To not allow my 8 yr old to go on his school trip tomorrow because he stole?

[Noneedtoworryatall]

He stole earlier this week €25 then the next day he stole again, €2.

I didn't take the ball back, I threw it in the bin.

The €2 was for an ice cream.

Oh, gosh OP, this sounds hard.

I would say he is trying to feel control over his life because his Dad is not contacting him and there 's nothing he can do to influence that.

And he's testing you to see if you will abandon him too - challenging you, almost, trying to make it be a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Or maybe blaming you because blaming himself is just too hard to bear.

But blaming someone or something makes children feel in control where they are not in control.

Talk to him: tell him that it isn't his fault that his dad isn't contacting him, and it isn't because he is bad or unloveable.

You are doing the right thing telling him you love him unconditionally whatever he does or doesn't do.

Well done for getting rid of your ex and building a happy home. It is REALLY good that he owned up.

Be calm, consistent and loving - as you are.

I am quite surprised that an 8 year old is able to steal all that money and go and buy a football without you noticing?

By the sounds of it, they're not in the UK so the kid will have a bit more freedom as most kids outside of the UK seem to...

He has to learn that actions have consequences.
If he were my ds I would keep him at home.

It sounds like there's something deeper going on.

Does he get pocket money on a regular basis? Have some of his classmates been saying things to him?

He does care, very much so going by how defensive you say he appears to be. He would not be going on the trip, I agree with that, but you do need time to sit down with him and chat to him, maybe get him to come up with some ideas as to why someone might feel they had to take €25?

Noneedtoworry, I feel your pain, and I can see you're trying to do all you can to steer him back onto the right path.

But can I just point something out: He DID do a good thing by admitting to the steal - he didn't try and lie about it, and that is a positive thing. I agree with the other posters who say there's more going on behind this, and just heaping on punishment after punishment won't solve that.

His punishment is : Having to pay the money back with chores (no matter how slow or how much ill grace) and knowing how hurt and disappointed you are.

In my view, that's enough. I'd let him go on the trip. Perhaps without spending money, or with less than others.

Are you finding things difficult financially in ways he's picking up on? at 8 I imagine he's doing a lot of comparing with peers. Maybe he feels hard-done-by. And if so, that's something he's going to have to come to terms with.

Whatever you do or don't decide to do, please keep reassuring him that you love him, but you hate the bad choices he chose to make.

Also, we tend to say that "the behaviour you give attention to is the behaviour you get", so please try and find some positives to praise and verbally praise them, and I would hope you'd get more of that.

Good luck

You are all so nice, thank you for you comments.

When I tell him off he will sometimes say that I don't like him. I'm very careful to point out I love him but I don't like his behaviour.

I just don't know what to do for the best.

I know he's hurting because I left his father but the life we were living was horrific.

My ex husband slapped my boy across the face leaving a hand print but I'm the meanest mummy in the world and he hates me.

He has always been a handful

Agree with Hairy and Fatmomma.

You need to find out what is behind this recent spate of taking what doesn't belong to him... this is usually linked to a sense of lack imo, either material or emotional.

Thus makes some sense in terms of a father who left and hasn't been in contact since.

I would let him go on his school trip but talk to him about how he's feeling and what he needs from you at this time.

I know it must not be easy for you either OP. It does sound like you and DS have a solid bond, in terms of DS being able to admit his wrongdoing to you and you being thoughtful of his feelings and possible solutions in posting here and asking for advice.

Oh, you are very much NOT the meanest Mummy: he would 't dare say that to you if you were. He wouldn't feel secure enough to risk pushing you away.

Kids always act out for the parent they feel most secure with.

You threw ball in the bin ? That's a bit pointless.

All behaviour is communication.
You need to address how ds really feels about being abandoned by his dad. however bad he was a child might not really get it in the same way. Child still worships dad. Give your ds opportunities to talk aNd listen to him. Get some advice from a psychologist or child therapist.

He's hurting and he's buying himself things to make himself better, maybe? Also to lash out at you perhaps?

Forget the 'no remorse'. Boys aren't supposed to show emotion (well sadness or upset anyway) so defiance or indifference are often used to mask these feelings.

Punish him if you must, but Id keep it minimal and concentrate on pulling him closer not driving him away.

I was a terrible thief as a child by the way - punishing me made no difference at all. I grew out of it by finding better ways to deal with my unhappiness.

