To think that radicalisation and home education is a red herring and Nicky Morgan wants an excuse to boss home ed parents about

[ReallyTired]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-the-papers-35144063

If parents are going to radicalise their children then it will happen regardless whether they attend school or are home educated. Children who attend school still learn about the world from their parents. Lots of children who attend state schools get indoctrinated by their parents.

I feel that the parents of children who have been found attending illegal schools should be barred from home education. Someone whose judgement is so poor to use an unregistered school with a narrow curriculum and lack of health and safety is unfit to become a home educator. Their children certainly need to be kept track of.

Leave true home educators alone. They are not responsible for the troubles in Syria.

Because Hed children can have less contact with the outside world.
I dont trust parents who chose to HE because it is a sign of arrogance and control freakery.
Children need input into theur life that is not single handedly controlled by their parents. They need other peoples opinions . They should be inspected on a very regular basis.

Apart from some isolated cases of neglect or abuse, the worst thing home-schooling has produced is Britney Spears. I have never heard of any so-called terrorist having been home schooled.

Weird as I think Teachers are control freaks and home educators are rarely control freaks. Many children don't need or do well with control freak, patriarchy style educational environment and do better in a collective.

But if the odd teacher ois a control freak it is only a small part of a childs life. If a HE parent is a control freak it is their whole life. I have seen plenty if conrol freaks 9n HE boards., why would you do it otherwise.

There are so few control freak Teachers around, when one isn't it's remarkable.

One control freak dysfunctional individual at home V several at school, I don't see your point, they are all control freaks.

I don't think anyone is saying that all teachers are perfect or all schools are. That's precisely why we need school inspections - to make sure that standards are maintained and so on. I just don't see why home education should not also be kept to the same (or modified standards). And although, no, we don't have standard home inspections, teachers are trained to look for signs of neglect in children. If they spot any sign, they will report, and homes will be inspected. But home educated children don't necessarily have that contact with the outside world, so they are inherently more vulnerable.

I can't believe that people are seriously suggesting that the inconvenience of having an inspector come and observe their lessons at home once or twice a year outweighs the need to make sure that all home educated children are getting a decent standard of education. You would really prefer a system where there was no reliable way of learning that a child was left at home alone all day to watch tv to a system where you have to talk through what your educational plan is with a LEA official? I don't understand that attitude at all.

I'm not attacking home education to be clear - there are lots of very valid reasons to do it, and I know two home educated little girls in the US who are very happy and high achieving. But to suppose that every home educator is automatically competent seems so weird.

I'm sure the vast majority of teachers and homeschoolers are basically fine. But there are already systems of accountability to pick up abusive/totally useless teachers, and it is much harder to get away with running a seriously shit school than it used to be.

So, why not have a basic system of accountability to pick up the small minority of abusive/totally useless homeschooling parents?

""And the law already supports this by requiring parents to provide a suitable education. If parents are found to be denying their children a suitable education they are breaking the law."

Yes, but it sounds like there is no enforcement of this law. Are you aware of any cases where parents have been found in breach? Plus it requires someone to pick up on the problem and report it."

Irene yes I am aware of cases where concerns have been raised and parents have been investigated. As with safeguarding concerns there already is a system/process in place for raising such concerns. But yes, as with safeguarding issues it does require someone to pick up on the problem and report it.

How else would you have the situation monitored? If home ed families should have random inspections to check they aren't following the law of providing a suitable education lets also have random home inspections by SS to make sure you aren't abusing your children. Or random inspections by the police to make sure you're not breaking any other laws perhaps?

theycallme your comments about inspectors coming into home ed homes to observe lessons and make sure they're not just watching TV all day expose your complete lack of understanding on how home education works and how different it is from school.

We home educated for a while as mainstream school couldn't support my sons need. I was amazed to discover HE is not more regulated. It should be, if you are doing it properly and have nothing to hide I just don't get why people are so anti regulation, it doesn't have to be a bad thing.

How else would you have the situation monitored? If home ed families should have random inspections to check they aren't following the law of providing a suitable education lets also have random home inspections by SS to make sure you aren't abusing your children. Or random inspections by the police to make sure you're not breaking any other laws perhaps?

If you're stepping in to provide a service that the state provides, then I think that it's fair enough to hold you accountable. Should I be allowed to set up a health clinic at home and not be inspected unless there is a complaint? No, of course not, because even though I am providing the service in my own home, it's a service that affects others, and those others have the right to know that I'm providing it to a competent standard.

I think you forget that although the parent has a right to home educate their child, the child has a right to a decent education, in the same way that patients have a right to know that healthcare providers have a basic level of competence. So if someone is providing a basic service - like education or healthcare - that affects the rights of other people, then they are going to have to accept that they will be held accountable to certain external standards, possibly by inspection.

snappybadger - your comments about inspectors coming into home ed homes to observe lessons and make sure they're not just watching TV all day expose your complete lack of understanding on how home education works and how different it is from school.

