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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to ask what is a reasonable length of time to chase payment. .

101 replies

whiteblossom · 28/04/2015 13:53

I've had different tradesman do work in my home and have been surprised to be chased up for payment after they have handed me the invoice just 14 hours after. Today a different tradesman, 24 hours later...aibu to think fuck off and give me a chance (they want cash so need to get to the bank)

The first tradesman Ive used a handful of times, paid no problems, job finished at 6pm on a friday, invoice handed over...8 am sat morning phone call chasing payment after being told "we can't live off fresh air you know"

I didn't use them again she was so bloody nasty with it too. (Wife chased up for her husband)

Surely you give it a week then chase?

OP posts:
StepAwayFromTheEcclesCakes · 28/04/2015 16:32

oh and yes we had agreed in advance that we would part pay up front for materials and pay rest on satisfactory completion, Invoice to payment would usually be 28 days. I work and get paid at the end of the month... yes agree with this, many suppliers give this amount of time for payment, but most decent people will pay as soon as they can after invoice. If its a small job then I happily pay cash immediately a bigger job a) needs checking first before happily parting with the full amount and b) unless you have a full and final figure you may need a day to get it together to pay a bigger invoice than anticipated.

OrlandoWoolf · 28/04/2015 16:38

I get paid in cash for 1/3 of my work. The payments are small (£10) but lots of them at the same time.

And yes - I declare them. It would be easy for me to not declare them.

I invoice schools as well. Some are good. Some take a long time to pay.
I have invoices to pay.

It's all about cashflow. When you run a business, cash flow is vital.

Droflove · 28/04/2015 16:39

ImNamey you are a very angry person. Totally ott responses. Also strange use of the word bigot.

OP you sound reasonable enough. If everything happened as you say it did YANBU.

redexpat · 28/04/2015 16:50

YANBU. There should be a pay by date on the invoice, and if he needed it quicker he should have made it clear.

However it sounds as if that particular tradesman may have been stung before by non-payers, hence the rather 'brisk' chasing up.

londonrach · 28/04/2015 16:53

Tbh unless a big company id expect to pay after work is complete that day.

WhiffleSqueak · 28/04/2015 16:54

did I read upthread that he declined an offer to transfer the money into his account?

cash would be preferable I suppose as it could be in his account faster than a cheque, but if I'm not imagining the bank transfer decline than defo a dodge imo

whois · 28/04/2015 18:19

So he wouldn't accept a bank transfer? That is very dodgy because there are hardly any circumstances in which a direct transfer can be reversed, contrary to what someone up thread said. You can reverse a credit card charge easily, a debit card less easily but still possible ht direct bank transfer is pretty certain.

Tradesman sounds a dick for harassing you so soon and in such an aggressive way. All companies have to factor in working capital into their business plan.

JemimaPuddlePop · 28/04/2015 18:32

Yabu with your expectations of a week op.

I've always paid tradesmen there and then, on the day the work is done.

I don't see why asking for cash is dodgy either.
Maybe he's skint and his account is overdrawn. Maybe he needs cash to buy supplies and would rather not have it credited to his account and then be charged by his bank to withdraw again. Maybe he's oldschool and prefers visible cash because he thinks transfers can be reversed (they can't at customer request, but lots of people don't know that).

I think a few of the comments are way ott tbh, calling the op 'disgusting' and the like. Maybe thoughtless, but she's not refused to pay at all!

MagratGarlik · 28/04/2015 20:59

Surely his reasons behind wanting cash are completely irrelevant to the issue? The worked was completed, invoiced and therefore the money should then be paid in a timely manner. If the op used this trademan a handful of times previously (as stated), she would have known his payment preferences?

MagratGarlik · 28/04/2015 21:16

It's also possible that if the op didn't realise bank transfer wasn't an option, that this is because the tradesman (who had been used previously by the op) had waited longer than reasonable for bank transfer from her before and said therefore this time cash only. I do this with notoriously late paying clients too, because I don't have time to chase up bank transfers from some people who routinely pay several weeks late.

Fairyliz · 28/04/2015 21:31

What I would really like to know are the contact details for all of these tradesmen who are skint living on the breadline.
I have been trying to get loads of jobs done for ages and find it difficult to get anyone to come and when they do they charge about £200 for half an hours work. Not many poor tradesmen around here!

SanityClause · 28/04/2015 21:51

Yes, most tradesmen expect to be paid immediately. In fact, they often expect payments on account during the course of their work.

The self-same tradesmen will often expect to have six months or more credit when paying a professional person for their services, though.

(Haven't said all tradesmen are bad payers. I'm sure no MNers and their partners would be rubbish payers - goodness me no!)

flowerygirl · 29/04/2015 07:41

That is very true Fairyliz My builder was always bragging about which restaurants he'd taken his wife to for dinner.

MagratGarlik · 29/04/2015 08:53

But it doesn't matter how rich or poor the tradesman is! Nor is it relevant why he wants payment in cash - there was agreement for work to be done at a certain price, the work was completed and hence the money owed should be paid!

No-one says, "well Amazon is so rich and avoids paying taxes with various tax-dodges so it's OK to wait a while with payment after I've received the goods", similarly with Tesco or many other large companies.

