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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to be pissed off at the tube drivers for going on strike....

106 replies

ihateminecraft · 22/08/2015 23:49

I've got the week off and have planned special things for the dcs including a theatre trip (tickets booked and paid for months ago) and another day out in London with friends, both of these things fall on the worst days of the strike.

Too pissed off for words........

OP posts:
ThisFenceIsComfy · 24/08/2015 10:39

Ah that's a wonderfully spun press release.

Also dated from the 3rd August and talks have moved on.

A 36hr, 4 day week roster was one of a variety of rosters to come out of a joint working party. It was rejected and is not a key sticking point of the dispute.

A 32 hour week has been put forward for about a decade. It would have to be self-financing and again, is not part of any sticking point that would resolve the talks.

To my knowledge the key points are:

No extra weekend working.

No extra nights imposed on staff. Note the word imposed. Lots of scope for voluntary and specifically recruited night roles.

That's really it.

Trouble is if you form your opinion solely from the Standard and TfL press releases, you are only hearing one side of the story.

maybebabybee · 24/08/2015 10:39

I don't think strike action is justified. I didn't say they shouldn't speak out.

CheersMedea · 24/08/2015 10:39

Suggestions

  • many hotels have a 24 hr cancellation policy so it's not too late to try to change your hotel to some where closer to walking distance from your hotel.
  • don't rule out walking and take some comfy walking shoes for all the
family.
  • set up an Addison Lee account if you can afford it and pre-book cars 24 hrs in advance. You will probably still have to wait but you will get transport eventually.
  • keep an eye out for those hideous pedalo Covent Garden bikes if you don't object to them in principle and think they are the devil
ihatethecold · 24/08/2015 10:42

buggerlumps try being married to a police officer.
You have no idea!

MackerelOfFact · 24/08/2015 10:45

I'm hacked off about the strikes. I don't really care if it's the unions or TFL who are to blame, it's for them to sort out between themselves, I'm just sick to death of being caught in the crossfire.

If the two strikes go ahead this week, that will be four strikes (affecting eight days' travel) in less than two months. I started a new job at the beginning of July and live/work on the Central Line, so it's had a massive impact, and necessitated ridiculous commutes using 3-4 methods of transport (including a long walk) taking up to two hours longer than usual each way.

Colleagues have been forced to use annual leave if they can't get in. Others have had to fork out for taxis or hotels, or lose pay. These are people who have no choice about the strikes, no power to influence any outcome, but who are seeing a not insignificant impact on their own work/life balance, finances and career. It's a joke that Londoners and visitors are used as pawns in their stupid games, and they are the ones who ultimately lose out either way (with fare rises or service disruption).

Binkybix · 24/08/2015 10:46

I've not been able to find any information (bar biased press releases from both sides) on what is actually on the table. Does anyone have any links?

It is possible to support the principle of unions and the right to strike without supporting the reasons for each and every individual strike btw!

BuggerLumpsAnnoyed · 24/08/2015 10:54

2 of my best friends are police officers so I do have some idea and it is unreasonable the conditions that this government has enforced on them. But this isn't about competitive misery.

ThisFenceIsComfy · 24/08/2015 10:55

There are talks today and further consultation and I would expect a decision to be taken dependant on the outcomes of those meetings.

Binky it's hard to find links really. I'll have a look.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 24/08/2015 10:56

It is possible to support the principle of unions and the right to strike without supporting the reasons for each and every individual strike

Very well said Smile

Of course it might be possible to solve all this with open recruitment, specifically of night staff at a new, agreed rate - I doubt they'd go short of applicants

But the unions have made quite sure that can't be done, haven't they?? Hmm

ThisFenceIsComfy · 24/08/2015 11:00

Actually Puzzled I think the unions are in favour of a specific recruitment campaign for night tube staff. I don't know why you think otherwise.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 24/08/2015 11:07

I was referring to open recruitment, ThisFence. I'll gladly take it back if I'm wrong, but isn't it still the case that drivers can only be recruited from among current staff?

