To be concerned about how DC was treated by store security?

[MothershipG]

DD was stopped by store security in the mistaken but reasonable belief that she had taken something. They asked her friend to wait outside the store and 2 male security officers took DD, who is 13, to a private room where they asked her to empty her bags.

They behaved perfectly politely and respectfully at all times and when she was able to demonstrate that she hadn't taken anything, they apologised and sent her on her way.

Of course I have no problem with that but AIBU to think that it is not acceptable for 2 adult males to take a juvenile into a private room? I cannot emphasise enough that in this instance they behaved perfectly properly, but surely that is a set up massively open to abuse? Adults in a position of power with potentially vulnerable young people in a private room. And of course the converse situation of troubled youngsters seeing a way to get out of a shop lifting charge by making allegations.

Does anyone know what best practice is/should be in this short of situation?

So you can only stop them leaving if you can prove that they have taken something?

No adults should be taking a child off into a room in these circumstances. Regardless of the gender of the adults and the child. It's just inappropriate. They don't know the background of the child - a child is very vulnerable in those circumstances. Not sure how they should handle suspected shoplifting though because I'm sure it's a big problem

You cant say you know there was no CCTV, in the sort of rooms that are designed to "hold" suspected shoplifters they are often pin hole etc. to stop people trying to damage them etc. I expect they would have been under CCTV the whole time from being stopped onwards. I am shocked that they didn't stop the friend as well since usually its assumed they are acting in tandem.

Those that say there are "rights" involved are talking about store policies for employees. As long as the security don't touch etc. then why would anyone have a problem?

I would have thought that was quite a scary experience for your dd, even though the security officers were polite to her. Surely it couldn't have done any harm to ask your dd if she'd like to have her friend with her.

I'd go in and ask to speak to the manager. You've been so calm and reasonable on here that I'm sure that the manager would be happy to listen to what you have to say.

Missfit She didn't use a basket, she didn't put it back where she found it and and she falls into prime shoplifting demographic. It was a perfectly reasonable stop, the guards behaved in a perfectly proper manner, DD has come away with nothing worse than a red face and learnt a lesson. Is that clear enough?

I am interested to know if taking children into private rooms is usual and acceptable practice as it sounds like a situation that is potentially open to abuse from both sides.

ssFitt68

""It was over In What? 5 mins? Why prolong it faffing around calling in this person or that person, waiting for a 'female'.""

It protects vulnerable people and the security guards.

The link doesn't apply to the detaining of vulnerable people/children.

There must be simeone of the opposite gender present.

These policies are LA and legal policies and apply to all public and private businesses.

This has come about because of abuse and exploitation situations, it wasn't uncommon for security guards to demand sex, to let a female go.

It takes moments to get a female member of staff.

OP complain, they've broken the law.

Also "detain" usually means holding someone against their will (usually while the Police attend). Not like in this instance someone showing they have done nothing wrong and then going on their way with an apology.

I think , if nothing else they are leaving themselves wide open.

Should really be done somewhere where there is a. CCTV and b. A staff member of the same gender present.

I have spoken to the store, there was no cctv in the room and they have agreed that everything happened exactly as described. They don't see a problem as there were 2 adults present.

OP this was all sorts of wrong. Your DD was not chaperoned. The guards did not have any sort of right to search. Your DD did not have to prove her innocence. The guards were in the wrong. They had lost sight of her and so had not seen her put the goods back on the shelf. Your DD was not old enough to give any sort of consent to the search taking place.

The guards were quite possibly following company policy but that does not make the policy right.

I have caught a few shoplifters in my time (although obviously your DD is not a shoplifter) and here is how we dealt with it (no security guards in our store):
Each time the police were called, on the phone we would mention if the suspect was male or female and their age. I noticed if male, one or two male police officers would come, if female either one female officer or a male and a female officer would come.
We had two 13 year old girls shoplifting once and we got a female officer. At no point did I leave them alone with the officer though, and we also would contact the parents/guardians ASAP if they were under 16 to have them come and be present with them. It seemed wrong not to do so.

In your situation I think a female member of staff should have stayed with your DD and I wouldn't be happy that she was taken in a room on her own with two men.

If they thought she'd pocketed them, didn't they ask her to turn out her pockets as well as search her bags?

I'd be a bit perturbed at venturing into the realms of a clothing search without a female present tbh, & also surprised they didn't ask her friend to come too - as support rather than also to search her.

I think I'd definitely call the store - politely as you've done here & acknowledging that dd was treated professionally & had acted rather foolishly, but asking them to consider their procedures.

I wouldn't be happy and would write to head office.

This situation has turned out honestly but what if it had been a different 13 year old? What if she'd made an allegation against them? No cctv to back them up. You're doing the shop/security guards a favour by pointing out that this is a huge safeguarding issue.

Teach her to put things back where she found them then! Dumping them on a random shelf! Maybe she lost her nerve

Gosh, if I were the security guards I'd want that policy looked at to protect me against false allegations.

I think it's a perfectly reasonable question.

I was under the belief anyone under the age of 18 should have an appropriate adult with them when questioned? I'm willing to be corrected though.

I think if they thought she'd put them in her pocket then a simple "we just watched you out something in your pocket, please show us what it is" would have sufficed? DD pulls out phone, saves 4 of the 5 minutes.

Thanks Outabout That sounds more like what I would have expected, at no point was she asked her age. She can see she might look older than 13 but maybe 15/16 tops. No one made any attempt to contact me.

So if it is bad practice but the store is satisfied that it is fine, who should I raise it with?

And just to say DD is fine, these guards were fine, I am not looking for compensation or to make trouble, I am just concerned that this is a safeguarding issue. Incidentally the store in question is Primark so not a small independent.

I think it is reasonable to ask for a female to be present in this situation.

MissFitt, don't be silly - and, indeed, don't make unfounded accusations against OP's child. OP isn't complaining that her DD was stopped. The whole point is that, irrespective of the fact that they had reason to be suspicious, that doesn't exempt the store detectives from following correct procedures.

I can see...

MothershipG write to their Head Office:

Primark House

41 West Street

Reading

Berkshire

RG1 1TZ

MD is Arthur Ryan

Explain that you have already spoken to the manager of the store in question and feel that he is minimising the problem.

Missfit stop being an idiot!