Who was at fault in this near collision?

[drivinglessons]

Name changed because this I am a bit embarrassed by this. Please be nice as I am a relatively new and inexperienced driver.

This afternoon I had a near collision which shook me up a bit, and I am trying to work out if I went wrong, so that I can improve, or if it was not my fault.

I was driving on a dual carriageway (50mph) and had just overtaken a car in the right hand lane, and was preparing to move back into the left lane.

I looked to see there was enough space behind me for me to go back into the left lane in front of the car I overtook. There weren’t any cars in front that I needed to look out for. I then signalled to indicate I was moving back into the left lane, and then began to move into the left lane.

As I was half across the dotted lines, a van who was in the side road on the left drove into my path of driving, and I had to swerve back into the right lane to avoid a collision. I was very shaken up, as I think I very narrowly avoided a collision. When it was safe, I then moved back into the left lane.

Initially I thought the other driver was at fault as he was on a side road and his pulling out into moving traffic caused me to serve to avoid a collision. As it was a dual carriageway with a barrier, all the traffic was on the right of the van, so they only had to look right (rather than both ways) to see when was safe to enter the dual carriageway, and I would have been clearly visible.

However I’ve now had a look on the internet, and found that it is against the highway code to overtake near a junction. I have also considered that perhaps the driver of the van thought my signalling left meant I was planning to turn left into the side road, however as I was in the right lane and hadn’t slowed down, I think that is unlikely.

I’m not sure who was at fault, me (for overtaking near a junction), the other driver (as they were entering from a side road and didn’t wait for the road to be clear), or both of us?

I would say he was at fault, though I would have stayed in the right hand lane til i was passed the junction myself.

He is at fault, you were indicating. He was pulling into the road you were already on so should have given way and joined when it was safe. If you hadn't been indication it would have been a different story,

nice animation. i would say you were at fault to be overtaking near a junction, though for a dual carriageway you would expect a solid middle line indicating no overtaking. are you sure there was there no middle road marking?

Both really - he shouldn't have pulled out while you were indicating, but you shouldn't have been changing lanes so closes junction.

I think he's at fault for not looking more carefully (and the car you overtook looks quite close as well). As a matter of course if I overtook before a junction or slip road I would try to stay in the right hand lane until I was past the slip road. just avoids trouble of this sort with traffic joining.

Alls well that ends well and you are clearly a sensible and thoughtful driver who's intending to learn from your mistakes. and !

I tend to think every driver on the road is silly and blind and cant seeme and would never overtake where you have. However as you on main road surely you have right of way despite the fact you not on the right side of the road. Maybe both wrong! Are you ok?

The van was pushing his luck but you should have been more aware of traffic joining the dual carriageway and been prepared to stay in the outside lane a little longer to allow them to do so.

Hmmm I think you should have stayed in the right hand lane til past the junction. Imagine the driving tests hazard anticipation test, a car at the junction could have been a potential hazard.

Don't beat yourself up though. There are very few perfect drivers. I like these threads as they make me think a bit more carefully about various scenarios.

The no overtaking rule applies to single carriageways, not dual carriageways or motorways.

As you were already on the main road, he should have been prepared to fit in with traffic on the dual carriageway.

However....as you overtook the slower vehicle, you should have been prepared for traffic entering from the slip road , and stayed in the outside lane for longer, and only moved back into the inside lane when it was clear and safe to do so.

But very easy to be wise after the event.

I'd be very shaken up too, poor you! I've had something similar happen (though I was in the left lane when a van pulled out, and had a motorbike next to me in the right lane so couldn't swerve. Had to emergency stop).

I'd say he was at fault - surely if you had only just overtaken he would have been pulling out into the path of the vehicle you'd just passed? I certainly wouldn't pull out in that situation especially with someone indicating (unlikely he thought you were turning off if you were in the right hand lane).

However the Highway Code exists for a reason and it's good advice not to pull in near a junction. It's possible it might have been shared culpability had their been a collision (just a guess from me though).

You sound like you want to be a safe, careful driver. Learn from this and take care - and thanks for being one more driver who gives a shit out there

Exactly what Oldie says - but don't beat yourself up about it & chalk it up to experience.

I wouldn't have thought there was a problem with being in the right lane of a dual carriageway on the approach to a junction.

If it was a single carriageway and you were on the wrong side of the road, you would have been in the wrong, but as things stood I think you were fine.