Really? You really think that being able to imagine where a child being left at home alone all day under the guise of being home educated means that I don't understand home education? Sorry, you sound deluded. I am NOT saying that I think most home education is like this. I am saying that sadly there are parents in this world who are abusive or incompetent or both, so saying that just because someone is a parent they are necessarily going to do a brilliant job with their child's education is ridiculous.

The myth that HE children are hidden away is a complete fallacy. Graham Stuart, the Chair of the Education Select Committee, says home educated children are "peculiarly visible". Even anecdotally, speaking to any HE family, every time you leave the house to do anything there are comments like "no school today?", "holidays already?", "are you poorly?" etc.

Should I be allowed to set up a health clinic at home and not be inspected unless there is a complaint?
This is totally different. IF the person was providing an education to the public, then this would fall under the illegal schools, and I would agree with you. However, the comparison you are attempting to make should be a mother giving a child a plaster or calpol or whatever, and that should be left within the family, and not require a medical degree to do so.

If you're stepping in to provide a service that the state provides, then I think that it's fair enough to hold you accountable. Should I be allowed to set up a health clinic at home and not be inspected unless there is a complaint? No, of course not, because even though I am providing the service in my own home, it's a service that affects others, and those others have the right to know that I'm providing it to a competent standard.

theycallme you have it the wrong way round. Schools are providing an education on behalf on the parents - because the law states that it is the parents responsibility to provide a suitable education. So the only person to be accountable under law is the parents. Your health care clinic analogy would only apply if a parent was attempting to set up a school and provide education to children other than their own.

Really? You really think that being able to imagine where a child being left at home alone all day under the guise of being home educated means that I don't understand home education? Sorry, you sound deluded. I am NOT saying that I think most home education is like this. I am saying that sadly there are parents in this world who are abusive or incompetent or both, so saying that just because someone is a parent they are necessarily going to do a brilliant job with their child's education is ridiculous.

I said you obviously don't understand home education because you seem to think that children should be having lessons at home for it to be legitimate home education. It simply doesn't work like that for many home educators - which is exactly why inspecting them wouldn't work because they are providing an education, not necessarily following the national curriculum or having a day full of sit down lessons. It is not school at home!

And of course the vast majority of home educators have absolutely nothing to hide and would probably have no problems were they to be inspected, however why should they submit to do so when the law agrees there is no right to do so. And because there is no guarantee the inspector that turned up wouldn't have the same narrow ideas about what constitutes suitable education as previous posters.

'why should they submit to do so when the law agrees there is no right to do so'

I'm presuming from the context that the DfE are planning to, er, change the law.

I'm presuming from the context that the DfE are planning to, er, change the law.

Well I hope they've worked out where they are going to get the funding from for all these inspectors they're going to need to do this...not that I think legislation will get changed anytime soon.

Ed Balls tried this when he was education minister.

He desperately wanted to introduce a curriculum that HE children must follow. There was a proper review and the upshot was he needed to wind his neck in!

the state provides a national health service. I'm not obliged to use it (even though I pay towards it). I can use private healthcare, I can treat myself, I can go to a homeopathic doctor if I was really stupid. NO-one comes round and checks I'm registered with an NHS GP, and insists I have a checkup with them each year.

State schools are the same, they're there to provide a service I can use to fulfil my legal obligation to educate my DC (note, NOT to exercise my "right" to HE - no such right exists). Why should I have to let someone in authority tell me that I have to do something in the way they proscribe, when they don't know any better than i do how to HE my DC?

The Conservatives are supposed to be the party of the smaller state. This sort of stuff shows just how far they've strayed towards Labour-style meddling in all and sundry.

Morgan should wind her neck in.

You are an adult, MyVisions. If you withheld necessary healthcare from your DC the state would have something to say about it.

Spot on MyVisions

I just read the article linked to in the op and it seems like another excuse for the government to create a register and ultimately control home education curriculum. Prevention of radicalisation is just the current excuse whereas it was prevention of child abuse/neglect before.

"Nat but they still need a huge amount of scrutiny. Educating any child is a huge responsibility."

Actually parenting a child is a huge responsibility.

Should we bring in compulsory social services inspections for all families?

Teachers and schools are at breaking point with the stress of constant scrutiny. Do we really want to do this to families too? Is there evidence that as a group home ended kids do worse?

exactly, but the state doesn't do preventative health checking of DC, they offer a service (and chase you if you don't follow it up) but they can't make you take your DC to the two year checks, or have immunisations. None of that in itself is a problem for the state. If that was combined with not treating a serious illness - or not providing a suitable education-- then it becomes a situation where they state should and does step in. They don't go into people's homes to check if DC are healthy unless they have cause for concern. Exactly the same thing with HE.