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Original poster

Seller refusing same day exchange and completion but no chain - why could this be?!

129 replies

Sunraying · 13/12/2015 19:34

We are trying to buy a house with no chain on either side. The seller doesn't live in the house and lives somewhere new! We have to exchange and complete on the same day because there's a tiny chance our bank will do another credit check before we actually ask for the mortgage money, and I know our credit score might be a bit different.

DH applied for a loan in between getting the mortgage agreed and now. We haven't taken out a loan but did apply for one. I can see the loan company searches on his experian credit file, so worried now.

We want to exchange and complete on the same day just in case the bank does another credit check and decides not to give us the money, then we don't lose our 10% deposit because the conveyancer already has the money from the bank so we know it's there before actually signing anything.

The seller is dead set against this. I don't know why though, it's not going to take any longer this way around. Why could it be he's digging his heels in about this?

OP posts:
Original poster
Sunraying · 13/12/2015 21:15

Even with the loan application on DH's file with a new mortgage application, the crucial point is that it will have been there when we made the application and then it will still be there when we draw down. Nothing will have changed on credit files and therefore bank cannot decline offer.

It's if there's a change - which we have now - then they can decline offer.

OP posts:
Original poster
Sunraying · 13/12/2015 21:16

Flash - yes it would have affected that I think definitely.

Do you see where my concerns stem from?

OP posts:
Oliversmumsarmy · 13/12/2015 21:16

For the poster who had never heard of a mortgage company reneging on an agreement I can tell you they do.

Not quite the same scenario as we were selling many years ago in negative equity because we needed to move from the midlands to London.

Our mortgage company said we were able to sell the house then buy the next property with the balance of the mortgage added on to the new mortgage. We had a letter from them stating those facts and with that we went and sold the house. The buyers wanted to be in within 3 weeks. 3 weeks later having exchanged contracts, furniture packed on van house cleaned, I receive a telephone call from the solicitor saying house has been sold, everything completed and to drop the keys off at his office. I replace the receiver and am about to pick it up again to call bt to tell them to make up our bill as the new people were about to move in when the telephone rings. It is the mortgage company saying they were rescinding there agreement. Took a little bit of time to get through to them to understand the house was already sold. The telephone call was ended with them saying they would have to get back to us and me pointing out that it would not be possible as I had sold the house and was on my way to drop keys off at the solicitors. I never heard from them again.

Original poster
Sunraying · 13/12/2015 21:17

Olivers mummy, thanks for posting. Why did they renege on yours?

OP posts:
LibrariesgaveusP0wer · 13/12/2015 21:19

So basically, the more you say the more your vendor sounds right to be cautious. If you engaged in conduct that would have affected the lending decision then that, to me, sounds only a whisker away from fraud. I mean, I am sure it is all above board, but mortgage fraud is one reason solicitors are suspicious of diverting from the norm.

RB68 · 13/12/2015 21:24

its not mortgage fraud to apply for a loan and not take it out. But I am confused about the deposit as that shouldn't do anything till after exchange and is held in trust by your solicitor on behalf of the other sides solicitor. You should not lose any deposit UNLESS you have already exchanged.

Flashbangandgone · 13/12/2015 21:24

Flash - yes it would have affected that I think definitely. Do you see where my concerns stem from?

I do.... Given everything I've read
And the fact the loan substantially changed you creditworthiness to the extent you don't believe you would be offered the mortgage if you applied for it afresh, i now think you're right to seek a simultaneous exchange and completion...

Perhaps you could ask solicitor to redraft contract such that if mortgage offer is rescinded then you won't have to pay deposit. If the house is vacant and empty,
He doesn't really have anything to lose accepting this.

Original poster
Sunraying · 13/12/2015 21:30

RB - but we have signed a deposit so we'd have to pay it, whether or not solicitor had already handed it over. We could be taken to court for the money.

Flash, I really really doubt the seller is going to agree to that change in contract but we might end up having to ask the question. The thing is if we ask that the seller might just walk anyway!

So wondering how I convince seller to go with the exchange and completion on same day when he's dead set against it. Not sure what we could do to persuade him. I thought I could tell him we're definitely not going to try and score money off the property on the day, that's not our motive.

He can see we're really invested in buying the house because we've done loads of research already on what work we'll be doing and we've paid architects to draw up plans and he knows all this.

OP posts:
Sunnymeg · 13/12/2015 21:30

We sold a house DH inherited and exchanged and completed the same day. It was a right pain, we had to wait for confirmation of everything going through, then drive to the house to read the meters and then deliver the keys to the agent in less than an hour. I wouldn't want to exchange and complete on the same day again and we weren't even living there.

Original poster
Sunraying · 13/12/2015 21:31

The estate agent can do all that though Sunnymeg. And they probably would in this case because seller doesn't live nearby. And the estate agents hold the keys anyway.

