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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Not to understand why anyone could choose to have those ugly looking dogs?

385 replies

meadowquark · 28/06/2015 17:52

I may be wrong but it seems that about 50% dog owners in my area have those staffie or staffie type dogs (sorry I cannot distinguish between them), looking aggressive, ugly (sorry) and always pulling the owner on the lead. I honestly don't understand why people choose to have these dogs. When I was growing up, people had cockerspaniels, labradors, daschunds, poodles, terriers etc. Is this a new fashion? Safety? Knife alternative?

I am sure they are friendly and trainable but if I hear a bad story of one dog mauling another dog, it is very often that type of dog.

I am just wondering why wouldn't people keep sweeter looking dogs instead.

Sorry I don't meant to offend any dog owners - I just would like to understand why?

OP posts:
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flanjabelle · 29/06/2015 14:17

well said skinhead.

flanjabelle · 29/06/2015 14:24

oh and this is my killer. she was obviously worn out from all the vicious attacking she had been doing. the blanket isn't really there, as killer dogs are far too evil to be snuggled up in a blanky.

Not to understand why anyone could choose to have those ugly looking dogs?
meadowquark · 29/06/2015 14:29

No dog owner will say that their dog is aggresive or unfriendly. Their's is always the most sweet dog in the world. Then the mauling happens "out of nowhere". How many stories I have heard about this!

OP posts:
SaucyJack · 29/06/2015 14:31

Completely agree Meadow, but that's hardly a Staffie specific issue.

ADishBestEatenCold · 29/06/2015 14:42

Hugely late to this thread, but just had to drop in and say that I loved sanquhar 's post (page 1 Sun 28-Jun-15 18:00:17). She summed up the staffy so well.

Such a shame that she does not own a dog and "probably never will"!

Grin
Godstopper · 29/06/2015 14:49

The "mauling that happens out of nowhere" is a result of dog owners not understanding the subtle signs that, when taken together, add up to a dog stating that they are uncomfortable. When that goes on for a lengthy period of time and the dog snaps, it is then taken to be unexpected. But it rarely is (knowing about the 'ladder of aggression' is helpful for all dog owners).

And more of Matilda. One of them passing the KC Good Citizen Scheme (she continues to go to an intermediate level obedience class).

Not to understand why anyone could choose to have those ugly looking dogs?
Not to understand why anyone could choose to have those ugly looking dogs?
Not to understand why anyone could choose to have those ugly looking dogs?
tabulahrasa · 29/06/2015 14:53

Maulings do not happen out of nowhere.

Serious dog attacks are rare and have a lot of common factors, the dog usually has a history of neglect or mistreatment, they often have a reported history of behavioural issues as well, the person attacked doesn't usually live with them and the dog's owner is not present.

One off bites are more common and they're the ones that supposedly come out of nowhere, but they don't, the dog had been trying to communicate it's unhappiness at a certain thing for a long time and has been ignored and feels the need to then escalate its behaviour.

My dog has issues - you'd be amazed at how many people try to touch him despite the appeasing behaviours he gives off to keep them away.

SqueezyCheeseWeasel · 29/06/2015 14:58

She's a cutie, godstopper

SaskiaRembrandtWasFramed · 29/06/2015 15:05

That's it, one off bites don't really happen. It's either the case that the dog has been ill treated and badly trained, or that it is well looked after but by people who don't understand how dogs think generally or the needs of the specific dog they own. The occasions when a dog does 'suddenly' snap are usually preceded by warning signals which were ignored over and over again.

I think this is the case particularly with children. I used to have a lovely, fluffy, grey lurcher. As it happened she was very good with children and didn't mind being stroked when we were out and about, but other people didn't know that, so it astonished me how many parents would let small children run up and stroke the 'lovely, cuddly doggy', without asking if she would be okay with that. In those circumstances I can see how biting happens.

FilbertSnood · 29/06/2015 15:07

One of my dogs has been bitten four times in his 8.5 yrs, once by a staffie (can still see scar), once by a shar pei, once by a staffie x mastiff (who also bit my other dog on the same day) and the worst, recently as we are getting the stitches out today, by a Weimaraner.

We used to live somewhere where most dogs were staffies, so it stands to reason that it's likely to have some good and some bad as with any breed.

I can usually tell from the shape of the dog and body language very quickly what kind of staffie it is! The aggressive ones always seem to be taller and leaner?! Maybe that's coincidence.