Quite simply - he does the work agreed, in the manner agreed, within the time agreed and the client pays the amount agreed, in the manner agreed and within the time agreed. Simple.

TwoOddSocks · 29/04/2015 09:12

The cash thing is clearly a red herring, if you think the person is dodgy choose a different trader but if you agree to a cash payment you should make a cash payment. I can totally understand why they want prompt payment. It's stressful having to keep track of who owes what and chase people up. They have no idea whose going to try and get out of payment and they probably have workers and bills that need paying, supplies to buy for the next job etc. Better just to pay on the invoice day.

FryOneFatManic · 29/04/2015 09:39

The OP says they didn't mention wanting cash, so yes, the chasing up was unreasonable so soon and before the OP had chance to go to a bank.

We've had work ongoing, and pay by bank transfer as agreed in advance, but if someone tried to tell me after the work is completed that cash was wanted, then they'd have to wait as I don't keep much cash in the house.

So for me the key here is to agree terms before the work begins (and get it in writing if necessary) and then pay promptly when it's completed.

HSMMaCM · 29/04/2015 09:40

There are so many people on here assuming you were warned in advance they wanted cash. If they don't tell you in advance, then they can have a cheque or transfer on the day, or wait until you've had a chance to go to the cashpoint.

MagratGarlik · 29/04/2015 09:47

But, the OP used the same guy before. So she must therefore know his payment preferences. If he suddenly changed to wanting cash after accepting bank transfer before, I'm betting the OP was previously unreliable with paying by bank transfer (which would also explain the very fast chase up of the cash, too).

MyOneandYoni · 29/04/2015 09:51

Recently, I have found that tradesmen (plumbers) will stand over me, using their height and bulk, to ensure they get their payment IMMEDIATELY the job has finished. Always seems to do it when when DH is out.

CinnabarRed · 29/04/2015 09:59

Although I absolutely accept that most self employed traders who ask for cash are doing it for entirely legitimate reasons, but HMRC estimates that c.£17 billion of tax is underpaid by small businesses every year.

Some will be due to genuine errors, some will be tax paid late by businesses in trouble - but around half, £8 billion, is due to deliberate and illegal under-declarations of income.

Under-declarations of income can only occur when there isn't a paper trail, which is why I always ask for an invoice.

(Small businesses are involved in virtually no legal but morally dodgy tax avoidance, by the way - that's exclusively the preserve of large businesses and individuals.)

FWIW, I will pay by bank transfer on receipt of an invoice. Cash can be harder because I may well not have enough on me (I don't like carrying large sums of cash.)

SometimesTables · 29/04/2015 10:12

I always pay by bank transfer the same evening that the work is completed or when I receive an invoice if it's for a non fixed amount . I never pay cash and I'm never asked for cash.

Bank transfer is usually instant and a lot more convenient than cash. It also provides a record of the transaction. I'd be a bit Confused if someone insisted on cash.

TheMagnificientFour · 29/04/2015 10:28

Well my experience with tradesmen is the opposite ie they never seem to send the invoice straight away so I can pay them.
My dad even had to chase said tradesman to get an actual invoice 3 months after they had finished the work (and still didn't get said invoice for a few weeks)

If I had been in the place of the OP, I would have been very surprised to say the least!

Speaking as a self employed person myself:
As far as I am concerned, yes it would have been inapropriate for the simple reason that if you do send a cheque in the post, it will take longer to arrive, even if you do it on the day you receive it.
If the tradesman wants a payment on the spot, I would expect him to say so at some point (and not when he is ready to leave and has just handed you the bill).
If he wants payment in cash (the only reason I can think about why the OP would need to go to the bank), then it has to be said right from the start so the customer can get organised (and wonders if they are happy with it).
I suspect that that sort of attitude happens when tradesmen are struggling with getting enough work so they need the cash asap. The thing is with that sort of attitude, you won't get new work from that customer (I would have done the same as the OP re not using them again) AND you don't get referrals either (essential in a business).

FryOneFatManic · 29/04/2015 15:51

But, the OP used the same guy before. So she must therefore know his payment preferences. If he suddenly changed to wanting cash after accepting bank transfer before, I'm betting the OP was previously unreliable with paying by bank transfer (which would also explain the very fast chase up of the cash, too).

Not necessarily. It could be for several reasons, including that the tradesman needs cash for some reason, and is chasing all his customers because others are late payers.

And the chasing after just 14 hours, and overnight at that, is actually ridiculous. Depending on how much the invoice was for, the OP may not have been able to withdraw the required amount using a cashpoint. My own bank only allows withdrawals to a max of £250 per day.

MagratGarlik · 29/04/2015 16:50

It could be for several reasons, including that the tradesman needs cash for some reason, and is chasing all his customers because others are late payers.

Likewise, not necessarily.

The amount may only have been £20 - the OP hasn't given that info (so far as I can see), just as she didn't say that previously she paid in a timely manner by bank transfer, or whatever.

I'm simply saying that everyone is very quick to slate the tradesman, who apparently must be doing some kind of tax dodge simply because he wants cash, without considering that the reasons for his behaviour may be due to the OP herself. There are 2 sides to every story and all that, and all we hear is the OP's side, not that of the builder. I'm just putting alternative possibilities out there.