to home educate due to not getting a decent primary place?

[fluffymouse]

Reposted from home ed to get more responses.

Dd (4) did not get a place at our local school, which was our first choice, to start reception in September. I'm absolutely gutted. I felt that this school would really suit her, and the schools which still have places are terrible (London).

I'm on maternity leave and seriously considering home schooling her for a term, deferring her entry to less preferred school till December, and hoping a waiting list place will come up in the meantime.

Dd is extremely active, excellent motor skills, but speech and language is a bit behind (awaiting salt referral). We have tried gently introducing her to numbers and letters, which she is also learning at nursery, and she is making slow progress in recognition of these. She however hates picking up a pen. While she is able to write her name she usually refuses.

I was planning to do learning in a manner that suits her, through activities, going out looking at things etc as I know she would struggle to sit still. I however worry this would leave her I'll prepared when she does start nursery. I will also have a baby, who will probably be crawling by September!

Any thoughts? I am very new to this.

The language thing is interesting. I was terrified when we moved and two of mine were going to start at a very unique school (one in yr r) where there were an extremely high number of children from a lot of countries, who had spoken little or no English at all until turning up (with new children in every year group in every year not speaking English - the kids only spent a year there and moved on, so a continuous influx of kids with no English at all, throughout the school). I just could not see how it was set up to deal with English as first language kids - although there were clearly measures in place for ESL.

It was absolutely brilliant. i still don't know how they managed! But often we do have misconceptions about schools... I know I did.

Thank you madwoman. The schools we are looking at sound very similar: high EFL in all years and a very transient population.

I find this a very difficult decision to make.

Maybe I'm a 'glass half empty' sort of person, but I would start from the 'worst case scenario' and decide what to do should that happen, rather than start with a 'hope for the best'.

(As a bit of background, I HE'd DS temporarily in Year 1, and then qualified as a teacher. I have taught both in 'run a mile from' and 'very MN, MC' type schools.)

I'd start with 'What will you do if no new place has come up by the time you have to return to work?'.

If you would simply send dd to your allocated school at that point anyway, but she will have missed out on those first months of settling in, learning 'to be in school' etc, then you may gain very little - and may lose quite a lot - by not entering her straight away.

When you visit yiour allocated school - remember to book an apopointment with the SENCo about the SALT at the same time, because that will give you a really good 'feel' for how they propose to look after your DD - find out about how many children defer entry to December. It is OK to be one of 16 who enter at that point, but to be the only new joiner to a settled cass is not ideal.

If, on the other hand, you decide that this school really is wholly unsuitable, and long-term HE would be the preferred option at that point, then obviously starting as you may go on, but being prepared to change plans if you get in off a waiting list, would make much more sense.

Historic movement may not be a good indicator of future movement in schools, btw. We moved when DS was at the end of Y1. He waltzed straight into a place at our preferred school, no waiting at all, because his year had several children leave in R and Y1. DD got a reception place as a sibling, and we found out about that 2 days before the end of the summer term. No other child left DD's 60-strong year group until Year 3, so no other child got in from the waiting list for over 3 years...

(Wiould also say that the 'run a mile from' school I taught in had much, much better, slicker, more professional SEN support than anything the naice MC school provided. It simply did more of it, so knew what it was doing much better and had a much better handle on it.)

"Hakluyt it is always controversial to say why I don't like a school, but the local school available had 60% of children who do not speak any/very little English when starting according to the head. The intake is very deprived, with very low attainment on entry."

What sort of KS1 and KS2 results do they get? And what's the value added like? Remember that very many ESL children will have very committed parents- and children's language comes up to speed very quickly indeed!

The overall value added of the school we are considering is 101.4, with 71% getting level 4 in English and maths.

I'm seriously considering sending her, as home educating is not something I would be able to do long term.

"Learning through discovery"? I'm sorry, that's utter bollocks. That's not going to do your kid much good if s/he hasn't "discovered" the things necessary to pass their bloody exams, is it?

Send your bloody kids to school. I'm so sick of hearing this bullshit crap from people who think their kids are too "special" to be educated the same as everyone else. Teachers are teachers for a reason. You're not a teacher. What the hell makes you (general) think you can do a better job than someone who is trained to do it, exactly?

