Night at the Museum - is this a bit off?

[MegMogandOwlToo]

I'm looking into organising a night at the science museum for a community group, and I'm looking at the adult ratios required.

The website states that women can sleep in either the boys or girls section, but men can only sleep in the boys section. Surely this is sexist? I don't understand why they don't just say that women must supervise the girls and men must supervise the boys?

Link here: www.sciencemuseum.org.uk/visitmuseum/science_night/science_night_faqs.aspx

I think there were ideas around

More women are supervising than men
So any men there are, should be supervising the boys
If you said women couldn't supervise the boys, either no boys could go, or no trips would go ahead
So that it wasn't "unfair" so much as "pragmatic" that if you've got a bloke he should look after the boys and the women look after the girls

And there was something about an assumption that most children have a female carer at home and both boys and girls are used to being "looked after" by a woman, but that not so many children would be used to getting undressed etc in front of a man esp one they didn't know
There was some stats as well

Then there were a lot of other ideas around it's sexist and the men should be looking after the girls

I'll have a look

schnooschnoo what age children are you talking about with everyone getting undressed together?

here is the swimming changing thread

If they are all in the same gallery anyway I assume they are not getting undressed. What difference does it make which side of the gallery they are in (unless it's massive)!!!

The majority of sex offenders being male, does not equate to mosten being sex offenders.

Then people wonder when men don't want to be as hand on.

And is sexist more of a crime in your book than child abuse? given that statistically there are more male than women offenders?
Wouldn't surprise me on here tbh . Athough it is quite sickening the way that some consider that discrimination of any sort must always be the overruling factor!

It's possible there is more to it as well.

For example, women of certain religions might not be able to spend the night in a room with men.

I don't think it is sexist as much as trying to be considerate - but maybe you should suggest a unisex night, where the sleeping arrangements are mixed, in order to accommodate, for example, single fathers and families that would like to go together but all children are female.

I think the choice would be good.

I would imagine that if there were similar number of male and female supervisors, the rule would be women with the girls and men with the boys.

I don't think there's any need to speculate about whether the museum thinks all men are sex offenders with an interest in children (!) when from a pragmatic perspective, any other arrangement will include either boys not being allowed to come on trips, or all trips stopping full stop.

Unless there is a view that any male supervisors should be in with the girls and female ones in with the boys, as some kind of point of principle? I think most people would think this is odd, it's standard to segregate along sex lines where sleeping / undressing is involved.

Smoorkins it says families can stay in mixed groups, the separation is there for non family groups eg school groups.

""What are the sleeping arrangements?
Your group will remain together for the whole event and will sleep in the same gallery, but there are different arrangements for schools and families:

Families: all sleep together in the ‘Family Zone’
Schools: boys and girls have separate sleeping areas. Female adults may sleep in either area, however male adults may only sleep on the male side of the gallery."

I don't think it's religious reasons as it sounds like they sleep in same room anyway.

Families sleep together so single parent issue shouldn't be a problem.

OK, my single parent comment was because someone else mentioned a single father earlier in the thread.

I think that it's fairly sensible, it's highly unlikely that a mixed group will have more male adults present than female, but it is likely that there will be more female adults than male.

Can't get too worked up about it to be honest.

I don't really understand it. Yes, men are statistically more likely to be abusers, but I believe they're just as likely to abuse boys as girls. So whilst this might protect the girls, it leaves boys at risk of these hypothetical predators?

Given that there is a large group of people there, I suspect that the likelihood of any wrong-doing is very low. A child just needs to shout out and there will be plenty of other adults there to come to his aid.

This is to do with pragmatism and social norms about single sex in certain situations, rather than the museum having decided that men are highly likely to be child molesters but as long as the only molest boys then that's fine

I mean, it's highly likely.

If anyone wants to know whether this decision is to do with pragmatism + social norms, or to do with suspicions about men, I suppose they can call the museum and ask.

Are there people who, in a group of boys and girls, with one male supervisor and 3 women, would insist that the man looks after the girls and the woman the boys, despite the fact that depending on the ages of the children this will possibly make them more uncomfortable?

I can honestly say that, as a teacher, I doubt any of my male colleagues would be willing to sleep in the girls' area, for fear of accusations.

I've worked with two young male teachers over the years who did turn out to have an inappropriate interest in teenagers (both discovered & dismissed, one of them prosecuted) & their actions have cast a long shadow over an entire teaching staff .

It's just the norm on trips that female staff go into male sleeping areas, no problem (eg. recently I had to check on a 12yo lad at intervals throughout the night because he has a health condition that needs monitoring), but no male member of staff would dream of entering a girls' room without a female colleague. It's so ingrained in the culture that it's never even discussed, we just get on with it.

Also, as pointed out upthread, male volunteers are harder to come by. I aim for quarter to a third male staff if I'm running a trip, & I have to twist some arms.

Family excursion is entirely different; seems sensible that they have a family section.