I'd get the ball out of the bin. I might not give it to him until he had "earned" it back through chores but if you throw it away no-one benefits. It sounds as if you have had a lot going on in your lives and your poor DS has been in the middle of it. At 8 he is still very little to have witnessed whatever went on between your and your husband and to have been subjected to violence which left a mark on him. He is crying out for love and attention and testing you out to see how bad he has to be before you too hit him or abandon him.

At that age kids steal to take what they're not getting from their parents emotionally. It happens.

I wouldn't stop the trip but he's crying out for the attention he doesn't think he's getting and if his dad has dumped him (.it may feel like) he may be blaming you somewhat for that.

Has he ever told you how he feels after you split from his dad? I know things are nicer now but that was his normal and things have changed. He may be struggling with that.

There can be a turning point with stealing, and regardless of his background or feelings I would take the opportunity to instill, if nothing else, the seriousness of what he has done even in the eyes of his loving parent. Whatever you do about this, he should be able to clearly remember the punishment, and the regret, for the rest of his life.

At the very least imo you can't possibly send him on his trip, rewarding him at this time when he is so young - the punishment should start with no trip. He STOLE, and miserably rueing the day he made that choice that is the most important thing in his little life at the moment.

Once it's done, though, it's done - don't label him a thief, don't be cross with or horrible to him afterwards, don't reward him with long deep meaning chats about his feelings or other attention - one short sharp shock, a glimpse into the yawning chasm that gives him an idea of how things will go if he wants to be a thief, then back to normal.

Your posts are making me cry. Such a hard situation to be in. You know you've done the right thing but it's making your child unhappy and rebellious. It must be very difficult.

I don't think I'd involve the school in the punishment. What would you do if there was no trip, you'd have to think of some other punishment? Ideally it would be linked to the crime, like being made to take the ball back and explain why he can't keep it, but if he's used it, I guess that's not possible.

Is there a charity the ball could be given too, with a letter about how he needs to pass it on due to it being ill gotten gains? Obviously the charity won't care about the letter, but he won't like having to write it.

An awful situation to be in noneed but you are doing the right thing. He needs very much to know you love him however he behaves. And this is the boundry he is pushing at. You probably know full well that children can feel they are to blame for divorces and family spilts, it might not be overtly voiced by a child as young as 8 but its often there no matter how wrong they are.
This "How badly can I behave and mum still loves me" may well be a way of him proving to himself that he is lovable inspite of bad behaviour. So stick to your guns - leave the ball in the bin and keep going with the "Love you not your behaviour" I dont think you need to do anything your not already doing

I second Darkness.
Let him know how much you love him but that you won't accept naughty / bad behaviour.
He is hurting emotionally - perhaps I was a bit hard with my previous comment before stating : actions have consequences.

I's precisely that he's so young [and has some quite big emotional stuff to process as outlined by OP] that you don't want him 'miserably rueing the day' he made the choice to steal Apeman.

I think it might just be more helpful to give an 8 year old boy 'the long meaningful chats' about his feelings and some one on one attention from Mum rather than less ['as a glimpse into the yawning chasm of how things will be if he wants to be a thief'].

FFS, this is some of the most ridiculous and unhelpful advice I have ever read on MN.

OP, please have a chat with a child therapist or a children's charity for some further advice. Stealing is not that uncommon in young children who are unhappy for whatever reason and what they need is understanding and support, not focus on punishment.

It does seem as if it is a cry for attention. I'd talk to him about his feelings. Say that it can't go unpunished but you want to talk about why he felt the need to do it. Can you access help via the school. He needs counselling really.

Oh, come on. Really? This type of ridiculous namby pamby, wishy washy parenting is why kids have no scruples about doing this sort of thing in the first place. Cry for attention my backside. He needs discipline and to have the consequences of stealing drummed into him, not a nice cup of tea and a cuddly chat about his "feeeeeeeelings". Utterly ludicrous. He's done something awful and needs punishment.

yoursfan

Yes, let's not wonder if a child who has been physically abused by his father who has now all but abandoned him might be slightly traumatised by what he has been through and struggling to cope.

Its just he needs discipline - what do you suggest another slap across the face perhaps.

He sounds upset and angry. Taking it out on you is probably the only way he can think of to let it all out.

He takes it out on you because he knows you'll stick around. He cant be angry at his dad because hes not around.

You do need to talk to him about it, maybe encourage him to write things down for you to read.