To wonder why so many teachers want to quit

[ChazsBrilliantAttitude]

Inspired by other threads but I didn't want to derail.

What is going on in education that is making teaching so stressful?

I work in the City and you don't see too many people quitting with stress even though the work can be stressful. Certainly, not the numbers you see in teaching.

When I went on daily supply I found I was appreciated more for doing so much less.
It made me feel like I was worth something again... I wasn't expecting THAT on supply!?!

On nearly every supply assignment I was allocated the permanent staff would ask me what my experiences were like, how much did I get paid, etc, etc... It was clear they were looking for a way out for themselves. Then I'd get to hear of the mad new initiatives in their schools to raise pupil attainment. Generally unrealistic, and half baked.
As a mum of two school aged children I'm in two minds about how I should feel about my decision to leave teaching. On the one hand I get more family time, I can do the morning and afternoon school run, less working till 2am or 3am, no more jumping to action when SLT email me in the evenings to urgently do some task or other, etc, etc. so, yes, I win in that way. BUT I feel like I've sold out when I should have stayed and fought. And I feel that I've contributed to a problem which is going to affect my children's future. It saddens me.

I have tried to fight but I have been made to feel lazy and incompetent when I question unnecessary work. I have been expected to attend meetings and training days unpaid on my days off. I was happy to do this when I enjoyed my job but I don't any more.

I teach a compulsory gcse and in my set 2 fft targets range from a-e. Pretty mixed ability... I argued to get the highest and lowest moved up/down and swapped with others but was told tough luck. It will be hard when doing practice papers in class as some will need to do foundation while most do higher.

I don't think MrsUltra is being smug so much as being relieved at not being treated like dirt any more. Of course everyone is living in a climate of fear and the SLT are the same. Fear makes people act in an irrational and shitty way. I sent this thread link to Nicky Morgan. Did I get a response of any kind? Of course not. She's a hard-faced poodle.

MrsUltra has never actually taught though. I could understand it if it were relief after 15 years of being ground down or having to leave through ill health/ stress. But she has never done that- just put her self straight on supply and seems to think she is much cleverer than the rest of us for thinking of a way to not have to do any marking.

Oh I see. Didn't read closely enough.

Noble

until now not being a core subject has had many disadvantages including getting the grades with (as Evil states) a greater mix of abilities in classes.

Also add to that, many schools, when you set catch ups/detentions for incomplete work core subjects get priority, so none core subjects, in effect, lose out on not only extra lesson/catch up time but also the ability to instil discipline in the pupils.

As it happens I do teach, every day, and in challenging schools. But I teach and the kids make progress. Don't waste time on things that do not help the kids. Also what I don't do is moan and wail about how life should be like it was in 1981. And I got to lots of schools, so do not only see that 'one-school-I-have-been-in-for 14years'
(The only actual 'solution' I have seen offered on here is to 'go back to 1981'. Yeah, we all would...)
SLT are clearly in many cases not up to the job.
A 'senior leader' who does not go the loo all day because he is scared of his boss!(Previous poster seemed to see this as a badge of nobility ). With useless 'leaders' like that, no wonder teachers are demoralised and leaving in droves. No where in any proper organisation would a person as spineless as that be promoted to 'Senior Leadership'.
And no, I don't think everyone should leave and be a supply teacher, because some of those who have posted on here, from what they indicate about their fixed mindset, really would not last a day in some of the school out there.

In reply about my DD in Year 1, not losing breaks no, but lots of 'when you've finished, you can go to the carpet to watch Numberjacks'.

My DD is bright and keen but having a bit of difficulty with her fine motor skills and it takes her time to write. She has said she feels like she is missing out on reward time and this makes her sad.

About supply, yes it's great, no marking, planning, accountability...but it's not a bed of roses being the new face in the staffroom every day, not knowing where the loo is, where to get a cuppa, being ignored by everyone.
I have to admit I do miss the trenches mentality of 'we're all in it together' I had with my old colleagues.

I couldn't leave and become a supply teacher because what keeps me going in the job is the relationships with the kids that you build up over time, and a supportive department.

No suggesting anyone should (...or could...) leave their job and do supply.
But for those that have the skills, you do build up relationships with schools and students. And you do get invited to Leaving Dos, and cards from students nominating you for their best lesson.

I completely agree with Noble. I did do supply for a short time when I relocated to London but I missed the relationships. I actually think that positive relationships with students is the key to successful teaching. Supply teaching didn't give the opportunity for that.

Is that me you are referring to ultra ? I said DH regularly never gets to the loo at work bit I have never said or implied he is scared of his boss or that it is. 'badge of honour'. He just never stops. If it was me, please don't misrepresent what I said and then use your misrepresentation to draw ludicrous conclusions from. DH is neither useless nor spineless. You really are full of your own self-importance for someone who has never held down a permanent job and been accountable for student outcomes.

This thread started as intelligent discussion about why teachers leave the profession. It has turned into that typical thing teacher so often do- bitterness, moaning, backbiting and blaming each other. I give up!

[Goes off to hide thread so does not have to see it anymore and feel even more fed up about the profession]

' being relieved at not being treated like dirt any more.'

