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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

to think this is selfish behaviour?

51 replies

cabbageleaf · 10/08/2015 08:32

DP is from Spain, and in July we spent ten days at his parents, our first stay there since DS was born in October. Of course, his parents' daily routine is completely different from ours - they have dinner at 9.30 pm at the earliest. This meant we were never in bed before 11 pm. Now, DS is in bed at 7 pm and wakes at 5.15-5.30 am, and in July he woke at least four times a night because he was teething. We were absolutely knackered with the lack of sleep and told ILs more than once that we usually go to bed at 9.30 pm, otherwise we are just exhausted the next day. They made absolutely no effort to have dinner earlier, not even by half an hour, instead telling us "DS is on holiday too, put him to bed later". I am aware that this is a cultural thing and that Spanish babies are put to bed much later, but AIBU to think it is pretty selfish to expect a baby to change its routine during a ten-day holiday?

OP posts:

HarrietSchulenberg · 10/08/2015 14:17

Seeing as babies can't actually tell the time I think I've just adjusted the timings of our routine so ds went to bed later and got up later. Or just let him sleep when he was tired rather than going through a whole bedtime routine shennanegins.

At least, that's what I would have done with dses 2 and 3. PFB ds1 was a different matter .

I am a night owl, though, so a Spanish routine would work v well for me.

DJThreeDog · 10/08/2015 14:23

Honestly, I think on holiday and with a ten month old you could have tried to work into their routine. It's not like you had school to get your DS up for or you and DH up for work.

Original poster

cabbageleaf · 11/08/2015 08:17

We didn't get the chance for a siesta because DS's daytime sleep was abysmal, probably because there were a million and one people coming to see him every day (as I said, first visit to Spanish side of the family). ILs both work during the day so not much babysitting. And of course we couldn't leave DS with friends and relatives he's never seen before.
Making our own meal, staying in a hotel etc. might be acceptable to a British family, but DP's family are average Spaniards and they would be very, very offended.
I have been thinking a lot about this because we are going to Spain again in October so we're going to have the same problem, but hopefully minus the teething so sleep might be better in general.
I cannot decide for myself if ILs are being selfish or if we should just have thrown DS's routine out of the window. But tbh he was so exhausted by 6 pm due to lack of sleep during the day that I couldn't have faced keeping him awake. I am surprised some people can just shift their baby's routine about, DS's bedtime is not something I chose, he is tired by 7 pm and I don't really see how can I ignore that. If we'd been there for four weeks, fair enough, but ten days seems too short to change a routine, especially for a cranky, teething baby. I also found it pretty weird that MIL wanted to keep DS awake when he was clearly tired and unhappy.
I admit though that the sleep deprivation definitely played a major part in our inflexibility, we were just too tired to think straight.

OP posts:

whois · 11/08/2015 08:24

OP is getting a hard time I think. She wasn't asking to eat at 7, but half an hour earlier at 9!

You know the magic 7pm babies? Well I was one. And as a small child probably up to age 7 or 8ish I really really could not stay up past 7.30ish. Used to drive my parents insane, on holiday, eating out, with friends, all the other children running around playing and my parents had a sleeping child lying out behind them on their seats!

bookbag40 · 11/08/2015 08:41

I feel for you op if you have a routiney baby then it's very hard to adjust. Some posters don't seem to understand that not all babies will just take a siesta when you want them too.

Personally I don't think it unreasonable to expect your in laws to make a few reasonable adjustments for their own son and dil
Bringing dinner forward an hour is not the end of the world or they could have just have let you do their own.
I think they were selfish and unwelcoming

bookbag40 · 11/08/2015 08:45

Can your DH not just say something to them. You are scared of offending them but they clearly don't care enough about you to make a small change!
Offend away I say!

TeenageMutantNinjaTurtle · 11/08/2015 08:47

I would shift the routine by an hour, so in line with the time zone difference. that shouldn't impact your routine at home. So instead of bed at 7, bed at 8 (which is 7pm at home anyway). All being well he should then sleep an hour later in the morning as you aren't actually changing anything

I would also pack snacks in my luggage. I would go to bed at whatever time I wanted pleading utter exhaustion, jet lag, headache whatever, I'd even cry if I thought it would be less offensive to in laws. Then I'd eat a snack and go to sleep. This is how I handle my overbearing MIL when we stay with them!

Original poster

cabbageleaf · 11/08/2015 08:51

whois, precisely, 9 pm would have been better than nothing... And if only DS slept in the pram, but of course he won't!!

bookbag40, if things go the same way in October we'll probably end up offending them - we both can't face another shitty holiday like the one we had in July.

OP posts:

Theycallmemellowjello · 11/08/2015 08:59

I think yabu. What's the point in visiting if you can't sit down and have a meal together every night? Don't understand what is so special about the sleep between the hours of 9.30 and 11 as opposed to an afternoon nap. Asking a Spanish person to have dinner at 7 is like asking an English host to cook dinner for 4 pm every night for the duration of the visit - not reasonable as hosts are not hungry then and it messes up their afternoon and leaves them nothing to do in the evening.

petalunicorn · 11/08/2015 09:10

If he wasn't sleeping in the day I would suspect that he was waking at night due to overtiredness, not teething.

