To ask what you would cut if you were David Cameron?

[Seeingthebeautyineveryminute]

Can't for the life of me see how £12 billion savings are going to be made. I fear it will be cuts to already diminished support and services (as opposed to increased taxation). If you were David Cameron what would you do?

JoffreyBaratheonFirstofHisName

That's when you'll hear squeals of "but it's the system". Only you'll hear the squeals much louder, through the bullhorn that is the Daily Mail.

I can't believe that in such a left-wing forum, so many people are against tax credits. I am right-wing, and hated the idea of them when Gordon Brown introduced them, but once I understood their purpose. I accepted they were necessary. Tax credits exist to eliminate the benefit trap. Abolish them and you will have lots of people leaving work to live on a bigger amount of out-of-work benefits.

(The exact degree of generosity is up for negotiation: I didn't realize until I read this thread that you were allowed more savings than if you were on out-of-work benefits.)

I do not believe tax credits will be abolished. Hopefully the already implemented PAYE RTI system in conjunction with Universal Credit will make the whole process much more seamless.

If I were going to go on a benefits-abolishing rampage, I would abolish out-of-work benefits for people who can work, and redirect the saved money into job subsidies tax credits, so that there were enough jobs for everyone. It would (by design) cost the government the same amount, and even if some jobs were 100% subsidized, at least everyone would be making whatever contribution to the economy they could, and no-one would be in a position to game out-of-work benefits.

I think it's a bit dangerous not to count tax credits as benefits. Tax credits are benefits. It was a big mistake to call them tax credits and make people dependent on them. I'd like to see them phased out too. I agree with extending free child care for working parents.

I don't think this is a left wing forum. It's made of of different people with different views.

Not cutting as such but means test all benefits.

I would means test:

• higher level attendance allowance;
• the NHS nursing component that is paid direct to nursing homes; and
• NHS continuing care provided in a nursing home setting,

But I would devise the means test carefully so that it only bites on those with property and no partner or financial dependants - the idea would be to fully means test all elderly end-of-life care - if necessary as a charge against the person's estate. The conservatives are in fact travelling in the opposite direction, so as to maximise cost to the taxpayer and minimise cost to the individual in this area.

I would also do something drastic to inheritance tax to help deflate the property bubble.

I would cut benefits for those who insist on having loads of children. They can have their benefits when they take effective contraception.

Tax credits exist to eliminate the benefit trap. Abolish them and you will have lots of people leaving work to live on a bigger amount of out-of-work benefits.

That may be the theory. But working tax credits are used as a form of welfare for businesses that are paying below the cost of supply (ie a wage people can live on) for one of the inputs to the business.

Which is why the idea of a regionally-adjusted living wage in combination with eliminating working tax credits is attractive. It would also test whether business models are actually sustainable when they pay the true cost of labour.

I think it's a bit dangerous not to count tax credits as benefits. Tax credits are benefits. It was a big mistake to call them tax credits and make people dependent on them.

They were called that because they replaced a tax allowance.

But working tax credits are used as a form of welfare for businesses that are paying below the cost of supply (ie a wage people can live on) for one of the inputs to the business.

They are also used for people who can only find PT work. Raising the hourly wage will not necessarily lift those who are underemployed out of poverty- which at present is a sizeable chunk of the working population.

Plus, as if the Tories would legislate to either make businesses pay more or for landlords to charge less. It is not in their make up.

But I suspect they will the same kind of simplistic thinking that is often being used on this thread and fail to properly assess the implications and scenarios.

I have no doubt they will make cuts but I will be really surprised if they make any savings.

Oh, I'm not saying for a second that the Tories would contemplate doing this. But a girl can dream.

Point taken about underemployment.

No benefits of any description to any foreign national - ever. If you can't support yourself then leave!
No benefits to anyone who hasn't worked full time and paid tax for at least 2 years of their adult life .
No benefits to anyone under 21.
After you've had 2 kids you get no more benefits/ bigger houses - even if you have 10 of the little darlings. You do the maths as to whether you can support them BEFORE you get pregnant!
No NHS treatment at all unless you're a British citizen.
Scrap foreign aid completely for the foreseeable future.

I wouldn't cut. I'd borrow, and invest in capital projects and public services, creating jobs and rebuilding a world class economy, not one limping along like it is at the moment. Then, I'd use the increased tax receipts and inward investment to reduce the deficit.

maninawomansworld - nice suggestions, let's leave all the foreigners to die in the street, and have a massive increase in homelessness for young people because they can't get housing benefit, and while you are at it, let's celebrate all the children who will get left to starve because their under 21 year old mothers can't get a job and won't have any more benefits. Or, and fuck the poor people who live outside the Uk, because they have a different skin colour they don't matter. They can all starve in their millions too. I would say it sounds like victorian England - but hey, at least they had workhouses.

Excellent post, Wear. I hope the cut this cut that brigade never get a knock on the door from poverty. If they do they may eat those words.
man. Don't take your anger out on little innocent children. Okay you don't ask their parents to breed them before you bite back with that old chestnut but they don't ask to be born. !!!!!!!!
Fancy advocating children go hungry and without.

thanks...

