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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be a bit freaked out about some of the reading levels some children have

103 replies

theWomenInTheWoods · 23/08/2015 21:14

DS was very slow to take to phonics and reading. He's nearly 6.

I was feeling pretty pleased as in the last month he's gone through book 1 to 4 of the Peter & Jane books and were starting on book 5 tomorrow.

He can also use his phonics to sound out a lot of phonic based words

However sometimes when I read threads on mumsnet I feel like maybe he isn't making such good progress. I saw one post where someone said their child was done with all 12 of the peter & jane books by the time they were 3 and a half. DS started school just before he turned 5 and he didn't know a single letter. I would have taught him letters if he seemed interested but he was too busy playing - and didn't seem to naturally absorb them or have any interest.

When people say their children are reading books like Harry Potter at age 6 are those children still sounding out words or do they somehow know a huge amount of words by sight?

OP posts:
Scoobydoo8 · 24/08/2015 08:45

My DS was slow at reading, he had 2 older sisters who'd done well, the teacher gave up on the Chip and ?Pin series of books, or whatever they were called, and reverted to an older v boring set, I think it was 10 months in that he started to get it.

He has a degree and a Masters now. But I consider him a very lucky lad, he didn't get the nagging his DDs got at exam time, as I didn't have great expectations of him!

At 16 I got a tutor for extra work at chemistry as he was also pretty lazy, that was enough to galvanise him to work harder himself, and he got into uni fine. He is now annoyed with himself that he didn't work harder then as he just missed a first. The moral of the story is that they all move at their own pace.
PS I regret nattering at my eldest to work harder, she was a young one in the class and I should have left her to it more then she might have had a more positive attitude to school.

theWomenInTheWoods · 24/08/2015 09:03

DS is not doing any other language

There seems to be less focus here in the schools than the uk on pushing ahead with reading - but I know by the time thy leave school the outcome here for children is the same as the UK

However, some children are reading ahead maybe because they are interested themselves or their parents are encouraging it

OP posts:
Skiptonlass · 24/08/2015 09:21

I was reading before the age of two and reading "proper" books by age 4 (walked late and was somewhat physically behind my peers though!)

Dh grew up in Sweden where they're basically left to have fun romping around the forest in kindergarten and didn't even look at a book until seven (things have changed a little now but they still don't start formal schooling till seven here.)

As adults, both of us are complete bookworms, have multiple degrees/PhDs and love reading.

Op, don't worry one bit. The most important thing is to develop a love of reading in your children. Make books and stories something to be enjoyed, together and by themselves and don't worry too much about rigid progress levels. If they love books, they'll read - everyone develops at different rates for different things.

RonaldMcDonald · 24/08/2015 09:25

It all evens out in time
Repeat
It all evens out in time

Girlwhowearsglasses · 24/08/2015 09:34

Yep, in the last school year (year2) my DTs went from reading book with one sentence to chapter books, and one is now attempting a Charles Dickens book (enthusiasm is driving him more than full understanding but that's what learning is right?). They were given extra phonic sessions at school but they enjoyed them.

Don't worry it's one of the most variable ages for development I think because things can change so quickly

Girlwhowearsglasses · 24/08/2015 09:36

Also 'Peter and Jane' books? I learnt on them, and much as I enjoyed them perhaps the world of phonics has moved on since circa 1979? Wondering if they're he same books...

50ShadesofNope · 24/08/2015 09:38

Exactly as PPs have said. Children take to reading at vastly different speeds, just like with everything. As long as he's enjoying reading and progressing at a good pace for him then he'll be fine Smile

Mysillydog · 24/08/2015 09:47

I was chatting to a recently retired teacher who does supply work administering reading tests in her old workplace. She does the phonics tests, but her school actually test reading of all children by getting them to read texts rather than single words. She said there are some very young children with phenomenal reading ability. But they are just reading the words and cannot answer her questions on comprehension. Older "average" children reading the same texts can answer her questions.

Osmiornica · 24/08/2015 10:13

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

sleeponeday · 24/08/2015 14:33

The thing is, there will be outliers in all areas. Most people aren't supermodel material, but they do exist. A child at DS' old school was reading and comprehending Harry Potter when he arrived, at almost 5. He's staggeringly gifted (and, sadly, socially isolated in consequence). I've never known another child like him. But he was there. He's real.

