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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Neighbours dog killed cat :(

268 replies

spudholes · 02/05/2015 21:02

Our next door neighbour has a staffie dog. I was talking to her over the fence and a cat came into the garden and the dog flew at it and killed it Sad. I was very upset and neighbour said it was the cats fault for coming into her garden.

I have found out that the ower of said cat is away on holiday Sad Neighbour says she's not going to tell them what happened when they get back.

Should I tell them?

OP posts:
MoustacheofRonSwanson · 05/05/2015 08:48

Tell the cat's owner. Warn the local police that this incident has happened in case there is future trouble with this dog. This incident doesn't guarantee that the dog will kill another cat or dog or attack a child or even an adult.

And also move house because your neighbour is a seriously nasty piece of work and evidently has no sense of responsibility or remorse.

Absolutely disgusted by the people who think that's its fine for a dog to kill a cat and the owner doesn't need to do anything about the dog's behaviour in the future. and I don't just mean tell the cat's owner.

D0oinMeCleanin · 05/05/2015 09:07

I don't think anyone has said that the neighbours behaviour was appropriate.

As for training the dog, she could and should train a decent leave command and a good recall, that doesn't necessarily mean the dog will apply these commands to cats. Dogs are not good at generalising. If you teach a dog to leave a bit of cheese in your front room, they won't understand that leave also applies to cats in the garden or even cheese in the dining room and even with perfect recall the dog could reach the cat before the owner has a chance to respond.

There are ways to train dogs not to kill prey, but without having a cat or prey at hand to safely expose the dog to, the neighbour might struggle to do this. A dog killing a prey animal is natural behaviour. A dog killing a child is not natural nor common.

MoustacheofRonSwanson · 05/05/2015 09:19

D0oin plenty of people, yourself included, are dismissing this as natural behaviour about which nothing can be done. Which is utter blinkered nonsense. You should be ashamed of yourself.

Only1scoop · 05/05/2015 09:24

I wonder if any of theses dogs that have literally mauled and ragged children and babies to death.... were at some stage or other thought as 'the sweetest thing' around their dc also. Confused

D0oinMeCleanin · 05/05/2015 09:31

It is natural behaviour for a dog to kill prey animals, whether you like it or not, it is. Some dogs kill and retrieve, some kill and eat, some kill and maim (terriers for instance that have been bred to kill vermin)

It's not nice, but it is natural canine behaviour, one that over the years we have selectively bred to enhance for our own means and entertainment. When we stopped working dogs as much and started using traditional working breeds, such as staffies, as companions, we forgot to tell the dogs.

Training could be done, yes. How successful it would be would depend on the level of prey drive that the dog has and the consistency of the training. It's something I would work on if my dogs were prone to attacking cats in my garden. I have a cat and would be devastated if anything like that happened to it. I wouldn't blame the dog or the owner, however. It's a risk you take when you allow your cat to wander.

the neighbour is a twat, as I said before, but that doesn't make her a twat with a dangerous dog. The dog is nor more or no less a danger to a child now than it was before it attacked the cat. That is what I've been pointing out, not that the neighbours attitude was anything to be proud of.

Reginafalangie · 05/05/2015 09:44

Sure the police would love to hear about a dog that killed a cat in the dogs own garden Hmm What do people think the police will do?

They will do nothing. The dog was in it's own garden and unless it has a "record" for biting people they will dismiss it.

IKnowIAmButWhatAreYou · 05/05/2015 09:57

So if you had pet chickens & one got into next doors garden & was killed by their cat would we have all this outrage?

To me the answer is pretty simple, cat owners should build runs for their pets or escape proof their gardens.

Think of all the trauma that would be saved - no more run-over, vanishing, wandering or killed cats. They could stay happy & safe in their owners gardens.

Anything else is just lazy & neglectful ownership....

BabyGanoush · 05/05/2015 09:58

Agree with Doinmecleaning

Dogs (some) kill rabbits/cats

Cats kill birds and mice

Doesn't mean the dog and cat would kill babies Confused

I do think the neighbour was wrong to not try and stop the dog, and also to not tell the cat owner.

