to think this is akin to slave labour.

[northernsoul78]

A friend on JSA is expected to do 30 hours mandatory (voluntary) work in a charity shop for 30 hours per week and apply for at least 10 jobs per week. It wouldn't be so bad if the voluntary work wouldbe likely to lead to a job but ofcourse it won't.
Aibu

I'd still prefer it if you based your assumptions on what I write rather than what you imagine Anthony but I have no wish to get into a fight with you so I think I might leave it there. I feel I've conducted myself appropriately and made my points clearly so I make no apology.

If I am behaving inappropriately report me. If I am saying things you don't like ignore me. If I am making points you disagree with then argue your case.

Rather than pushing people into mandatory workfare it would be a much better idea to allow people to go to college. Gaining new skills, improving on skills is a much better idea, increases people's self-esteem and gives them a fighting chance of a decent job.

Far better use of 30 hours a week than working in a charity shop if you're going to force people into something. After all, this government is all about aspiration, right? Right?

hiddle that sounds good (and like there's some element of choice in how many hours they can manage?). I don't have an issue with people being given roles to support them in gaining new skills/recent experience/confidence, that's a good thing, I just object to making somebody work for less than minimum wage.

Saying things in a way you dislike is what I meant to say. Just to be completely clear.

Yes miracle he "works" at the charity shop with my sister who lost her job in a factory too. Worked there for 35 years. Redundancy money long gone and only had a few temporary jobs in the last 10 years. Should have retired in two years but now bumped up to 4 again. Not many peopl want to employ a 62 year old with spine problems and mild sen but not enough to qualify for pip or whatever it is now. Not that she would claim it even if she did.

Or another option to college (because it's a fallacy that everyone on these schemes is unskilled or inexperienced) would be to use the money to create industry and creat jobs.

I feel I've conducted myself appropriately and made my points clearly so I make no apology.

Absolutely! Who wanted to report you

The 'real' Anthony Blanche was made of sterner stuff I think

I think offering courses to those that would benefit would be very useful.

Using money to create jobs. Ah, what a nice world that would be....

Perhaps tradespeople could offer training under a 'voluntary' scheme, and get access to some of the many empty council owned properties that need doing up to become habitable, with their fee paid from the future rental. This would at least give the jobseekers a real transferable skill, and create some affordable housing that cant be accessed at the moment because the costs of bringing them back into use are beyond what local government can afford

You folks on here bleating about housing benefit - you do know that isn't classed as an out of work benefit, yes? So why in the world would you include it? Lots of working people get it. Too many benefit bashers on this thread

If you're claiming JSA and rent then you will also be entitled to Housing Benefit. That's just fact, not benefit bashing It's entirely relevant to the points people are trying to make about how this mans benefits breaks down into an hourly wage amount.

No one has said that only those on JSA get HB or that it's an out of work benefit only.

How do I vote you in nettle?

i think its fine when its for volunteer positions.

I think its diabolical when its making them work in tescos or poundland for dole, when those positions should be fully paid

It can be done though OddSock. It happens all the time with subsidised contracts, generous "incentives" to investors etc etc...

Thanks atreya kind of you to say so.

YANBU and the people on this thread who are comfortable with the idea and claim they are being paid are totally out of touch with reality. It's unethical and the value added of the 'experience' when trying to apply for retail work is pretty negligible in such a tough employment market. The kinds of low skilled jobs they're being given require little training and there's huge competition at that level- it's not like getting an internship that will really develop skills and contacts in a specialist field (though many internships are also pure, one-sided exploitation). Charities should not be participating in such an unethical forced scheme- they are helping to keep people trapped without any real remuneration or time to invest in changing their situation.

moving I've already made comments on this thread but just for you:

1. There are jobs out there for people who really want to work. The jobs may not be what the person did before, or their dream job but there are jobs. For instance, There seems to be huge demand for office cleaners in many cities.

1. There is nothing wrong with expecting a single able bodied adult to volunteer for 30 hours a week and look for jobs in exchange for them being given money by the state. Doing voluntary work for a charity is not the same as being told to do workfare in tesco (which I agree is not on)

1. There are a significant minority of people who live on benefits who have no desire to get a job and who won't work if they can possibly avoid doing so.

1. I think there is no reason for an able bodied adult with no dependant children to be out of work for anything other than a short time. If there are no jobs in your immediate area you need to move to where the work is - seems to work well for Eastern Europeans.

How righteous some people are, especially when they don't have to do it themselves. It is unreasonable to be expected to work for 40 hours per week for JSA. I can't see many people here working for what works out at £1.81 per hour. 10 hours it much more acceptable and gives a person chance to search for a job. We don't live in a country where we expect people to be out picking bananas for 12 hours per day, it's called a democracy.
This is just the government's way of 'sanctioning' people and saving money I am sorry your friend has lost her job and I hope she manages to find one soon but she doesn't stand much chance if she's out their making valuable contacts and socialising in a charity shop.

moving I don't doubt that it can be done, I just don't hold my breath that the current government will do it.

Tell you what Anthony, I'll do you the courtesy of reading your list if you would do me the courtesy of reading my post with the list and telling me which point you answered yes to. Is that fair?

P.s. moving I didn't imagine you telling people to "cop on" or calling them "ignorant" it is there in black and white for all to read.

Sorry miscalculated 30 hours equals £2.41.

mentioning Housing Benefit does not make peopel benefit bashers. That is ridiculous. It is in response to otheroing on about having to live on £70 per week. It is a neutral fact.

It seems that most people are against the exploitation of workers but also in favour of JSA claimants doing something constructive.

No I don't either OddSock. It's not really their style iykwim.

and what is wrong with thinking people who believe fallacies to be true should cop on? Or that they are ignorant Anthony? Could you explain?

It seems to me that you are derailing the thread with your repeated barbs at me so I shall stop responding to barbs and only to points of argument.

That seems most sporting and conducive to harmonious posting I think.

I think all thevpeople quer counting housing brnefit meant that often people working in low paid but min wage or above jobs may still get housing benefit. Thus posters saying well actually he is working for 5.00 ish per hour are wrong. (Me included)

"moving" accepts gentlemanly handshake (Though I'm more of the quiet wallflower type who normally offers gloved fingertips in greeting )

You wanted me to make my points and I have. I did it in your "list" style as I (perhaps wrongly) assumed that's how you like information presented?

I can't find your list now to,read - too far upthread - I expect I would answer yes to everything though.