My own DS can read and comprehend Harry Potter. He's on the Able, Gifted & Talented register not only for academic subjects, but for problem-solving ability, and general knowledge. But... there's a very substantial but. He is autistic. He has the extraordinary level of focus that strong special interests in a bright child can offer - that is one of the gifts autism can convey - and his obsession as a preschooler with phonics and lego and maths translated into real facility with numbers, and a love of stories that now means he loves to read so he can escape his reality. Because he does need that escape. He suffers chronic anxiety (common, in autism) and he knows he has difficulties knowing how to interpret the body language and words of others. He knows the world is confusing and he also knows he has far more sensitivity to touch, sound, taste and smell than anyone else, which makes the world a barrage of draining, and sometimes terrifying, sensations. His life is very hard. I am hopeful that his academic talents will go some way to compensating for that, and that he will be employable as a result, but he is at seriously elevated risk of mental health problems. All autistic people are, because we live in a world that has low tolerance for interpersonal diversity, and most autistic people cannot predict or understand the level of hostility or mockery they inevitably will encounter.

I understand that people don't like to think that some kids are just able to do this stuff. I understand that they want to think they don't understand what they read, or the parents are lying. And I am sure in some cases that is true. But surely the reality is that most of us, and most of our children, will be average, and that's okay. That's better than okay; that's lucky. I would swap my little boy's academic abilities for happiness and social ease in a fucking heartbeat, and parents who worry about their children tootling along cheerfully in the middle lane, because some kids are roaring ahead in the fast lane... well, just sometimes, remember that your kids aren't in the slow lane, either. I do, with mine, when I see what other parents with ASD kids handle, and I know I am lucky. But those of you who are luckier still, please try to remember, and appreciate it. Normal is great. Average is splendid. Rejoice in it.

theWomenInTheWoods · 25/08/2015 14:53

sleeponeday. My DS also has autism but unfortunately isn't gifted like your child. He is of above average intelligence but has a poor attention span so he has to work very hard and even at that is still behind the others.

I wish DS was doing better at school as it would be one less thing to worry about and would be a small compensation for the autism

I would prefer DS to have below average intelligence but to have great social skills.

OP posts:
IsItMeOr · 25/08/2015 15:05

Ah Women just saw your last post. Apologies for my obviously tactless comparison with my own DS, as it sounds like they have similar social problems.

I can relate to your desire for DS to be fine in at least some areas, so you have less to worry about.

DS struggles to persist where he doesn't "get" something immediately. So we have to try to find ways to get him to try enough times to get to sufficient competence that doing the thing becomes its own reward.

VirginiaTonic · 25/08/2015 19:01

That's a fantastic postsleep. I agree with every word.

boobubsmum · 25/08/2015 19:16

I was really slow to read as a child, I seem to recall I was still doing 'bob lives in a red house' 'tom lives in a blue house' type stuff when I started in year 4, and then they had to get someone to sit down and dedicate the time to getting me caught up, it's not impacted my ability to read in the long run though.

sleeponeday · 25/08/2015 20:59

Ah, TheWomen I apologise, I didn't realise.

If it's any other compensation, I didn't read myself at all until I was six. I am not gifted, but I was a hard worker, and I went to Oxbridge to read law in the end. My brother isn't gifted but is autistic, my FIL likewise, and both have good jobs in IT.

Being gifted isn't a golden ticket. Being average, calm, and able to work hard is, I think. My DS can only work on subjects that interest him, is very easily distressed and distracted around others, and I am tbh really afraid of how he will fare in secondary school, which will be large with endless transitions. His ability to focus is likely to be non-existent. Sad

sleeponeday · 25/08/2015 21:02

And the play based is massively better for kids with ASD according to all I've read - I changed his school to a village one that tries as hard as they can, within the national curriculum, to stay play based, and as it's a several year class that's easier for longer as it has to suit Reception, Yr 1 and Yr 2.

My son does not respond well to pushing - we live near one of the best grammars in the country, but it would destroy him, I think, with the pressure.

It's hard, isn't it. So fucking hard some days. Flowers

DeliveredByKiki · 25/08/2015 21:06

my DS sounds excatly like your except a year older because we live in America so he started school a year later....he's normal compared to a lot fo his friends so I'm trying to silence the demons in my head...I want him to love reading so am taking it at his pace

sleeponeday · 25/08/2015 21:07

DS struggles to persist where he doesn't "get" something immediately. So we have to try to find ways to get him to try enough times to get to sufficient competence that doing the thing becomes its own reward.