If she has speech and language difficulties then a school (with good value added which the one you are considering has) where the staff are experienced at dealing with those issues due to large proportion of ESL pupils might be ideal for your dd.

and completely separately to the OP, it is legally the parents' responsibility to educate their child. Maddie - being blunt it sounds like your friends'child wouldn't achieve much in the way of qualifications anyway if the support and discipline aren't there. At least she won't be disrupting the education of others.

Hakluyt it is always controversial to say why I don't like a school, but the local school available had 60% of children who do not speak any/very little English when starting according to the head. The intake is very deprived, with very low attainment on entry. I think dd might just coast while they focus on teaching other children English/bringing them up to minimum standards.

have you look at the progress made and the end results though? Speaking very little English to start with doesn't mean that any English speaking child will do worse. Yes the school probably has to focus to teaching those children English but only in the first few months as kids are like sponges.

OP, my ds1 was put into exactly the kind of school you describe - majority of intake ESL, high deprivation, low attainment on entry. I cried.

Four years on, I cried with relief when ds2 got into the same school because it's amazing - wonderful, committed teachers, lovely ethos.

Ask around, but don't be put off (especially if the naysayers are remembering a bad rep from years ago).

That is a good value added figure, btw.

Thank you tea French and others who have given reassurance re the local school.

With this in mind I will be viewing it again.

Viewing again seems a good plan. I'd also check if there are any school fayre or sports day etc you could go along to will help you get a real feel for the school.

Teacher training is mostly about classroom management maddie, why would anyone need training to he? Nobody trained you to teach your children to talk, walk and anything else they might have picked up before Reception age. And as for not discovering the right things to pass their exams (because obviously every school educated child passes them all with flying colours), well, if they need their bloody exams then with their love of learning and motivation intact they'll study for them, for themselves and jump through that hoop of their own accord, won't they? Might I suggest you do a bit of research into the outcomes for autonomously educated young people before spouting such ill informed opinions?

There's also the cultural angle - I really love that my DC are meeting lots of kids from different backgrounds.

And I agree (having seen it in action) that it's not where the pupils start from - it's where the school gets them to that matters. The naice tiny mc school I wanted adds far less value and is far more homogenous. Also doesn't have such good facilities - our school has a brilliant head who really knows how to go for funding and use it well.

Definitely get a feel for the place - atmosphere will tell you a lot. Good luck

Maddie

Teacher training in no way prepares you to H.ed what a bizarre suggestion.
How on earth could it be applicable, any examples?

Maddie, I have HEd and have now trained to be a teacher.

I was a pretty successful home educator, and am a good class teacher - but they are very, very different skill sets, even though I was firmly at the 'structured' end of the HE spectrum.

It is interesting to hear how different the skills are for home educating compared to teaching. I genuinely had no idea.

Thank you again to those who suggested looking at value added. Interestingly this school has a better value added than my first choice school.

I think the local school is doing the best in difficult circumstances, and is improving. The head was very open that a lot of the children come from very difficult backgrounds.

fluffy

When we started off, I spent the whole summer holidays preparing lessons, making plans, even a scheme of work. This is typical of what a class teacher would do.
It was a complete waste of time, even though we wanted to provide a structured education for dd.
It just didn't work out and we realised that a more semi structured method was appropriate for her, with some subjects being completely autonomous.
I would say that from a structured pov, it was more akin to a support worker or TA role.

maddie

If you consider H.ed to be bullshit, why bother posting. As for your other comments well, I have never met or heard of anyone who thinks their child is too "special" to attend school.
I suggest you do some research, then maybe you won't come across as so silly.

maddie you're being completely over the top. A primary teacher trains for one year before being qualified, they are also shared between 30 other kids it's more than possible that a parent can teach themselves to educate their kid without an official qualification. They have the benefit of a lot more time with their child, a knowledge of their personality, the flexibility to delay reading and writing which happens far too early for most kids.

There are advantages for mainstream education too and I doubt I'll be home-edding my son but your statements are just ridiculously one sided.