Merkel is responsible, Germany should take them

[longfingernails]

Merkel has idiotically encouraged millions of illegals to risk their lives getting to Europe, and then promptly shut the door on them. Now sensible countries like Hungary are having to bear the brunt. It's the most idiotic policy I've seen for quite some while.

Germany should pay. Germany should house them. And the EU rules on free movement of people should be torn up. I hope the AfD gets a massive boost at the expense of the CDU/CSU.

I think even someone as wet as Cameron could get Hungary, Croatia, et al to agree on making Germany bear the brunt after the problems caused by hordes of illegals at their borders over the last few days. I am sure the Greeks would be more than happy to oblige too.

[LunchpackOfNotreDame]

You could argue if child abuse is happening in these camps then surely the abusers are the type of people you turn away and don't let in? If you know for a fact someone is a child abuser then you don't grant them asylum or migrant status.

That's why people need to be processed, to filter out the crap like child abusers.

[reni2]

Bloody hell, we are talking about people here. Refugees from dreadful war zones. I do agree Germany should take more (although they have taken 450.000 already) and so should the UK.

[LunchpackOfNotreDame]

I think I have concussion anyway from what my Dr thinks is a cluster fuck headache but I'm still labelling a severe migraine. I'm in denial. It's safest here.

[Ta1kinPeace]

Lunchpack
I moved here for a better life. Illegally initially. Perfectly good life where I was but wanted better.

THe people in Syria have had the shit bombed out of their country
AND
Climate change has made the rivers run dry this crisis was predicted in the science press several years ago by the way
www.newscientist.com/article/dn13655-is-this-the-beginning-of-water-wars/

[lovelyconverse123]

thank you for the link longfingernails (love the name), don't have time to read it though, but surely any half wit knows that god knows what, with god knows what sort of intentions, is hiding amongst this unchecked and unlimited flood of migrants. and I cannot understand how some people think all the apples in this migrant barrel are good 'uns...............the fact is, is that that cannot possibly be the case. 'oh we already have our own homegrown terrorists' I hear y'all cry.............and that, very sadly and unfortunately, is correct. but do we really want to be giving an open door to more (no matter if it is 1 or 100) ???

[ohmyeyebettymartin]

Lunchpack from what I've read it's guards who are a large part of the problem. Not the people being held there.

It's sickening.

[shins]

I'm aware of Spanish/Italian/French labour laws and how they've created virtual gerontocracies where older people enjoy far better pay and conditions than the young. Why can't Germany try to attract young workers from those countries rather than people from incompatible cultures? Many of the people we've seen moving through Europe are illiterate and from extremely conservative religious tribal cultures, why devote huge resources to integrating them that could be used to help the truly vulnerable sitting in camps, not those who are setting fire to tyres and lobbing them at police officers. Only about a fifth are Syrian, the BBC finally conceded today. The rest are opportunists piggybacking on the Syrian tragedy and Merkel's stupidity and lack of foresight.

[LunchpackOfNotreDame]

talk I'm pleased it's worked for you. But for every success story how many forgien nationals are homeless on our streets? It doesn't work for everyone and we cannot afford to support the world. We struggle to support our own. Multiply this throughout Europe. It's crap. The world has gone to crap. Perhaps we need to get the gulf states to stop being knobs?

ohmy grim

[Dawndonnaagain]

Lunchpack I find it worrying that not once did you consider it could have been the guards.

[LunchpackOfNotreDame]

Why? The post was worded in such a manner where it could be inferred it was the occupants of the camps.

Given the large numbers residing in them it's safe to assume one or two or more will be paedophiles and child abusers...

[ohmyeyebettymartin]

shins I live in northern Europe and we have had increasingly large numbers of Spanish and particularly Italian and Greek young people moving here over the past 5 years. So that's definitely a "thing" IYSWIM. I wonder if there are political issues involved with being seen to be trying to attract another EU country's young graduates? That's one reason why that option might not appeal to Germany.

[Justanotherlurker]

Talk

Oh, that's alright then, it's only the 'utterly unskilled' who have seen wage depression then I suppose they should all just up skill and become middle management, after all when there is a larger pool of available workforce then wages obviously stays the same.