I love all dogs. Just not the ones that bite mine.

DressingGownFrown · 29/06/2015 15:07

I have a little poodle and currently no children. I know when I have children I will have to be so careful with him around them - more so than you would normally. Whereas my Grandparents had a staffie and he was lovely around us all as kids and (obviously not to stupid levels) was about as trustworthy around kids as a dog can get. He is the dog that I've been least scared around in my life, including my own and my parents dogs which consist of a small fluffy and a lab - not that I'm scared of dogs.

Mrsjayy · 29/06/2015 15:40

My dog (not a staffie) is a bit stand offish and is choosy who or what he is friendly with and i wouldnt trust him to play with small children not for a second but I dont have small children so he has space.

GoodbyeToAllOfThat · 29/06/2015 15:54

I've said this on here before, but in the last few years every Staffie I've encountered has been accompanied by an elderly person. The yoheads who want a penis extension seem to have gravitated towards huskies.

I can't remember the last husky I saw in London. I do not like them, my sister had one. The yoheads I see have pitbull type dogs.

I can't find any stats for the UK, but in the US it seems that pitbulls and rotweilers together account for 2/3 of dog attacks in some states (couldn't find any national figures).

sparechange · 29/06/2015 16:05

I can usually tell from the shape of the dog and body language very quickly what kind of staffie it is! The aggressive ones always seem to be taller and leaner?! Maybe that's coincidence.

Not coincidence... The tall, lean ones (opposed to the short stocky ones) are ones that are bred to look like banned Pit Bulls, often by breeding bit of pit or mastiff in there. I think they are advertised online as 'american staffs' or 'irish staffs' as the code for those who want those sorts of dogs. And it stands to reason that those will be the owners who are less likely to properly socailise them as puppies, and train them and exercise them - all potential red flags for problems later on.

The smiley faced proper staffies shouldn't be confused with these mixed breeds. Nor should someone who wants a staffie as a pet be confused with someone who is taking advantage of the vagueness of a law to buy something that is as near as dammit a banned breed.

MidniteScribbler · 29/06/2015 16:09

This is another example of MN existing in a parallel universe. I don't know anyone who owns a pit bull/staffy type dog or would be entirely comfortable with their kids being around them, even though there are certainly quite a lot of them about these days.

I am comfortable with certain dogs being around DS. I am uncomfortable about certain other dogs being around DS. The ones I am comfortable with are the dogs that I know have been socialised and trained. The dogs I am uncomfortable around are the ones that have not been socialised and trained. This is irrespective of breed, age or sex. A well trained and socialised dog should be able to be around children. A poorly trained and unsocialised dog is a risk being around children. And that has nothing to do with breed.

I have a friend with staffies. Her young child has grown up with them, and the child competes with the dog in competitions. I've also run with this dog in a teams event and he's an entire (not desexed) male, I have never seen him even glance sideways at another dog, and I am quite comfortable running my own dogs with him and I've seen him with the child running him and he's amazing with her. I have no hesitation allowing my son to interact with this dog.

I know this dog, I know what he is like, and I will interact with him, and allow my son to do so. That doesn't mean that I allow my son to run up to a strange dog in the street. I'm teaching my son to ignore dogs in the street, or ask for permission to pat them. He is 3 1/2, but he knows already not to touch a dog unless the owner says it is alright, and this is a child that is surrounded by dogs.

No dog owner will say that their dog is aggresive or unfriendly. Their's is always the most sweet dog in the world. Then the mauling happens "out of nowhere".

Actually, the sensible dog owners will know their dog. My male is not good with other males if they come in to my yard due to an attack in his youth, so I don't let him run him with other males at home (he's fine when he's at shows or events when it's not in his backyard). He's not looking to fight, but he gets very defensive when any of the girls are with us. So I don't put him in the situation where he could feel he needs to defend himself against another dog. But I will allow this dog to play with my son because he is fantastic with him and supervised play is a great time for both of them.

There is a big difference between human aggression and dog aggression. Dogs that are not good around other dogs aren't unusual, and it is actually fairly easily managed. Dogs that are human aggressive are a different issue and need specialised behaviouralist intervention. It is incredibly rare to find a dog that is dog AND human aggressive, and that would normally be a dog who has severe behavioural issues, and should definitely not be out in public until those issues have been addressed.