The van driver should have been paying more attention.

Oh OP, poor you I agree it's probably a bit of both really. Van shouldn't have pulled out but you should maybe have waited a little longer before pulling back in.

If it's any consolation, I had a similar incident when I hadn't been driving long, but the road was much busier. I was on a dual carriageway, car came up a slip road and slowed right down, then shoved out in front of me. I had to swerve into the right hand lane (in front of another car) to stop from going into them. Still makes me shudder to think about it.

Highway code isnt law

Something similar happened to me once on a motorway. I was in the fast lane indicating to go into the middle lane, and didn't notice someone in the slow lane trying to pull into the same gap. I think it's one of those situations where we both should have noticed each other and neither of us should have gone. But these things happen and you learn from them. I think in your case you should have stayed in the right hand lane for a few more seconds until you were past the junction. The other driver shouldn't have pulled out, but you have to anticipate that sometimes other drivers are less than ideal.

A lot of talk and single and dual carriageways. Just to be clear, what constitutes a dual carriageway has nothing to do with the number of lanes, something that even experienced drivers don't grasp. A dual carriageway is any road with physical separation between the lanes, like a grass verge or a barrier. Near me there's a dual carriageway with only one lane in each direction. because there's grass and some trees in the middle. Also there's a road with 2 lanes in each direction that isn't a dual carriageway, because there's no physical separation in the middle.

OP, has there been an accident it would have been down to him, because the onus is on him to ensure it's clear when pulling from a side road onto a major road. However, being right is little consolation if you're dead. So don't move from lane 2 to lane 1 on approach to a junction, especially if there's someone waiting there to pull out. And avoid indicating if there's any chance that someone could misinterpret your intention and thing you are turning left when you're not.

Learning from your mistakes is good, but learning from someone else's is even better!

He was in the wrong. The junction thing applies to single roads

Maybe the van driver was a new driver too - I think we all have such incidents and learn from them. Don't be too concerned about moving over as soon as possible, a few extra seconds won't harm those behind and will allow you to anticipate potential hazards ahead.

As to the Highway Code - it seems to be promoted as law but is really just a (very good) guide/common sense.

I don't know if he was in the wrong? But you should have been aware that he could pull out and should have stayed in the right hand lane. Imagine it from his point of view. He's waiting to join the carriageway, sees someone in the outside lane, so pulls out only to find they pull into his lane, scary.

He should not have pulled out into the path of oncoming traffic. What an idiot.

if you had been wanting to turn left, you would have been slowing down in the left hand lane.

you do get a few people though who drive onto the slip road and expect everyone else to get out of their way, whether is space to do so or not.

Put it behind you now. When you're driving, it's good to anticipate what might happen, who might move where on the road. When you approach a junction, it's good to move out one lane if there's room, to allow the car to enter the road. When you're driving in town and you're near a zebra crossing, anticipate that any pedestrians on the pavement might decide to cross, so be prepared to slow.

Mostly the other driver I think.

He shouldn't have joined the carriageway as you were indicating to move back into the left lane - and also surely the car you were overtaking would have been too close to the junction for him to join the carriageway safely? I expect he didn't notice your indicator and assumed you would stay in the right hand lane. Or he didn't look properly at all. I've seen some near misses involving drivers who just pull out of junctions / slip roads etc and seem to expect everyone else to just make room for them.

But if you're in the right hand lane approaching a slip road or junction that's joining the carriageway, it's a good idea to keep an eye on the junction, so that you're aware of cars etc that are trying to join. If there is a car trying to join the carriageway, it's generally safer to stay in the right hand lane a bit longer till you're past the junction just in case the car at the junction tries to join the left hand lane just as you're moving back in.

just wanting some advice,

today I joined a slip road onto a dual carriageway there was a car in front of me entering the carriage way at around 25/30mph the slip road is fairly small before reaching the end of the slip road the car stoped which resulted in me going into the back of the car.

I was really shook up, has anyone experienced this before and if so what was the outcome? I feel so bad 🥺😩 xx

just wanting some advice,

today I joined a slip road onto a dual carriageway there was a car in front of me entering the carriage way at around 25/30mph the slip road is fairly small before reaching the end of the slip road the car stoped which resulted in me going into the back of the car.

I was really shook up, has anyone experienced this before and if so what was the outcome? I feel so bad 🥺😩 xx