That's me. Not smug, just delighted that I've survived and a little incredulous that my life is so much less stressfull than it has been for years.
I thought I'd do my 40 years or so and retire. Then I thought I'd do 30 years and be dead. Then I thought I'd spend the rest of my miserable existence under a duvet with the phone unplugged.
But now I'm teaching again and enjoying it.

Ultra - the not having time to go the toilet has nothing to do with being spinless; its the reality that all school staff find themselves in. A 15 min break in the morning which is often taken up with detentions, talking to students then straight vack to the classroom. Lunch is often taken with clubs, revision sessions (see earlier posts on what is now expected) then back to a full afternoon

If a 'Senior Leader' is complaining to his wife he can't go to the loo - it is spineless. Why would you led by a person like that?

It is now half term and the only way I am able to have a precious 3 day break away with my DH and spend some time with my children and my Mum is to work at 5am every morning before everyone gets up. Otherwise I will be chasing my tail and getting stressed as soon as I get back to work. And none of what I am doing has anything to do with teaching - it is all admin.

MrsUltra please give it a rest. It's hardly supportive to sneer at other teachers. No wonder divide and rule works so well.

We went on strike when I first started teaching to secure the right to a lunch break. There are so many academies and so much pressure now that it's possible to drive a coach and horses through teachers ' terms and conditions.

No Ultra you do not teach. You stand in front of classes and deliver a pre-planned lesson which is a small part of somebody else's teaching. You don't even help them with their teaching by providing them with adequate feedback about the learning that took place in front of you- and you feel that this is a badge of honour.

Teaching a far broader, deeper and more skilled undertaking than what you are doing and it takes time and investment, standing alongside pupils day after day while they piece together their knowledge and practise skills.

What none of us enjoy is having to evidence every minute step of that learning process for every child in front of us. Yes, before you say it, at the moment we do have to because we can't individually just decide to stop- the personal and wider consequences of that are too great. It can only be stopped by collective action, which I have already suggested is long overdue.

You are blaming teachers for causing the problems with the current system. You are blaming SLT for, in your inexperienced eyes, not getting it right. It is not helpful and you do not have the insight to make these assertions.

The DC show progress. And they enjoy the lesson, engage and there is real participation.
Okay, you are defensive and don't like that, and it is not 'real teaching' no marking! )
Too bad - the kids involved do like it - the schools that ask for me back like it.
So - your opinion is not so relevant, actually.

Engaging is not the same as learning.

MrsUltra, I'm sorry but until you have actually worked properly as a full time teacher, on a full time contract, I don't think you're in the position to be able to tell those of us that do do that how it is.

You presumably don't really know if progress is being made as you're not there "over time".

Whilst I am the poster who loves their job and does not recognise much of the crap others are posting about, I don't think it helps to try to make out that teachers are creating these issues themselves. And FWIW, Mrs Ultra, a "decent" supply teacher in my book is one who delivers the lesson and ensures that my room doesn't get trashed. If that's what gets you invited back, then great, but please don't be under the illusion that you are doing a better job than the class teacher.

Popping in occasionally and delivering a lesson is not the same as being a class teacher, responsible for a class for a whole year (or two, for GCSE). It really isn't.

MrsUltra the jealousy evident from some on here of your chosen course of action i.e. Supply in which you clearly do teach & mark, yet are true to your beliefs, is very interesting.

I entirely agree with your usage of the word 'spineless' to describe some of the 'S' LT you have experienced. If more staff had the courage of their convictions to point out that the Emperor actually has no clothes, the serious problems of low teacher morale and high staff turnover would have to be addressed.

Much of what has been listed by previous posters as SLT responsibility could very easily, and much more effectively, be outsourced to companies who have properly trained and qualified staff specialising in eg HRM.

Until the quality of SLT is improved so that they are deserving of respect from the staff below them, the situation will continue to deteriorate.

I would not employ an amateur gas fitter to fit a new boiler in my home, as I wouldn't want to risk my children dying of carbon monoxide poisoning. I need him to be properly trained, experienced, registered & referenced. Fortunately the government recognise this, and there is a national Code of a Practice, so I can have reasonable confidence in his CORGI registration credentials.

By the same token, I do not expect individuals untrained in key areas to be responsible for the running of my children's education. Unfortunately, I have no choice in the latter due to the current promotion system being wide open to abuse. This is fundamentally wrong.

The fact that 'S'LT spend very little, if any, time at the chalk face whilst having the power to destroy teachers' lives and students' futures is the crux of the problem.

As they ironically lecture those teachers deemed to 'need support with students' behaviour', "respect has to be earned".

I turned down AHT progression 3 x due to my zero-tolerance of hypocrisy, which is point 1 of the Person Specification.

I turned down AHT progression 3 x This kind of thing doesn't help either. Presumably what you mean is that you chose 3x not to apply for an available job?

I'm not interested in being SLT either, but wouldn't try to claim that I've "turned it down" - I just chose to apply

Lonelyplanet I respect your bravery for handing in your notice. And I completely agree with you about the ludicrous situation we have now where last year's able child is now considered average. We are told to 'teach from the top', and hope the majority of the class can hang in there and get some of it.