Most of the 'out of nowhere' maulings are actually due to the behaviour of the child or adult. I cringe when I see pictures or videos of a child climbing over a dog, taking food out of its mouth, shoving it, squashing it, pushing it. Every dog owner should read this article: www.suzanneclothier.com/the-articles/he-just-wants-say-hi as it is the best article about canine behaviour that I have ever read. Dogs generally 'react' rather than 'act'. A dog that bites has usually already given many signals that they are uncomfortable in the situation they are in, and the bite is the final 'telling off'. Know your dog, know their behaviour, know their limits, and the chances of biting are far reduced. Likewise, teach your children how to behave around animals, and don't put your pet in the position of having to defend themselves, and you won't have problems.

Greyhorses · 29/06/2015 16:11

ladyglen I can honestly say that that is my experience. The large majority of staffs in my area are sporting massive harnesses and launching at other dogs. I hardly ever see a well trained and well socialised one. I don't blame the breed for this but I can see why they are 'picked on' by the media and dog haters. Maybe that is the area I live in I don't know but it has put me off them as a breed. Nothing to do with looks.

Just today I have met two, both severely dog aggressive. I am not saying that other dogs can't be aggressive, just that in my experience they are more likley to be dog aggressive than some other breeds. Many of the Staffies i work with in reacue have issues around other animals, maybe due to the upbringing rather than breed but it means I trust them less. Just last week we put to sleep two lovely sweet dogs who went out and killed another dog with no warning. The new owners were distraught.

This is only my opinion though and I have met some lovely lovely Staffies that are great with people but I would not trust them around my pets Sad I also have no problem with people saying all dogs can attack, I agree with this completley but it just seems to be in my experience alot of the time in my area a staffy is involved.

I don't think they should be banned or regulated, but I do think some owners don't know what they are taking on when they take on a dog that is so powerful especially one with an unknown past (and I would say the same to anyone taking on a large breed dog of any breed) but sometimes I feel the bad bits of the breed are washed over in an attempt to get them homes which leads to unsuitable people taking them.

There are some very lovely dogs on this thread though Smile

formerbabe · 29/06/2015 16:18

I am genuinely sorry that you will never know the joy a staffordshire bull terrier brings

I can't tell you happy I am not to know the 'joy'!

sparechange · 29/06/2015 16:18

Midnite That is an excellent article
I'm also trying to find the one that someone (possibly you) posted on another thread with pictures of children with dogs, in which the behaviourist had called out all the visable stress signals the dog was giving off

tabulahrasa · 29/06/2015 16:21

"I can't find any stats for the UK, but in the US it seems that pitbulls and rotweilers together account for 2/3 of dog attacks in some states (couldn't find any national figures)."

Well pitbull is a meaningless term really because it includes actual Pitbulls, crosses and and dog that happens to look a bit like one even if it's actually some other kind of cross.

There was a study in the uk of bites by breed (I can't find it right now) and staffies did come out top or near to top - but, reading down the list it almost exactly correlated to which breeds there are higher numbers if in the UK.

KC registered staffies are the third most popular pedigree dog, when you add in unregistered ones and crises most animal organisations think they are the most numerous breed of dog.

Another very popular breed are Labradors and they were either number 2 or 3 for recorded bites.

tabulahrasa · 29/06/2015 16:22

Loads of typos there, fat fingers, small phone, lol.

SelfconfessedSpoonyFucker · 29/06/2015 16:36

I live in the US, I do not have a staff or a pit bull but when we were looking for a dog the pit bulls were easily the most friendly dogs in the shelter.

MehsMum · 29/06/2015 16:38

No dog owner will say that their dog is aggresive or unfriendly
I beg to differ. My big dog is quite scared of other dogs (neutered too soon, but that's a whole other discussion) and consequently he can behave like an utter arse. He has to be carefully watched and managed. He is not muzzled, because he is not a biter, but he can look pretty scary - though the hard work is paying off and he's a lot better than he was. But yup, I'm a dog owner saying my dog can be aggressive.

He's also very stand-offish with strangers: not aggressive, but very aloof - 'unfriendly', even.

Utterly amazing with the family, though. Barks at me Lassie-like to tell me things.

00100001 · 29/06/2015 16:41

Errr, maybe because people aren't shallow enough to go on 'looks' alone?

00100001 · 29/06/2015 16:42

< ---- ...... this dog Blush

Not to understand why anyone could choose to have those ugly looking dogs?
formerbabe · 29/06/2015 16:44

Not cute at all IMO.

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