OP posts:
Sunnymeg · 13/12/2015 21:32

Ah OK

Viviennemary · 13/12/2015 21:32

I can't see why anybody would agree to this redraft of the contract. I certainly wouldn't. Glad I'm not buying or selling a house. What a complication.

Original poster
Sunraying · 13/12/2015 21:34

Lenders can check any changes in the application prior to completion so if you do not disclose all your credit commitments on application, the lender can in extreme cases withdraw the mortgage offer even after you have exchanged, which would put your money at risk.

This above is from thisismoney.co.uk

OP posts:
CalliopeTorres · 13/12/2015 21:34

Of course he has something to lose! The sale of his house!

He is concerned that you are going to leave him high and dry and he will get no recompense for that, it's completely understandable that he wants that reassurance of contracts being exchanged, he has plans to make too, and given that the reason you want to exchange and complete on the same day is so you can walk away and not lose anything If the mortgage offer is rescinded he is absolutely right to be concerned!

Rdoo · 13/12/2015 21:35

Hello, Licensed conveyancer here....some really, really bad advice being given on this thread, Liz, you're the worse culprit.

The funds do not have to be available at exchange, only the buyer's deposit (and by "deposit", I mean 10% of the purchase price) has to be available at exchange. The balance from the buyer and the mortgage funds need to be in place for completion.

All mortgage lenders reserve the right to pull the mortgage offer at any time, whether you're exchanged or not. It is very rare but op, in your case, I think you're doing the right thing by wanting to do a simultaneous.

The solicitor/conveyancer will not be able to give you any more information than to say the lender reserves the right to withdraw the offer and last minute checks can be done. We do not work for the mortgage lender to know what their internal procedures are and each one is different.

Op, you're going to have to find out why exactly he won't do a SIM, in his situation it shouldn't be that much bother. They only thing I'd say is, does he have to clear the property and doesn't want to bother with it until exchange? I think you've no option but to stick your feet in the ground.

Original poster
Sunraying · 13/12/2015 21:36

But if he doesn't agree to exchange and completion on same day he loses the sale of his house anyway Calliope!

OP posts:
Fizrim · 13/12/2015 21:37

So your vendor has been against the idea of exchanging and completing on the same day all the way through and yet you are still asking? And the only reason you are doing it is to protect your deposit? You expect the vendor to take all the risk! He'd be mad to do so.

Rdoo · 13/12/2015 21:38

What risk is the vendor taking Fizrim?

LibrariesgaveusP0wer · 13/12/2015 21:40

How bad is the state of the market where you are?

When we were selling we nearly walked away when a purchaser made too many demands. We just thought they were being such a pain that something was bound to go tits up. We figured better to walk with dignity and be able to tell future buyers why we pulled out.

He might feel similarly.

lighteningirl · 13/12/2015 21:40

As a seller I would see it as you trying to delay exchanging contracts and that has no upside for a seller. As said before exchanging and completing on same day is stressful so a definite downside it's a win with. For you and a lose lose for seller so yabu

Cressandra · 13/12/2015 21:40

I agree asking him to put aside the deposit if the mortgage is rescinded might come across as a big red flag.

I don't think you have much to gain by promising you won't drop your offer. Not that I think you're lying, but someone planning to gazunder might also say that. People who do that are not trustworthy and think nothing of reneging on agreements or promises. The last thing he will want to hear from you is any talk of price dropping - don't give him any reason to think it's even crossed your mind.

Original poster
Sunraying · 13/12/2015 21:41

Rdoo, thank you for posting! I don't think he's going to tell us why he won't do it on the same day because he's been minimal information all the way through, just wants to sell the house and be done with it, and quickly too.

The impression we're being given from everyone involved is that he likes to get his own way, and he's used to getting his own way. He's threatened to pull out when we haven't moved fast enough with the mortgage already!

Rdoo, have you any ideas for how we can persuade him to do it?

OP posts:
LibrariesgaveusP0wer · 13/12/2015 21:42

Rdoo - he may not be risking anything. But unfortunately the OP is saying "our stupidity may have stuffed the deal. We'd like to protect ourselves from the consequences ". If he can sell again easily he may simply resist that.

Original poster
Sunraying · 13/12/2015 21:43

He doesn't have any other interested buyers, the place has got some massive problems that come with it actually and we haven't asked for any money off for those. So we haven't made any demands so far at all, it's all him putting pressure on to go quicker. The place was on the market for well over 6 weeks without any offers.

OP posts:
Grilledaubergines · 13/12/2015 21:44

Simultaneous exchange and completion is risky. There's no guarantee for either that the other won't back out at the last minute and when your removals van is packed up. I wouldn't ever do a simultaneous.