AIBU to feel discouraged that marrying well makes more impact than professional or academic achievement?

[williaminajetfighter]

When I was growing up my very feminist mother always told me that I didn't need a man to get ahead and suggested I could make my own way, and have a good quality of life, by achieving academically and professionally. I did that and went to the right schools and built a good career. I was also single for the majority of my life, for lots of reasons, but I never felt I needed a man to 'complete me' as it were.

I'm now in my 40s, all well and good and I'm happy with how things have turned out generally. However I don't have an amazing quality of life and as I look around I do feel like the women I know who are the best off got there through marrying well or just marrying young (and thus having someone to support them or a dual income), not through academic or professional achievement.

I appreciate that quality of life isn't just about money and I wouldn't change my life and experiences, but it does make me wonder when I look amongst my peers and realize the best off are the ones who achieved it by aligning themselves with a successful man. I suppose thus it has been through time - but it makes me sad that 50 years after Betty Friedan it still is thus!

And knowing this, what do I tell my DDs? Yes, do well in education and yes, pursue a career but the most important thing you can do to improve your quality of life is to get married, and ideally marry well? Perhaps it's not a meritocracy but a marriage-ocracy?

Please don't flame me - I am curious if others wonder/think the same thing.

YANBU, but I would like to speak as someone who is perceived to have "married well" (A Saudi businessman.)

I feel that because so much of my "worth" and status lies with who my husband is, that I am in a very vulnerable position. I have tried to use the fact that I have more free time and more money to improve my skill set, get better training etc. But ultimately DH does not want me to do that. The price of having married a rich guy and having more disposable income/time/whatever you perceive, is that my time feels completely owned by him. He doesn't say this, of course, but it is like I am his employee. He wants to travel constantly and he wants me to go with him. He needs my attention all the time. He needs me at dinners with people that I don't even like. There is a code of behaviour expected at the dinners (sunni muslim) where I feel I cannot be myself. I have no friends. We are travelling all the time, most of my old friends are in one place. There is quite literally no opportunity to be my own person.

I don't feel strong. I imagine that feeling of strength and self-resourcefulness feels pretty good for you.

I married my husband when we were 22. He probably earns a bit less than the national average wage. We are incredibly happy together and have 3 beautiful children. We are very lucky that our work commitments facilitate us being able to spend many evenings and weekends all together which makes us very happy. But I guess I didn't 'marry well' as he isn't a high earner? I will stick with what I have thanks

Ah well op, at least I am one less person for you to be jealous of

We're saying the same thing mother. Working hard in a well paid job won't provide the same opportunities for our children as having a stash of family money.

This is a really interesting topic. A friend of mine pointed something similar out to me recently. She was saying how she (and me and the rest of our college friend group of women) were all top of our class academically going into college, we all did a professional qualification, all worked in that profession, all made partner (except me - I went a different route after about 5 years), all worked very hard. But our lifestyles are no better than women who did a mediocre leaving cert (in Ireland), didn't go to college, but did marry a man with high earning potential.

I agree that I would not want to be financially dependent on a man but from my observation of these women, many of them are in great marriages, their husbands think they are wonderful and do a fantastic job in the home, they have equal access to money and they enjoy their lives.

I agree with JanetBlyton though in the changing face of matrimony. I see a huge difference between wives of the older guys in our company (65is) who didn't work when children were small and definitely didn't have a career of similar stature and earning ability. My generation (maybe 20 years younger) is full of couples where both have similar careers and earning ability.

Slapme I think the telling thing here is you think you are almost like an employee and to some extent you are because he needs you to fulfill a certain role so he can succeed. In this case, i would definitely be transferring a significant sum of money every month to my own bank account as my salary.

on the "stash of family money" thing, it can transform lives. My husband's grandmother was the only child of her generation - all uncles/aunts/parents etc left everything to her. She had an incredibly good life with a country house and farm, trips abroad, private education for her children just because of this stash of money propping everything up. It helped her children get on the property ladder very well too.

I know a woman here in US whose grandmother left her about $100K when she died (again the only child of her generation). My friend used it to buy a house when she was still a graduate student. Because of that early injection of cash, her whole life changed. She and her husband (a sociology professor eventually) live in victorian 5 bedroom house with a small mortgage and are able to put significant money into their pension, savings etc. They can also make lifestyle decisions - she was an engineer who went back to become a high school teacher so she could spend more time with her children.