No NHS treatment at all unless you're a British citizen

Does that mean we can have our NI contributions back? Lovely, ta.

Wow to some of rest of you, and I thought maybe I was too harsh. Good to think out of the box, though. I think to cut:

My job & our whole research group (promised up to 10 yrs funding).
Most the jobs I applied for last yr.
IVF on NHS.
All arts funding unless vulnerable groups are directly and heavily involved in the arts production (like disabled, or ex-offenders).
Any discount on stamp duty for first time buyers and the right-to-buy scheme. Discount for first-time buyers who are registered disabled might be good instead.
KS2 SAT tests (replace with competency/CAT tests done at start of yr7). I'd like to stop making the data publicly available below GCSE (no more league tables for KS2).
Ofsted inspections to be shorter, less frequent & with no notice.
Involvement in any foreign armed conflict unless the strategic British interest is extremely compelling.
4 hour targets and waiting list targets in NHS and most of the performance metrics that go with NHS & state education. Eg: This would save money by freeing up ambulances attending A&E!
Pensioners should have one single benefit grant which is means tested, that includes state-pension, bus-pass, winter fuel, TV license, etc.

Someone suggested higher Uni tuition fees for kids who come from private schools, I think I like that one.

Lower caps on tax-credits & housing benefit.

I would raise council tax a fair whack, way overdue for re-evaluation and rises. Should be levied directly on property owners not residents (administratively this would save money). And no discounts for 2nd or empty homes.

I'm not sure about museum entry; do museums make so much back from gift shop sales that they are nearly net earners from VAT?

I want to keep Trident, though I know it's a dreadful boondoggle. I want as many good guys in world to have nukes as bad guys who have 'em.

Maybe raising minimum wage is a good idea if it spurs inflation & cuts national debt.

Christ there are some stupid ideas on here.

No NHS treatment for foreigners ... So that would include all those NHS nurses who happened to be born and trained abroad (saving the UK the cost of their education)?

Most of the low hanging fruit has already been picked when it comes to making cuts, and a lot of coalition policies aimed at reducing spending didn't achieve their objectives anyway. The one area that hasn't really been touched is spending on pensioners and if the £12bn is going to be achieved without major social costs then old age benefits are going to have to be looked at.

I suspect this target will get rolled back though as they realize how tough it's going to be to achieve without touching their grey voters.

Abolition of universal free school meals for KS1. Universal funded preschool hours reduced to just the full year before starting school, with extra hours for children growing up in the bottom SES 25% of areas.

Instead of capping child benefit (which harms kids not their feckless parents), what about paying people to be sterilised, if between ages of 25-40? Doesn't harm existing children & prevents some unplanned pregnancies.

Its interesting how we are reacting to the abolition of tax credits by asking how people would cope losing a high percentage of their incomes, and still maintaining that they would close the loopholes in the tax laws which could easily result in Amazon Vodafone etc taking their business out of the country, but no ones asking how that would affect unemployment and therefore the welfare bill?

Imo it is more beneficial for the current government to keep tax credits and NMW the same as it is now. For their own interests. They are subsidising big companies wage bill and keeping us poor people in their place, having to claim a benefits and be oh so grateful for the shit state this country is in.

Old age benefits absolutely need an overhaul. My mums is currently enjoying her winter fuel allowance in Sorrento.
Agree universal free school meals KS1 too.

which could easily result in Amazon Vodafone etc taking their business out of the country,

really? You think they would actually stop selling to the uk if they had to pay tax? No, they wouldn't and if they did someone else would easily take their place. no loss. there is a market there. They would like you to believe they will but they won't.

I do think it is possible the government won't be able to cut 12bn. it has been suggested that this figure was made up to use as a bargaining tool for coalition and now they are stuck with it. I suspect they might come out with something like - the economy is doing so well because we are so brilliant we now only need to cut 6bn aren't you a lucky, lucky populace.

Abolition of universal free school meals for KS1. Universal funded preschool hours reduced to just the full year before starting school, with extra hours for children growing up in the bottom SES 25% of areas.

This also harms kids. Not to mention having an impact on their education which in turn harms the economy.
Really, the only demographic you can squeeze much further without hurting the economy, in future if it is kids, or now if it is adults of working age, are the pensioners. They are not economically active and they never will be. If it is wrong to take from them then it is wrong and foolish to take from everyone else. I am not supporting hitting pensioner btw I am just saying if you want to justify cutting then there is no reason why they should be spared other than for purely political reasons

I think they will do thing such as abolish HB for 21 (parent) and 1

Those saying get rid of IVF - IVF is a drop in the ocean. If all IVF in the UK in 2012 had been funded by the NHS it would have used 0.002% of the NHS budget.

www.ivfyes.org/costs/4584322161

Let's stop treating acne and other skin conditions shall we? After all, they're not life threatening.

HS2 - at least the London-Birmingham section.