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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

ABU to expect work to actually do something constructive about PITA colleague?

66 replies

Songofsixpence · 23/08/2015 09:03

Instead of constantly saying "well, you know what he's like"

He's due to retire early next year so they seem to be reluctant to discipline him as "well he won't be here much longer anyway"

Don't want to out myself so don't want to give too many examples, but he's a complete busy body and constantly interferes with things that are nothing to do with him, continually manages to offend other staff, suppliers, etc

He sets stupid tests for people to try and catch them out - last month he changed a load of figures on a spreadsheet that I had done, which could have cost the company a lot of money if I hadn't noticed. We knew full well it was him as our computer system logs which users have accessed/changed stuff.

He's constantly pulling stunts like this, but all we ever get is "oh, you know what he's like, there's no harm done". No, there's no harm done so far but only because the rest of us sort this shit out.

I'm supposed to have a week off next week, but I now have to go in for a couple of hours for a meeting tomorrow morning to sort out something that happened on Friday, due to him interfering yet again.

I'm sick of picking up the pieces behind him. I had to do some serious damage limitation a couple of weeks ago after he offended an important supplier, and tomorrow is going to be a nightmare and could have serious implications if we don't get it sorted.

We have disciplinary procedures, I just want them to bloody follow them

OP posts:

MadamArcatiAgain · 23/08/2015 11:57

how do you know he hasn't been disciplined? This would be a confidential matter.

treaclesoda · 23/08/2015 12:01

Although it is confidential, surely if someone was disciplined, they would most likely stop doing the thing they were disciplined for? Or am I very naive?

MadamArcatiAgain · 23/08/2015 12:02

*1. Raise a complaint that he is bullying and harassing you

Sabotage his figues, then if you get in trouble act daft and say he tests you so you were testing him, you thought that was the practise now? Then if you get in shit for it, raise a bullying complaint against management
Get suppliers to complain about him and threaten that unless he is removed they won't work with you - this can easily backfire if you force the supplier sto say it rather than it being their actual point of view
Complain to the top top brass- owner/board*

The above are all dreadful ideas which will reflect badly on the OP

is a lie
gross misconduct 3)Unprofessional
Not going through the correct channels

I can see why the pragmatic thing is for the company to just sit tight until he retires.

HarshbutfairTess33 · 23/08/2015 12:21

Is there a Trade Union you can go to?

Do any of the things he does have a bearing on Health and Safety?

He is harming your Health and Welfare, So bring the subject up at the Health Safety and Welfare committee meetings.

redshoeblueshoe · 23/08/2015 12:33

Why not put in a grievance about your boss ? You are being bullied and he is doing nothing about it.

elementofsurprise · 23/08/2015 12:34

Why on earth wasn't this man fired when he first did it? Surely it's gross misconduct?

And where can I get a job where I can be so rubbish at it as to actually sabotage the company and not get fired, please?

IAmNotAMindReader · 23/08/2015 13:36

What he has done so far is gross incompetence anyway. Point out in your meeting that this has to be addressed now as though he is coming up to retirement age there is nothing stopping him continuing till he is 90. Given his current actions and escalation do they really see the company being able to survive it for another 30 years?

Sazzle41 · 23/08/2015 14:07

I have worked in some vipers nests of offices but altering figures you sent him, when he must know databases with swipe cards track edits/user smacks of a personality disorder /mental health issue to me: he has lost the plot and they are all letting him, due to his age/iminent retirement. Password everything, can you take screenshots of your system as well as a 'record' too just in case: and blind copy someone sympathetic what you send to him email wise? I

Don't step in and help if he has caused problem - report, report, report, to mangers & HR every single time: and, when you do, you cc in the line above them, that will get a result/get things happening. Get supplier to put it in writing and forward to line above your managers with cost implications as well.

BreakWindandFire · 23/08/2015 14:45

The issue here is this is almost too big and too awful for the company to deal with. I worked in an office (of a FTSE 100 company) which had a similar problem. They had HR procedures to deal with slacking, with computer misuse, with theft, with low level harassment. All the usual HR stuff.

But we had a director who went out of control. Throwing stuff, screaming at staff until they wept, abusing clients, drinking at his desk in full view, beating his head against the wall, trying to punch the MD etc. And they didn't know what to do. Senior management just ignored it completely, even if the Director in question had literally just been prised off their throat!

They were totally paralysed, even though good people were resigning left, right and centre. And they remained paralysed even after one of our rivals rang us out of courtesy to warn us that the Director was trying to tout confidential company information around rival firms.

They just didn't know how to deal with wonton destruction and malice caused by a very senior person, when all the HR procedures were about dealing with low level staff just being a bit crap. They also feared being sued, by someone hell bent on damaging the company, thinking it would cost them a lot to defend. Ignoring the fact they were losing staff, productivity and client goodwill by not acting! This Director was like the banks in 2008 - too big to fail!

The fact that some of your junior staff are facing disciplinary action for something this man did is telling. I can understand why you need to go in during your holiday to defend them.

But apart from this you need to do what this man's team do and work to rule. Tell your staff that you will have their back if he blames them for something, but from now on don't correct his sabotage. Yes, it will be hell with 50,000 widgets turn up rather than 50 as he's deliberately screwed up the order. And yes if he abuses a supplier who supplies stuff only your team use, then you won't be able to work without it. So you can't work. That is not your problem.

Stop making it your problem to fix and make it your bosses. Short term pain but long term gain.