BabyGanoush · 05/05/2015 10:01

Only1scoop, that is hysteria.

Agression to humans and a dog's prey drive arenit connected.

Pret drive is notthe same as aggression.

Are you equally afraid a cat who kills mice, and fakes sadistic cat pleasure in doing so, will be a danger to babies/kids?

Or is this malinformed hysteria only applied to dogs?

D0oinMeCleanin · 05/05/2015 10:21

I think Only1scoop was referring to my post about my Dad's hunting dog and dd2 and also working on the mistaken belief that family dogs often turn with no warning, which yeah, is hysteria.

No dog has ever attacked a child with no warning. I'd bet my life savings on that.

It's often reported in the media that the dog was fine with children before the incident. The dog liked children, the attack came out of the blue etc. When, if you delved deeper, you'd always find that the dog had shown many, many indications of being uncomfortable around children, it's just that these indications weren't growling and snarling. They may have been lip smacking, yawning, sniffing, or typical avoidance behaviours. All of these behaviours are often misread or missed completely by your average dog owner, it doesn't mean they were not there. Dogs like to avoid aggression wherever possible, it is an evolutionary safe guard to their survival as a species. They do not start fights that may leave them injured and unable to hunt unless they absolutely have to. They'll only resort to aggression as a last means, when all other means of of stopping the unwanted attentions have failed.

I taught dd2 these signals. She understands when a dog wants her attention and when to back off. Most dogs would not like being dd2's patient and dd2 would not play doctors and patients with most dogs, but this dog, for reasons known only to the dog itself, enjoys being dd2's patient. It's never shown any sign of stress during these games. In fact if dd2 gets bored before the dog does the dog will attempt to encourage her back to the 'doctors office' by headbutting her and play bowing at her.

Leave this dog unattended with a cat and it would be bye bye kitty.

I firmly believe that the basics of canine behaviour should be taught in primary schools. This would have a far greater effect on reducing the number of child fatalities to dog attacks than ill thought out, knee jerk dangerous dog laws.

Chattymummyhere · 05/05/2015 10:30

Way too many overreactions. Yes the owner of the cat should be told but as pointed out by others prey drive and human aggression are two very different things.

The dog killed PREY that was in its garden. It did NOT attack a child in the street.

By some of the responses does my dogs eating already dead whole prey mean it's going to savage my children? You have got more chance of the hyped up kibble fed dog biting a human than a dog with PRAY drive.

ephemeralfairy · 05/05/2015 10:33

I don't like dogs at all, but i don't know much about them so will refrain from speculating on whether a cat-killing dog could go on to kill a baby....

However, if my cat killed someone else's PET (as I know could happen) I would be absolutely mortified. I would tell the owner at the earliest opportunity, apologise profusely and do anything I could to help them. And I would recognise how upset they would be, and respect that. I really can't see how anyone could think that just shrugging it off and not saying something is reasonable.

OP, I am really sorry that you had to witness that. I hope you manage to find and tell the sister, so she can break the news tactfully.

Only1scoop · 05/05/2015 11:27

Doin to be honest I was. My comment wasn't about dogs in general. Confused

I was also referring to comments I've seen about how dogs who attack and have indeed killed are often portrayed as being cute as buttons with dc pre attack.

I think thread has gone off piste. Just the norm.

Collaborate · 05/05/2015 11:48

Much has been posted on this thread about what people think should morally happen. The law is the Dangerous Dogs act 1991, and the Dogs Act 1871.

Basically, for the most recent Act, the dog will need to be shown to be "dangerously out of control". To do that, it will be necessary to show that there are grounds for "reasonable apprehension that a dog will injure any person". Not sure that will apply in this instance. How can anyone reasonably think that a dog, in its own back garden, that presumably no casual visitors to the property will have access to, make someone fear that it may injure them? A threatening dog in the front garden is a different matter. Ask any postman.

