Just lost some friends...

[ChiefClerkDrumknott]

Only Facebook ones, but still. Because apparently stating that the rights and safety of women should be considered alongside the rights of trans women in prison reforms makes me a bigot, comparable to Britain First and completely ignorant. I hate all trans people and am the new Hitler because I don’t think that everyone who claims to be female should be placed in women’s prisons. Oh, and ironically because I dare suggest that FTM trans people would be at higher risk than other men in a male prison – because they’re men, so how dare I suggest they’re not!
I didn’t state anything of the sort, just that a female bodied person, even if they consider themselves male, would be at risk in prison with biological men.
I tried stating my case but have been completely shut down and called all sorts of names because I suggested that feminism and trans rights will clash on this issue. I’ve stated time and time again that I wish no harm to trans people and want them protected, but that I also think that women should be considered. It upset me a little as I was told I had no understanding of the issue, that I clearly have never met anyone LGBT (not true) and that I am a hateful person. Is it even possible to have a civilised conversation about this? I did state that I believe gender to be a social construct and not an innate concept, which had me ripped to shreds.

It was with regard to this article: Trans prison issues

WIBU?

Sorry Worra, giving it more thought there

Btw I like it when I see people posting articles like this. Some people I know not to click the links (their ideas are too different and sometimes it gets repetitive). But others share stuff I hadn't heard about before, different pov and u think it's great!

You see I don't agree with not airing your personal views of FB. Because if you do that and then stop challenging sexist/racist/disability posts, then these ideas are becoming the norm.
On the contrary, I think we should defend our views when we see something that we feel is wrong and should be challenged.

Ah I did try, but they just would not listen. What most annoyed me is I was getting their POV and discussing it but all they would say to my answers is how ignorant of the issues I am, and bigoted, and how I didn't care. And then there was flouncing because they could not get through to me so what's the point? In other words, I would not change my mind = no point discussing it. It's really hard to argue with people like that.
Maybe I should just stick to cats and poines from now on

Oh I wouldn't expect them To agree!
But they will have heard something and most importantly their friends and maybe the friends if their friends will have come across the idea too.

It's not because they don't listen that you shouldn't say anything. Just like in RL.

I think it's even more important actually because a lot if people now firm their opinions from what they see on FB and the likes. But from reading newspapers or listening to the news. If no one is ever challenging these ideas, what's going to happen?

Well that's just it, Wood, I love a healthy debate. But it seems that there are some things that we must view a certain way and anything else is ignorant insert South Park Michael Jackson voice here
My favourite thing of all was being called bigoted because of the FTM thing. I am gobsmacked that being open minded and liberal seems more important to some people than even considering that someone with a female body would be at risk in a male prison!

Sorry NOT from listening to news and reading newspapers.

Maybe I should repost my thread but without the Facebook references, to see if I am an ignorant twat quite possible But that would be Thread About A Thread and that would be naughty

Why would I get a pasting? I was calling for women's rights and trans rights to be considered equally in the prison reforms, which I think is fair as I do think that people who present as trans (both genders) are at risk in men's prisons. Re the gender reassignment thing - that's pretty much what I said and that apparently is far too right wing

My dh is losing friends on fb due to bombing syria and being against it and that.
He has been called an ISIS supporter.

I'll tell you the same, walk away from fb if you have more interesting things than the weather and xmas to post about.
They aren't real friends anyway.

Oh dear, NewLife I'm on the fence a little about that particular issue but wouldn't attack people who had a view either way. I do think it can be a good medium to discuss a range of issues but as others have pointed out, it does tend to get a little, ahem, heated

Oh but itsmine a separate wing (which is the first comment I had, a friend of mine suggested similar to you and I said that could be a possibility) is akin to apartheid, according to these people. We don't separate by race, ethnicity or religion so why would we can't place trans people in a different wing because that's bigoted (even if it's for their own safety)

Only being able to chose which (gendered) prison you go to and automatically placing all trans people in their prison of gender choice is good enough, regardless of the safety of other prisoners or indeed, the trans person them self feels self getting drawn back in to the argument Sorry , Worra

I saw the Tara Hudson one. Tbh I was a bit more in the camp of my ex friends before the Germaine Greer no platforming thing kicked off, but I read a lot around that, threads on here and other forums like DataLounge, even some amazing trans blogs, and started to come around to where I now am. I guess that's one reason I wanted to talk about the issue, but my mistake was think FB would be civilised what an idiot!

As for facebook I rarely see debates like this ending well on there, I tend to avoid them. Saying that I did loose some 'faxebook friends' around the Indy referendum time, I think there were very few people on scotland who didn't!

I have also seen issues hospital when single rooms have not been available, but that's a whole thread of its own

Ah I did try, but they just would not listen - Or did they listen but not agree with you?

Ah I did try, but they just would not listen - Or did they listen but not agree with you?

No, they didn't listen. I repeatedly stated that I wanted both trans women and women to be given equal consideration. This was ignored and not acknowledged once. It escalated in to conjecture that I don't give a shit about trans people and in fact hate them, despite clearly explaining my opinion. My gender critical position was spun in to wanting all trans people to suffer

That's why I use facebook to organise my social life and holiday snaps. No good will come of political debate online. I ignore most of it. It's safer that way!

Why do people debate online like this? Your face is right there next to your comments, you're completely identifiable, and everything you say comes up in your friends' news feeds (and maybe even friends of friends).

Why do you want people to have this level of insight into your thoughts? It makes me break out in a cold sweat.

Leave Facebook for holiday and DC snaps and wishing people a happy birthday, and post your opinion on an anonymous website like this.