustice still rankles, along with the knowledge (even then) that the school was trying to 'buy' his good behaviour. Didn't work.

Yes, another one here. Dd2 is quiet, well behaved, achieves above where she should do but not 'superstar' level iyswim. She's constantly missing points on the school's daft points system simply by being overlooked while all the 'naughty' kids are overflowing with points.

Jessicasrabbit I wish DS would try harder all the time but he won't, he doesn't have that must win at everything attitude. He frustrates me & his teachers but we shall see how he does in his GCSEs this summer. I am far more competitive than any of my children but they seem less stressed and anxious than I was as a teen, I assume that's a good thing. Mocks started today, we'll see in 2 weeks how well his approach has worked..

I've always had a problem with the parable of the Return of the Prodigal Son so I take your point, OP.

This drives my DD mad. She's Y6 and regularly comes home moaning that 'Johnny Lazypants has got another 10 housepoints because he did 5 minutes work today'. I also noticed it when I went in for parents' evening - the well-behaved kids had managed about 10 house points for the year so far, the naughty kids had about 50. I just keep telling her that those children are unlikely to do well in life, will always struggle, will probably never have any money, whereas for her, the world his her oyster, she can do anything she wants, go to university, earn loads of money, go travelling etc.

It continues beyond childhood... my older bro developed an alcohol problem in his late teens, and my Aunt and Uncle offered to pay for his driving lessons if he stopped drinking. I never gave any trouble and still can't drive at age 30 because I can't afford to learn!

YADNBU As the mum of another 'good' DS I know that it is baffling for young children to see everyone make such a huge fuss of naughty children, just for doing something that the good children do as a matter of course. It takes consistent good behaviour for granted, and I think that is unfair.

It 's the parable of the prodigal son, isn't it?

I always felt the stay at home brother was unfairly treated.

the trouble with it is that there is an assumption that the clever good kids KNOW they are clever/hard working and well behaved.

In reality many of them think they must be somehow less good than those who get prizes.

I remember ds coming home in year 5 having been selected for a G&T day. He was astounded. He never got awards etc. He didn't actually believe he was clever, so he just poottled along, didn't work that hard and wasn't particularly well behaved.
That one selection changed his whole attitude to himself, and he started to work harder and pitted himself against the top of the class. He now goes to a super selective grammar. Mum telling him was irrelevant, he needed school to encourage him.

dd1 - very quiet well behaved, works hard. Invisible in class in a way. In year 5 she got a teacher who noticed her for the first time. She has absolutely blossomed. Just the look on her face at that first parent's evening when teacher said 'Well, what can I say dd is lovely, a delight to teach etc'

These kids need to be told by someone that matters (ie teacher not mum) that they are doing well, hard working, appreciated. They need the head teachers awards just as much.

We have a points system, and bronze, silver and gold certificates at the end of term. They get chucked in the bin in this house. You are meant to get a point each day if you are good and extra ones for merit. DS kept careful count one term and knew he was due a gold and didn't get one. DD had poor attendance one term and still got a Gold. Basically the teachers give them to the kids who need motivating and the real suck up goody two shoes kids. DS is just a good boy who goes under the radar.

It does pee me off because it is actively teaching the kids that teachers lie about how the system works and that consistent good behaviour is not rewarded. I've a good mind to go in at the end of the year and tell the teacher that I will be discipling DS severely for having such an abysmal year and for consistent poor behaviour as he is obviously naughty and that I wish that she had raised it at parents eve rather than brush it under the carpet. If he hasn't been earning any extra merit points he can't be a good boy can he?

Really I just wish they would do away with the system.

Yanbu op. An "always good" award would be good to prevent some kids always getting overlooked/ignored.

YADNBU. I still remember the year I came BOTTOM of the class star/reward system when I was eight. I was good, clever, conscientious but shy. I remember one girl getting a star for calling out the latin name of a tree as the teacher was asking about it (we were studying trees at the time so not particularly arcane knowledge ), and telling my mother that if I'd done the same I'd have been told off for it - not that I would as I was too quiet to do it. Same in secondary school, had a very low number of certificates/awards considering how well I did in exams, etc, and it was always the same people getting them. I suppose I had the last laugh at university where I won the department prize for the best degree results in the department .

My school has an "always good" system, which works well.

But my child's still questioned why little Jonny got a reward for not shouting out when my child never shouts out and never gets a reward. I explained that whilst my son found it easy not to shout out, Jonny did not. It was a real achievement for Jonny not to shout out. I explained that people got rewarded for doing things they found difficult. Jonny finds awarding questions in class easy, my son is shy and doesn't like putting up his hand. If my son put up his hand and answered questions, he would get rewarded as this is something he finds difficult. My son is 5 and understood and accepted this fine.

Thingywotzit I complete agree with you

When my son was 14 he would not go to school without a major meltdown, i was advised by his mentor to buy him a game or film every time he spent a full day in school. I did it twice as i really was at the end of my tether and did not know what else to try. After the 2nd BRIBE my other 2 children asked why they didn't get anything because they always went to school. I didn't do it again. School also told him if he went to school for 2 weeks he could go on a trip to Blackpool, i drew the line at that. Unfair to kids who never cause problems, it just made him feel entitled and he still does at 25 yo.

Sorry, posted too soon. Completely agree with Thingywotzit. I remember the same kids at my junior school being the same old teachers pets being chosen to do everything, always in school plays etc.

Yes it is one thing to see it now through adult eyes and realise it's not that straightforward, but surely it's how the current child sees it, is what matters, as it's them that it'll affect. It might seem 'fair' to an adult, but to the children who do their best and behave every or most days, it is going to be perceived as the badly behaved kids being rewarded unfairly, while they are generally overlooked and left to get on with things like they usually do.

Plus, the teachers are adults (and many are also parents themselves) so can they not see how it looks to their charges and maybe suggest a different system for their school, one that's fair to all of the kids?

Some interesting points, especially what Yesterday said. But I suppose that is the problem with the 'always good' kids. They might not have anything that is an effort for them as such. Well not one that will stand out IYSWIM, so they just sort of plod along unnoticed.
I'd say DS is an average student, so nothing exceptional from his workload, his behaviour wouldn't seem exceptional either (I can't see him volunteering to do something unprompted for example), he just sticks to the rules and gets on with it.
I can see it from both sides as I do have one of each, and to the PP who said it, yes, it definitely takes more effort for DD to behave herself. She's away with the fairies half the time, she gets distracted/ thinks she can just do what she wants, (doesn't want to do story time, so she thinks she can just go and play with something else while every other child is on the carpet) so I do see that there is a need to encourage her more.
We have a parents evening coming up soon, so think I'll have a chat with his teacher then.
I suppose it is just one of those things that happens, life's not fair etc
The 'always good' time/area sounds really good! Think we need something like that!!