If there is an incident that involves injury to another animal the older Act may be used. However a single incident is unlikely to be considered sufficient to prove that the dog is dangerous unless the Court accepts that the incident is an exceptional one.

My own personal view is that I have only ever seen cats goading dogs, or indeed attacking dogs, not vice versa. Unless anyone witnessed the attack it would be hard to be sure that the cat was free from culpability in some was. The cat was, after all, the trespasser.

O, and, OP; YANBU to tell the cat owner. Awful of the neighbour to be so dismissive.

Seeingthebeautyineveryminute · 05/05/2015 19:27

This is why I hate vicious dogs.

EEVEElution · 05/05/2015 22:39

Is this normal behavior for dogs? I have a dog and a cat, dog wouldn't harm her (although he is quite excitable and gets a paw swipe from the cat when he gets on her nerves).

EEVEElution · 05/05/2015 22:40

Oops just saw this is 10 pages long and haven't RTFT, sorry if that's been answered!

GraysAnalogy · 05/05/2015 22:44

Some fucking idiots on this thread.

Talking about poisoning a dog for erm.. acting like a dog.

Seeingthebeautyineveryminute · 05/05/2015 22:57

Quite surprised by how many people here think a dog killing a cat is fair game. Is this really true? Does this go on a lot then?

Collaborate · 05/05/2015 23:06

No it's not common, but it can be instinctive in some dogs. Much like some cats will instinctively go for birds and other small animals.

SiobhanSharpe · 05/05/2015 23:35

The NDN sounds most unpleasant. Yes, dogs can and obviously do kill cats. But her reaction was just horrible.
And more worryingly, she does not appear to be able to control her dog.

I like cats AND dogs, btw.

Please, OP, tell the cat-owner exactly what happened. (And any other cat owners in the neighbourhood?)

Rainbunny · 06/05/2015 00:20

Well of course it's upsetting but other species don't live by our gentle societal rules. Your ndn's dog had a cat come into "his" territory and he acted in the way many dogs would (btw the specific breed you mentioned is not necessarily relevant.)

I agree it's not a good thing and I train my dog to obey me and I take the time and effort to maintain training so I know that my dog will obey me when I order him to heel no matter what he is wanting to chase after. I also realise not everyone is going to take the time and money to do that for their dogs.

Honestly, I think it seems upsetting mostly because the victim was a cat, but dogs don't know that cats are specially regarded pets by humans. Cat's kill prey like mice, voles etc.. all the time. Is it that unexpected that a dog would go for something that he is naturally inclined to go after? In any case, the owner has no cause for complaint since the cat was on the dog owner's property.

kali110 · 06/05/2015 00:52

Glad your telling your neighbour.
How awful, that poor cat.
That other neighbour sounds callous.
If a dog did that too any of my cats, can't say i would be responsible for me or my dp actions.
I'd try not to be blaming the dog here, but the neighbour.
Iv been around dogs all my life and never known any to tear an animal to pieces. My friends staffies are the dopiest things ever.
I wouldn't want to fence up all my garden so they couldn't go anywhere. We get a lot of strays visit. We also get a neighbours cat visit who comes in when its raining or at night, if it was fenced up he'd gave nowhere to go.
My cats also are not hunters. They go out in the day ( though not for long) and sleep next to me at night.
They'd be useless hunters as they're scared of rabbits, birds, hedgehogs...
If this was the other way round i'd be horrified. I don't know what i would do but i wouldnt take the view that it wasnt my fault.
I'd be offering to help with vet bills too.

Gently and ali i'm so sorry for your loss. Mine are my babies so i'd be inconsolable if anything happened to one of them.x

however · 06/05/2015 01:07

Well Kali, if that happened to one of your cats, you'd already abdicated responsibility. Because you'd allowed your cat to roam into a dog's garden.

What if your cat had come into my garden and killed my guinea pig?

kali110 · 06/05/2015 19:46

Ill just tell them not to leave the house shall i.....
If one of my cats attacked an animal ( extremely out of character)i wouldn't not be taking responsibility as id already said id be offering to help with vet bills, aplogising, not trying to bury the evidence.