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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To not pay for this damage?

28 replies

fadingfast · 19/04/2015 21:40

Probably an academic question as I expect it will be taken out of the deposit anyway, but not sure if I would be unreasonable to argue that we shouldn't have to pay it.

We hired a filthy church hall for my dc's birthday party. My mum was on hand to help and was cleaning up in the kitchen afterwards. When wiping the inside of the oven door unnecessarily, it seems that she knocked one of the frankly inadequate plastic fittings holding the inside glass panel in place without realising. When she shut the door, the panel slid out and smashed on the floor. On investigating further, it appears that one of the four fittings was missing. In other words, only three of the four were in place and then she knocked one of the three off.

Do you think this is something we should be held accountable for? Mum is adamant it was not her fault. She was quite shaken up about it.

I can see both arguments: it wouldn't have happened if the fourth fixing was in place, but it wouldn't have happened if mum hadn't knocked the third one off...

The woman in charge of the hall is a bit fierce and I will have to deal with her on an ongoing basis so I wondered about offering half as I'm a total coward.

What do you think? ?

OP posts:

DownWithThisTypeOfThing · 19/04/2015 21:44

I think if it wasn't in perfect condition and there was no warning about needing to treat it with particular care then I can't see how it's your mum's fault. Cleaning an oven door isn't unusual activity.

Catsize · 19/04/2015 21:49

I suggest a conversation like this...

'Hello Mrs Fierce, thank you for letting us use the hall. We are sorry but the oven glass has shattered - my mum didn't spot that there was a problem with the door and the glass came away and shattered. Luckily, please don't worry, Mum wasn't hurt. Very sorry.'

If she suggests you pay, a 'you're not serious in the circumstances are you, given the door was already damaged, nobody told us, and my mum could have been badly hurt?'.

Bad publicity by word of mouth is damaging to fierce ladies.

MissPenelopeLumawoo2 · 19/04/2015 21:49

I can't see it was our Mum's fault either. It was hardly brand new, and sounds like it was not in good condition. Is that not just covered by fair wear & tear?

ragged · 19/04/2015 21:52

How much does the glass cost, really? I think I'd feel better about just paying for it.

But hand on heart, if I was sure it was very faulty before my mum touched it, I'd probably say something like "we went to open the door and the glass slid out, seems like the fittings were missing, we found one on the ground."

Fat ass lie, I know.

maliaki · 19/04/2015 21:53

Not your mum's fault if damaged, fierce owner is very lucky mum wasn't injured or she'd really have to explain why she hires out a hall with faulty or damaged equipment.

ItsNotTrueThough · 19/04/2015 21:54

I wouldn't expect to pay for it in the circumstances. I would dispute any charges.

AmateurSeamstress · 19/04/2015 21:55

Possibly unfairly, I think it might depend how much you paid for the room hire. If it's a bargainous £5 per hour job, & someone has given up their free time to open up for you etc, I think you should cover it because the new glass would be a big dent in their limited funds. These halls run because of volunteers, and are an asset to the community, and no one replaced the 4th clip because 3 still did the job.

If you paid £30 an hour and it's a much more professional setup, maybe you could argue it more.

Original poster

fadingfast · 19/04/2015 21:55

I have already emailed just to explain (factually) what happened and that there was a door fixing missing. I haven't said anything about paying for it but I did say that mum was shaken up. I have suggested she call me if she wants to discuss it I will probably not answer.

OP posts:

Imnotaslimjim · 19/04/2015 21:56

I'd go with raggeds reply tbh, unless you've already told her about it. Mum doesn't know for sure that she knocked it, so fierce lady certainly can't prove it

Koalafications · 19/04/2015 21:59

Personally, I would pay for it.

Stopandlook · 19/04/2015 22:00

Sounds like oven was very flimsy and not fit for purpose.

Charis1 · 19/04/2015 22:26

Catsize, I don't think bad publicity by word of mouth is likely to be very damaging to someone in charge of the key to a church hall, it is likely to be voluntary, and would be much easier if no one hires it!

Original poster

fadingfast · 19/04/2015 22:28

Just for context, it's not exactly a community enterprise (run as a non-profit making business). We opened up ourselves (and had to sweep the floor etc before we even started on the party preparation), but we did only pay £35 to use the hall. I think the glass will cost around £30-40 to replace. We paid a £50 deposit.

OP posts:

Original poster

fadingfast · 19/04/2015 22:29

By which I mean the manager and staff are all paid a salary - not volunteers.

OP posts:

Charis1 · 19/04/2015 22:33

how can there be a paid manager and staff at a church hall? I very much doubt it.

DesperatelySeekingSanity · 19/04/2015 22:42

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster

fadingfast · 19/04/2015 22:46

I don't know the exact arrangement but I think it WAS the church hall but it is now leased to a childcare group who run it as a non-profit making business (probably outing myself completely now!).

OP posts:

Inertia · 19/04/2015 22:53

I might be tempted to contact the owners first to outline your horror at the unsafe fittings in the oven, and asking for the details of their most recent health and safety inspection as your mother was fortunate to escape injury.

musicalendorphins2 · 19/04/2015 22:56

They rented out a hall with a faulty oven, and just lucky it didn't pop out when it was hot and cause an injury catching someone with a pan of hot food off guard.

The glass in our oven would never come out, you have to take the door apart if you want to clean in between the glass, that one in the hall sounds unsafe to begin with.

musicalendorphins2 · 19/04/2015 23:03

A google search has surprised me, apparently this is a common thing! I had no idea! They even sell special glue for glueing the glass in when the seal no longer holds the glass in place.

CheapSunglasses · 19/04/2015 23:10

If your mum had been hurt by the glass then the owners of the hall would've been liable.

They were negligent in not making sure the oven was in proper working order.

Don't pay them anything. Tell them to fuck off and that you're lucky you're not suing them.

And then tell them to cry to a small claims court who'd tell them exactly the same.

CheapSunglasses · 19/04/2015 23:11

*they're lucky you're not suing them!

Grapejuicerocks · 19/04/2015 23:50

I don't think you should pay either. You should play the, it's very lucky she wasn't hurt, card.

Original poster

fadingfast · 21/04/2015 17:23

UPDATE: I went to see the fierce lady today, who was entirely reasonable and apologised about the oven and said she would arrange for our deposit to be paid. Perfectly civilised conversation and didn't need to argue our case at all .

OP posts:

Vycount · 21/04/2015 17:38

Oh no, it's just not good enough. Another thread peacefully resolved.

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