This. So much this. I try to teach him whatever they are about to do next term in a fun and engaging way over the holiday before, so I can spark an interest, and then he feels confident and can listen and participate because, surprise, they are learning all about something that interests him already!

Writing was an absolute bugger to get going, because he hated his own incompetence at it. Now he can write okay (he is almost 7) he doesn't have a loathing for it any more... though he is still not exactly a fan. He has a block on the early stages on learning anything, because he lacks resilience and persistence when things are difficult and/or boring.

Lookingforwardtoholiday · 25/08/2015 21:20

I read too many of these threads when my older two were young and pushed them as far as I could. I can't be bothered with my youngest, he reads ok but nothing special, he's going into year 1 on level 4. I have no idea what level any other child in his class is on and I have no interest in finding out. He writes well and will be able to read properly soon. Eldest is in year 8 and not a clue when his friends could read but they all can.

EllenJanethickerknickers · 26/08/2015 00:31

Funny, Sleeponeday. My DS2 (who I hadn't mentioned above) has ASD. He thrived in a very structured Y1 after struggling tremendously in an unstructured, play-based reception class. Horses for courses. 'If you've met one child with austsm... you've met one child with autism" and all that. Smile

theWoman ASD is a funny old thing. DS2 with ASD read much earlier than his NT(ish) big brother. But while he could read quite well his comprehension was crap. He's 15 now and coping in MS with support. I have learnt to try to celebrate his successes and not to compare him with his NT peers. It's hard and I don't always manage it. I hope your DS gives you lots of joy between the worries and heartaches. Flowers

sleeponeday · 26/08/2015 01:16

His class is structured. It's just play-based, and pitched at a genuinely inclusive/differentiated level, because of the wide range of ages. His old school had considerably more traditional learning time, even in Reception, though they ostensibly masked it by making it about fairy stories blah blah blah - but everything they did had an overt academic learning goal (unless it was being taught dance steps, or circus skills, or a song - all of which they needed for a school play...) because they had a massive focus on retaining their OFSTED Outstanding, and drilled the kids to achieve the necessary results. By the second term, he was being given 6 dull little reading books a week, and expected to write a sentence about each. At five. Meltdown central, so I moved him, and he is now much happier. My understanding was that a lot of autistic children need to feel they have some control over their learning, and a less pushy approach? Though as you say, the classic statement about knowing an autistic person kicks in there. Lord knows I've used it enough with my MIL! So apologies for the sweeping statements.

At his current school, they do a lot of forest school (village school, on an amazing rural site), cooking, craft, scavenger hunts, puzzle-solving, and so on. I suppose I should say creative, rather than play-based, though? They aren't left to do their own thing very often. When they are, it's deemed "free-flow" and it's scheduled into the day. He loves his free-flow time because he can go and sit down with the lego and zone out, though, while it sounds like your own DS wouldn't necessarily enjoy that, so again, I do appreciate your point.

kippersmum · 26/08/2015 01:30

DD1 (August baby) finished R totally unable to read. At the end of Y1 she could read a bit. Y2 it clicked, it finally made sense to her.

Last year, when she was Y4, I had to ask the Y6 teacher for reading suggestions because she was bored with all the "baby books".

Don't give up OP. Your child will get there in their own time.

Scoobydoo8 · 26/08/2015 08:24

But surely the reality is that most of us, and most of our children, will be average, and that's okay

Most won't be average, half will be above average and half below ....... sorry, we can't all be geniuses.

BoskyCat · 26/08/2015 08:33

That's technically true Scooby but it will probably be a bell curve, with most people closely clustered around "average" and only a few at the far higher and lower ends.

lilyb84 · 26/08/2015 09:01

Just to throw something else into the mix here, when I was a teenager I took part in a reading programme with a primary school where we visited children who were lagging behind their peers in terms of reading 'age'. We spent time reading aloud with them every week - letting the child read levels they were comfortable with, books they enjoyed, and generally just giving them a space to enjoy it as a fun activity rather than just school work.

Without exception the children in the programme all advanced at least a year in reading age, if not several. Spending time reading with your children - if you can make the time - is so important and if you're already doing that you're doing the best you can do!

Sounds like your DS is doing great, OP Smile