TeenageMutantNinjaTurtle has excellent advice about the time change.

Given what you did didn't work in July I'd approach October totally differently and have a go at a different routine for 10 days. You say that you are surprised that parents can change routine so easily. I can't talk for others but for me I could do it and it might have looked easy but it wasn't as simple as just put them to bed later, I prepared for it, so for instance, if I wanted them to stay up later they would have a nap after lunch (NO sleep in the morning if you are still doing that), then a big snack at four and then another sleep, even if I needed to get the four oclock sleep by driving/rocking/pram/dummy/bf (whatever works), then I would wake them by six at the latest, then bed at 11. You have to manipulate them into what you want with planning. If he is being a pain leading up to 11 and PILS are typical Spaniards then they will take their turn in occupying/soothing him.

Do you want him to have a 5.30am start usually? I can't tell from your OP. If you don't, this is a good opportunity to change that.

BestZebbie · 11/08/2015 09:32

"DS is in bed at 7 pm and wakes at 5.15-5.30 am, and in July he woke at least four times a night because he was teething. We were absolutely knackered with the lack of sleep and told ILs more than once that we usually go to bed at 9.30 pm, otherwise we are just exhausted the next day."

Could you slide DS bedtime closer to 9pm anyway, as then he might sleep until 7 or 8am and you wouldn't have to go to bed so early yourselves!

NotYouNaanBread · 11/08/2015 09:37

I would have put the baby to bed later. Our children are in bed by 7pm in the UK, and here in Greece we don't put them down til 10pm or so, and we are having a much better time for it. It helps that the small one is napping during the day again here (in the car mostly).

Granted, they're older, but the later dinner time in Spain is there for a reason, and it's an incredibly child-centred society there (sweeping generalisation alert!) so I would have gone along with the local routine and enjoyed myself, rather than sticking rigidly to my UK routine and complaining about selfish IL's for weeks after.

I was BIG into routine when my 2 were babies, but the world doesn't revolve around you, esp. when you're on holiday.

RealityCheque · 11/08/2015 09:47

YABU

When in Rome...

DisappointedOne · 11/08/2015 10:20

You didn't choose 7pm, OP?

"It took a while for him to settle for an earlier bedtime - it moved forward gradually and he was six months old before we could even think of putting him to bed at 7 pm. I haven't seen much improvement in his sleep"

(Less than 3 weeks ago.)

DisappointedOne · 11/08/2015 10:21

9 pm would have been better than nothing... And if only DS slept in the pram, but of course he won't!!

Because you've conditioned him to nap in a bouncy chair or his cot.

chrome100 · 11/08/2015 10:23

If I were you I'd just nap in the afternoon if you're on holiday. It might be nice not to have to go to bed and eat so early if you don't have work.

Hygellig · 11/08/2015 10:31

I can sympathise, as I would definitely need an earlier dinner and an early night if I had to get up at that time in the morning! They probably could have compromised on a slightly earlier dinner, say 8.30 or 9pm. I think I would have been inclined to have had a siesta after lunchtime in the heat.

Hygellig · 11/08/2015 10:34

Sorry, I just read your earlier post OP that said you couldn't easily have a siesta. Is there any way you could take it in turns with your DP to have a rest in the day?

CaspoFungin · 11/08/2015 10:43

If your parents in law were at work in the day why couldn't you nap?

Jengnr · 11/08/2015 12:24

Why don't you feed the little 'un at their normal time and put them to bed at their normal time and you and his Dad tag team each other to catch up sleep? So one of you gets up with him then when the other gets up the first one goes and gets a couple of hours kip. If you're on holiday that should be easy enough to do, won't disrupt the baby and means you can have some adult time in the evenings.

That's what me and my husband do at weekends, works well for us.

diddl · 11/08/2015 13:47

Depending on what time they get in from work I would have thought that they could have brought the evening meal forward.

Sounds awful to me eating that late!

Nearly bed time!

Especially if you are getting up early & not having a siesta!

How on earth do ILs do it with working all day?

I suppose that thy wanted GC to stay up later to see him!

Yokohamajojo · 11/08/2015 13:56

Couldn't you have given DS his dinner earlier and put him to bed? Yes it's totally different in Spain but that is just the way they're doing it and it would be totally weird for them to have dinner at 7pm all of them just to suit your DS. It obviously takes a few days to get adjusted.

KatieLatie · 11/08/2015 14:40

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ at the poster's request.

diddl · 11/08/2015 14:44

I would have tried keeping him up longer, but if it doesn't work, it doesn't!

Well, if staying with them doesn't work then they'll have to be offended!

RonaldosAbs · 11/08/2015 15:19

Honestly I don't think YABthatU.

I'm part middle eastern, my children all born and raised here in the UK, DH is Irish. When they were little, and we went to visit, my family were very accommodating, we made it work, both compromised on the differences.

My family and I are good at playing the long game, obviously Middle Eastern and Western cultures are very different, as are Spanish/English, successfully raising a multi cultural child means everyone making compromises. If anyone tries to force "their way" it's going to get difficult. You could have been a little more flexible sure, but so could they.

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