To think i don't have a speech impediment

[McColonel]

To me, F and TH are pronounced exactly the same. E.g. three and free - I say them in exactly the same way.

My wife says I can't pronounce th, and I always pronounce an F when it should be TH.

Does anyone agree with me, that they are pronounced the same? Or is she right, and I can't speak properly? My brother agrees with me.

its only seen as a marker of lower intelligence because people have absorbed that class markers are a gauge of intelligence. Its obviously bullshit but its pretty ingrained.

Thumb I say it exaxctly like tree. Have you never heard an Irish person say "Turty tree and a turd" ?
(Thirty three and a third)

derxa Like Rogan Josh I too had a granny who said "shree" instead of "three". I assumed it was related to her false teeth initially, but did hear other people speak similarly. All Scottish.

Incidentally, what speech impediment does Alex Salmond have? ( you said above it had not held him back).

Have never ever heard anyone in Scotland saying shree for three! Never ever.

And op, I would - rightly or wrongly - judge someone saying uvver instead of other, free for three etc.

They are totally seperate sounds. And it makes me wince. I would not associate someone speaking like this with middle or upper classes, or with being educated. Sorry!

Alex Salmond says v for th.

I'm puzzling over this 'shree' thing. It's driving me crazy
It could be loose fitting wallies.

I can hear "shree" in my mind's ear (does that exist?). Their "r" being right behind the front teeth makes the "shree" sound quite plausible.

Found it!

. A peculiarly Edinburgh trait is the pronunciation of “tr-” so that it sounds like “chr-” (“tree” sounds like chree”) and “thr-“ so that it sounds like “shr-” (“three” sounds like “shree”).

m.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/opinion/we-cannae-stop-speaking-up-for-scots-ye-ken-1-1834770

Well yes, I have Lucy, which is why I asked if there was a bit of aspiration there - that's what I've heard before. :)

I get it now Iguana The tr /chr pronounciation is more familiar and lots of pre-school non Scots use it.

Phew!! Glad somebody found that. As the person who first mentioned the shree thing I was worried how I was going to explain it. As a child I was told it was wrong and only to be used by those who physically can't say th correctly.
I am happy and proud of my accent but I do think that it's important to make kids aware of "correct" pronunciations as every dialect/accent has a more formal and less formal version. The more formal versions travel better.

I think most people say "chree" instead of "tree" though.

I think most people say "chree" instead of "tree" though.

I don't think so!

It causes lots of fun when teaching and the pupils spell on GCSE papers with an F not a Th. Also missing H and the VV sound eg ' my bruvva is a feef and ad to go prison' ( round here to is optional!)

Try saying "trucks on the train tracks" without making any "ch" sound.

Or "dreary drinks" without a "j" sound.

It's quite unnatural to say terr-ucks on the terr-ain terr-acks". Or "derr-eary derr-inks" even if you say it very fast.

I know it's late in this thread, I'm a geek, so ... In the late fourteenth century, a poet writing (probably in London) used to use 'f' and 'v' as if they were the same letter. We know, because alliteration is a big part of his verse. I always find students really struggle with this, except a few smug ones who point out that they know modern accents that do the same.

It's the ancestor of Cockney.

OP are you tongue-tied?

A good friend of mine can't pronounce th and he's tongue-tied.

Iguanamaybe you have speech a problem - would you really say that as 'chucks on the chain chacks?' I don't, and I just asked my 10 year old to read it and she clearly said it says t-rucks not chucks?

I am from the Midlands and can certainly say trucks on the train tracks there are no ch sounds anywhere.

Dreary drinks has no j sound.

I have never heard anyone say those sentences with the sounds you are saying.

Its an accent not an impediment. I'm from norf London but have heard the same accent here in Oxfordshire. My DH is posh rural Berks and went to private school.

I am more qualified and earn more than him. Accent does not make a jot of difference in the real world. Except for that time I had a job interview with a famous TV historian and my accent was pointed out to me with a sneer

(Although I did steer clear of th and ph sounds when naming my daughter)

I'm baffled as to how there could possibly be a ch sound when saying Truck

Not everyone says chucks on the chain chacks but enough people do that it is a thing. Also "Schjeet" for "street" is very usual. a lot of people can't say st without making it into sh or sch and it gets very noticeable in "Street" because of the complicating r, which often doesn't appear at all but just sort of makes the "shj" or "schj" heavier and further back in the mouth. (I have a feeling this may be more of a southern thing?) There was a time in the noughties when it was practically illegal not to have ramrod straight hair when you would hear 10 conversations a day about "Schjay'-nahs"

I notice a lot of things like this because I don't live where I grew up, and my parents are from different places, neither of which is where I grew up. So I am used to hearing people saying the same things in very different ways.

I do object to the expression "lazy" being used for a different way of making sounds. I know it isn't meant as a moral judgement (but it shouldn't be used anyway because of it's hinting at this) - but is a way of expressing that the movements are taking a path of least resistance instead of the long way around to make the "proper" sound. However I object to it even in that sense, because most people who have one or two of these ways of pronouncing certain sounds also have other sounds where they are taking a very long way around in muscular terms. It's just varied ways of learning to speak, they are morally and effortfully neutral.

It's quite unnatural to say terr-ucks on the terr-ain terr-acks". Or "derr-eary derr-inks" even if you say it very fast.

I don't know why anyone would put a "ch", in "trucks on the train tracks", I think to do so would be unnatural. Having said that, you also seem to be putting in extra syllables all over the place, compared to the way I would say it. For me "trucks" = "trux", in fact none of your three "terrs" exist for me. (Not sure if it's relevant, but I don't pronounce "r"s the way a Scottish person might.)

"I am from the Midlands and can certainly say trucks on the train tracks there are no ch sounds anywhere.

Dreary drinks has no j sound.

I have never heard anyone say those sentences with the sounds you are saying"

I agree with this. I've never heard it either. I have no problem at all with tr or dr sounds. Don't know if I'm tongue-tied. Not that I'm aware of. I'll look it up.

I looked it up - i am definitely not tongue tied.