AyeAmarok · 23/08/2015 14:46

Can you maybe raise it as a "I think he's going senile" thingand have management put him on restricted duties?

HarshbutfairTess33 · 23/08/2015 15:05

Send him on Gardening Leave.

EBearhug · 23/08/2015 15:22

Drinking at work is against our CoC. Attempting to assault staff is very definitely against the CoC. I think... hope... with us, they would be suspended while investigations went on, and I would expect them to go through the full disciplinary procedure, possibly resulting in termination of employment, but probably also being sent in the direction of the employee assistance programme and its counselling and support services.

I know this doesn't help you, as clearly none of that sort of thing is happening. I'm just naively surprised it's not like that in other places.

Why would your staff be disciplined for his mistakes? Other than the hassle of having 50 000 widgets and so on, what would be the fallout of you all refusing to fix his errors? I think maybe this is what needs to happen - until it's actually costing the company money, rather than just theoretically what would have happened if others hadn't sorted it out - they aren't going to take any notice.

sherbetpips · 23/08/2015 15:28

HR can't do anything, his line manager has to manage him through his performance review. If he continues to cause problems and these are properly recorded as incidents on his personnel file then his manager can move for a dismissal and HR will advise. Basically if his manager has no balls then nothing will happen. It is not your job to sort him out.

MadamArcatiAgain · 23/08/2015 15:34

Why can't they just change his computer permissions.i am struggling to imagine what possible motivation he has for changing your spreadsheets especially when he is retiring in a few months.

BreakWindandFire · 23/08/2015 15:43

Changing permissions would tackle the symptom not the cause. And I suspect that he'd move onto something else, leaving the OP playing whack-a-mole and waiting for the next disaster.

OutToGetYou · 23/08/2015 15:56

You can't just put people on gardening leave. (and why the fuck should they pay him to stay away, they should sack him - which no, will not have a 'massive effect on his pension').

HR policies in my very long experience of being in HR always cover violence, assault, swearing etc in the workplace. That director had something else, he had top-cover, or he knew where the bodies were buried. But if someone assaulted me at work I wouldn't give a stuff about HR policies, I'd make a police complaint.

The manager should not be managing this through 'performance review', which happens twice a year in moist places, but by taking action on issues as they arise. If he does not then people it affects should bring a formal grievance and they have a right to have that investigated.

Disciplinary is not the only outcome of a successful grievance, there are plenty of things - mediation, as pp said putting him on some restricted duties, coaching, counselling, informal warning, training, a mentor for him to refer his actions to, demotion, etc.

There is plenty the employer could be doing.

HarshbutfairTess33 · 23/08/2015 16:27

Is this a Private sector company?

Sazzle41 · 23/08/2015 16:57

It just occurred to me, is he terrified of retiring and trying to say look, everyone else is crap, you NEED me to stay? Its either that or an out of control need to be 'superior'/noticed as such and therefore in control. He needs another warning, the line of management above currently paralysed ones (& HR) need to be made aware of whole shebang. Thats only way things will move.

Maybe it is as other posters said, personality disorder or possible early onset dementia: IME it does sometimes manifest first in extreme paranoia and odd behaviour ... can HR suggest he does counselling they pay for in the guise of 'to prepare for retirement' ? Large corporates and smaller ones lately often offer 6 sessions free to employees too.

HarshbutfairTess33 · 23/08/2015 17:00

That's it. Send him on a pre-retirement course.

poorbuthappy · 23/08/2015 17:08

I have 1 of these in my organisation.
Problem with us is that there is a specific type of work that he and only he does so management (apart from me) are running scared because if he throws a strop and refuses to work (oh yes that is how he deals with it...) it will immediately impact on our company's output.

I am tearing my hair out with his line manager (same level as me) plus the 2 directors who simply will not deal. We spend many meetings dealing with his sabotage and hissy fits yet he is never dealt with. I've started walking out of meetings because I will sit round a table with 7 other grown ups who simply bitch about him rather than dealing.
I am waiting for a massive turn around in cash flow (imminent) so we can recruit A N Other in the same role and wait for him to fuck off...

poorbuthappy · 23/08/2015 17:09

Proof read....will not sit round a table...

stayanotherday · 23/08/2015 17:15

I've had similar to this and stopped papering over the cracks so the consequences would show. Doing otherwise is enabling as management know somebody else will deal with it for them. Then when it hits the fan and the panic sets in it's "Well, you know the situation" and let them deal with it. They then are forced. I took a step back and watched the fallout.

OutToGetYou · 23/08/2015 17:18

"It just occurred to me, is he terrified of retiring and trying to say look, everyone else is crap, you NEED me to stay?"

Well, if that is the case, he only needs to, you know, NOT retire. No-one is nor can make him.

"Maybe it is as other posters said, personality disorder or possible early onset dementia:"

It's irrelevant to the op though, isn't it? If HR do their duty and investigate and find something like that suggested it is then up to them to deal with it, whether with occupational health or employee counselling support etc. But what the OP needs is for them to at least take that first step in investigating.

StealthPolarBear · 23/08/2015 21:37

Completely off topic but I thought age discrimination in employment terms went up to a maximum age. So they could force his retirement.
Could have changed but I know back in 2010 when we were facing redundancies my 67 year old boss was in a very different position from the rest of us.

ilovesooty · 23/08/2015 21:54

You certainly can't force people to retire on age grounds now. The Equality Act 2010 made age a protected characteristic.

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