I also realise this isn't just about the drivers, but given the problems which the unions' extremely restrictive practice have already caused, it might be useful to at least start somewhere ...

ThisFenceIsComfy · 24/08/2015 11:12

Oh I see, you meant direct recruitment. I don't believe that management have offered or even discussed that for drivers. They are not happy about finding night drivers internally, let alone externally.

Yes, drivers are recruited from internal staff and have been for a very very long time.

Which extremely restrictive practices are you referring to?

ThisFenceIsComfy · 24/08/2015 11:13

But you are right, there are more issues here than just the drivers.

Binkybix · 24/08/2015 11:17

Thanks thisfence! Seems crazy that amongst all of this it's difficult to find out what's actually going on!

ThisFenceIsComfy · 24/08/2015 11:18

Although to be fair, there have been a very few direct campaigns and the unions have not stopped them.

ThisFenceIsComfy · 24/08/2015 11:27

Been having a look for links but it's hard to find some that aren't written with a bias.

If something gets published today with a real update on talks, I'll link it.

ThisFenceIsComfy · 24/08/2015 11:29

Oh and just for clarity, there has been an open and fairly long recruitment campaign for night tube station staff.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 24/08/2015 11:48

TheFence the fact that drivers, at least, have only been recruited internally for "a very, very long time" doesn't make it right. Many feel the real reason for this is to protect the unions' stranglehold, and it's an example of the restrictive practices I mentioned. It's also hard to avoid believing that the current drivers' stance of "the strike's nothing to do with us, guv" is just a carefully calculated attempt to let someone else take the flak for a while, knowing as they surely must that sympathy for their case is starting to run out

Excellent comment here from Gady Hinsliff in The Guardian:

An effective defence of the right to strike now must include recognising when that right is being abused, to the point of potentially jeopardising other people’s rights in future. Or to put it another way: strikers can only expect solidarity from the millions still at work if they remember to show some solidarity in return

ThisFenceIsComfy · 24/08/2015 11:55

www.lbc.co.uk/tube-strikes-are-working-insists-union-chief-115116

Listen to the actual interview.

ThisFenceIsComfy · 24/08/2015 12:01

Open recruitment to drivers is not something the unions can influence though.

Tfl can recruit how they like. And indeed they do.

The cost involved in the training and turnover of direct driver recruits is something that puts Tfl off.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 24/08/2015 12:25

Open recruitment to drivers is not something the unions can influence though

Maybe, maybe not - but it's not hard to imagine the chaos the unions would unleash if something like this was attempted, threatening their grip on everyone's throats

Googling among all the noise and fury, I've just learned that in New York and San Francisco the metro systems have been designated "essential services" and the right to strike removed. This isn't something I'm very happy with - at least not in principle - but I can't help wondering if, one day, it will have to come in London too

ThisFenceIsComfy · 24/08/2015 12:28

But there have been direct campaigns Puzzled, just not very many. I did say that up thread.

designedbynature · 24/08/2015 12:41

Could London Underground not make changes to current work patterns optional and have an open recruitment policy? Recruit new people to work weekends etc?

Something like;

Option 1, Stick to your current work pattern, no extra pay
Option 2, Adopt new pattern and get extra money

Use the money not paid to workers for recruiting new drivers.
The strike will just cause misery, the weather forecast is shit for the next few days too.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 24/08/2015 13:06

Works for me, designed Wink but again, I can't see the unions wearing it. I realise I could be wrong, but it really is hard to avoid the impression that they simply want what amounts to a closed shop and no challenge at all to their position

Maybe the right to strike will have to be removed from this sector - I don't know - but if it is, I wonder if they'll acknowledge the part their own militancy played in the issue?

ThisFenceIsComfy · 24/08/2015 13:09

The trains union put forward the idea of two separate rosters a long time ago at the beginning of consultation. One including the extra nights and one not. The extra nights would attract a slightly higher pay. This was rejected by LU.

Now I believe they are looking at recruiting for night tube drivers but unfortunately it has all been left too late for the introduction of night tube on the 12th September.