Christina yes, exactly.

Yes an inheritance can change people's lives. One of my friends, both her and her DP work part time because of an inheritance, and bought a big house. They have lots of family time together as a result. Another friend retired early in her 50's when she inherited and her DP doesn't work at all.

Even small inheritances can mean the difference between having a large enough deposit to buy a house, or like one friend, having the money to retrain for a better career.

Beg pardon, ' no one can take away your skills and experience' Have you looked out the window? People are binned all the time because their skills and experience are no longer useful/can be done cheaper elsewhere. Lawyers note: software is coming that will seriously impact your profession.
Capital, looked after, remains useful.

If you have a good education and are bright you can adapt, however. I am a lawyer and have worked continuously for 30 years with huge ability to change. I don't fear software. In fact I've made a lot of money in writing the software licences (around the time of big bang), the legal issues of 1.1.00 and today all those internet contract so more software - bring it on, more packages which take away dull grunt work - bring it on. One of the biggest issues for work is not taking enough risk and opportunities when they arise.

On the topic of the thread assortive mating between two bright people who both earn a lot and carry on working - that is very sensible as it spreads risk. However it is certanily true that women also have erotic capital (Hakim writes about it) which men don't so in a sense we can gain money two ways (my husband who got a big divorce settlement being an unusual exception). If you look at the number crunching just done on the Ashley Madison sight in the last few days over how many women sent emails compared to men it was something like 0.0167% of emails being sent were from women.

I suspect it makes sense for women not just to earn their own money but marry someone who is similar to them rather than the unemployed drug user etc. get someone who has a similar work ethic and education and income level to you which is of course what marriage matchmakers still do the world over - in India they will be looking to match two people with PhDs etc as much as being in the same caste.

I know a lot of women (in their 40s and 50s) who owe their material comfort to their DH.

Many of them are highly educated and were in highly paid industries, which they gave up on either moving for their DH's career, or having children (sometimes both).

However, when I look at the younger generation of parents their are also men who owe their material comfort to their DWs. Most of these men do not give up work completely, but certainly their income could not keep them comfortably. That is down to the DW.

Of course OP what did you expect? Most successful blokes I know started working/studying/savings for a family when they were 18-21 years old and formed long term views of what they would like to achieve in life.

That pays dividends in their 30's when they have beautiful children and successful intelligent hard working wives (whether that is SAHM or not) all contributing towards one another to make their lives better. Such men and women are naturally going to be attracted to one another too.

Due to the division of their labour I would expect such a family to have an excellent quality of life so long as they are intelligent, rational and hard-working.

I am in the situation of having a high (1%) household income mostly due to DH's salary. It certainly isn't something I set out to do, and I'm far from a trophy wife - I just happened to fall in love with someone with a high earning potential and niche skills which are very well rewarded in the current market, without him having to be a workaholic. The truth is that it has definitely given me advantages over my friends who are in relationships with lower earners or who have ended up as single parents, no matter how ambitious or hard working they are.

E.g. I have been able to pursue several degrees and a career related to my own interests, which is often badly paid but I've been cushioned against the stresses of low pay due to DH's financial support and still been able to follow my dream career. I've never had to compromise on it due to finances or lack of childcare - lots of colleagues and fellow students dropped out along the way for these reasons. Other friends have pursued better paid work but are ground down with long hours and lack of interest in their work, so financially they are doing well but lack personal satisfaction and it also affects the quality of their relationships. We are in London and we're one of the few families we know of our age (mid 30s) who have been able to buy in a central location (so it's close to DH's work and he has a short walking commute), and at the time it was only based on DH's salary.

Who you partner up with, or whether you partner up, is important for both men and women. But unfortunately I think it makes more difference for us still.

That said, I wouldn't subscribe to everything OP is saying. After all, women in their 20s now outearn men, we're the higher earners on average until about 31 or 32ish I think? And we don't know what those of us in the 32 and under bracket are going to do in the future- can't assume we'll necessarily follow the same pattern as those who've gone before us.

Lymzz your friends have the self respect to know they are not living off a man

If lymzz and her husband both love each other and are both happy with the way their money is earned and spent,there is no reason for lymzz to feel any lack of self respect IMHO.