I think it's generally known that it affects low skilled workforce

www.migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/briefings/labour-market-effects-immigration

You obviously haven't read the guardian article I linked to either.

[ohmyeyebettymartin]

Lunchpack I stand corrected, I had a quick Google and there is very definitely a problem amongst so-called 'inmates' too.

The disgrace is that while reporting suspected child sexual abuse is mandatory in Australia, it is banned on Manus.

[Ta1kinPeace]

Lunchpack
But for every success story how many forgien nationals are homeless on our streets?

Well considering there are more rough sleepers in Seattle than in the whole of the UK
I do not believe you.

The foreigners either work or bugger off back home - a lot of the original Polish crew have gone back and built businesses there.

[shins]

I've been following the German media (I lived there for a few years and speak the language) and there's the same total dissonance with the mainstream papers full of happy clappy hands around the world stuff whereas the comments below the line tell a very different story. People are scared and angry. The UK media is the same; the Guardian is like Pravda at this stage.

[LunchpackOfNotreDame]

Thank you ohmy that's appreciated.

It's disgusting whoever is carrying it out.

[jorahmormont]

'hordes of illegals'.

Nice.

[ohmyeyebettymartin]

It's the same where I live shins, positive media and awful comments.

But when I go on Facebook groups where locals are working to help refugees and migrants, both here and elsewhere in Europe, there's an extremely high percentage of caring, practical (as in offering practical assistance such as clothing and sanitary pads etc) and worried comments.

I am worried but practical if that makes sense. It was obvious from the time Hungary said they were going to block the border entry point that there would then be violence, you didn't need to have a crystal ball to see that one coming. That's why it was clearly a horrible idea - because it would not take us to a place any of us wanted to go. well maybe Hungary have got where they wanted to go?

[shins]

Talk I'm not liking your contempt for the unskilled. My middle class friends love the cheap nannies and tradespeople and don't care about what nationality the waitress is. Whereas I grew up with people whose wages and life prospects would have been hit very hard by the kind of influx we've experienced in the last decade and a half in my country because they were gasp unskilled.

That Lisa McKenzie piece was great btw; shock at the Guardian printing something left wing!

[Ta1kinPeace]

Justanotherlurker
The article from the Grauniad was about people worrying about immigrants on every corner, not about actual facts of employment

The Oxford data was analysed in great detail by the Economist when it came out.
There is a massive shortage of skilled trades in the UK
(bricklayers, carpenters, plumbers, plasterers, electricians etc)
caused in part by Bliar and his obsession with everybody getting degrees for everything.
The UK imports thousands of nurses every year from all over the world - and has done for decades.
Vegetable picking has been done by immigrants since WW2.

The UK and western Europe need more taxpayers.
Birth rates have been below replacement for decades.

What is utterly shameful is that the Syrian / Lebanese / Palestinian refugee crisis was not dealt with in an orderly manner three years ago.

[shins]

I recommend the live streaming on rt.com, a Russian news station. They don't edit or narrate, just film at current border flashpoints. I watched what happened yesterday at the Hungarian border and then later the edited version on Sky. Astounding, the propaganda.

[LunchpackOfNotreDame]

Can you explain further shins how did they differ?

[Georgina1975]

Germany has a very strong economic motivation for encouraging settlement. I guess that resumption of border checks is probably an attempt to get an EU settlement on the issue.

In terms of the UK...of course we should take a significant proportion of these people. And I do favour prioritising the most vulnerable (minors in particular). BUT I do hope the present government will provide the necessary funding to settlement areas. This has not really happened in respect of relatively recent EU migration. Most migrants and asylum seekers are not initially settled in naice areas. Rather, areas of cheap housing and high levels of socio-economic deprivation. A primary school near me has changed from serving a predominantly white/British community to having 64% of pupils speaking English as a second language in 7 years. It remains a lovely & vibrant school, but it is really struggling to cope with the scale and pace of this change.

So, I say "YES" to migrants and asylum seekers, but far, far more funding for Local Authorities to manage change.

[longfingernails]

What was the difference shins?