Forced to change my days at work.

[PiperIsTerrysChoclateOrange]

I work set days which was agreed with my manager when I came back off maternity leave 8 years ago.

Had a meeting last week and another one tomorrow.

I know they can do this as my contact doesnt specify days just hours.

If I don't agree I will have 13 weeks to find another job or my contact will be terminated.

The reason is because it no longer fits in with with the nature of the job.

Union said there is nothing I can do also acas.

What's the point in all these policies if an employer can basically force you to change hours worked.

Is everyone being asked to do this 4 week rota?

It does sound as if your working pattern does not fit in with business needs.

Nobody likes having to work shifts, or weekends, but it is one of the ways businesses are developing to meet the demands of their customers.

Is this a fixed rota, so that week 1 you work shift X on days A, B and C or does it vary from month to month?

The 13 week thing sounds very much like an NHS policy op, if it is NHS it'll be in your contract that changes can be made at any time with appropriate notice, which they are giving to you. Are you with the NHS?
I know when a service I delivered was restructured I had to change accordingly. It is annoying on a personal level, but ultimately you have to roll with the changes at times (or look elsewhere), unfortunately especially in the current job climate.

I have a child with ASC so I sympathise on that point, but...

You asked for flexible working when you came back from maternity, they were flexible and agreed.

Now further down the line they need you to be flexible and you don't agree.

Also the reasons you've given have nothing to do with your child, but to do with your social life. You'd have to cover school holidays in your current position so that can't be taken into consideration.

It might seem unfair, but the business employs you to meet their business needs. Either accept it or find another job that better suits your needs.

Varies.

I'm in the UK.

Surely holidays will be honoured. Are other people's shifts changing also? Can you work something out with them?

I'm sure your booked holidays should be honoured if they have been previously agreed.

I wouldnt worry about your request to wait until August being unreasonable, just ask. The worst they can say is no.

So for the last 8 years your employers have made a special exception for you - you are in a post where everyone else has to work on a 4 week shift pattern with variable schedules, but you have been allowed a fixed schedule.

Tbh I think this is mainly a lack of communication issue. I think your employers never intended for this to be a permanent arrangement. They have been a bit unreasonable in not being explicit about that, and in springing this on you unexpectedly. However, they have not been unreasonable in wanting your position to be filled by someone who can fully meet the needs of the role without further special dispensations. From their point of view, you've had 8 years to get to a point where your other commitments can fit in with your job, or if not to change to a job which doesn't require you to have special arrangements. Eight years is a very long time to put up with an arrangement that doesn't really work for them. They are at fault for not making it clearer earlier that this arrangement couldn't last forever, but not for wanting the change.

I feel for you but YABU.

I see this from the other side. In my office, very few people work full time. I'm one of the few that does.

It is a nightmare on Mondays and Fridays as barely anyone is in. Same amount of work but nobody to do it, as most of the staff only work tues, wed and thurs.

In my case - public sector, very understanding of the need for flexible working - the needs of the business are not balanced.

I can see why your employer is trying to balance the needs of their business, and think that you have been very lucky to have had this same pattern for 8 years so far.

The 13 weeks to sign a new contract or you're out, is correct unfortunately. It happened to me in an old job. You either agree to the new terms, or you don't have a job. The union said it was above aboard.

It sucks. What is the point of a contract, if employers can change it whenever they like, with three months notice.

I think the ops point about holidays is that they aren't booked because at present she doesn't need to book holiday at weekends because she doesn't work then

If you only get 4 weeks notice of your rota though, how do you know that you're going to be needed to work on the dates of weddings/birthdays/etc?

Assuming there is a valid business case for change - as employers would not generally relish the idea of going down the formal consultation route unless it was absolutely necessary - then you need to think about how you could work with them to make the new proposal work. If not, then you will be given your notice if you don't accept the changes.

Some ideas might be:

Starting after summer so that you have time to settle your ds and honour the existing childcare arrangements you have

Agreeing a fixed 4 week rota so you can plan your childcare

Agreeing 1 fixed day and be flexible in the other 2? Do you have any family or friends that could help with your son who may be more flexible than formal childcare?

Agree to their proposal in term times but request a fixed rota in holidays?

No real advice, just commiserating. I understand how bloody frustrating this can be.

I've had crazy changes made with both hours/days at work and also locations. It was all to do with the NHS trust putting contracts out to tender, and then half of the teams jobs being taken over by another agency, and now everyone just has to work when and where they are sent, often seemingly at random. Money saving, and temp contracts. It's utter chaos.

My experience in the Civil service was that it was written into PT contracts that the hours could be changed at time by the employer, including a return to Ft working for business needs.

If the business requires the workforce to be more adaptable by adopting a shift pattern and everyone is going to be working shifts within the next few weeks then I don't see how it would be practicable or fair for you to remain on your fixed hours/days working schedule. If one person is allowed to do this, then you'd have a really disgruntled workforce if they weren't allowed to do the same.

it is going to impact on everyone, especially over the summer. I really wouldn't try to resist the change by trying to get it delayed for 4 months. If there is a business need then the change needs to be introduced now, not when it suits you.

Sorry I do think yabu. The business has honoured it for 8 years. If the business can not work with you doing those anymore, it can't put your needs in front of that.

Its crap, I have been there, but there isn't much that you can do. Definitely ask about deferring it until August. They can only say no.

Still don't understand why you can't look for a job with a more convenient routine?

I think you would be reasonable to ask for the end of August But they would be reasonable to say no.

If you are being offered 13 weeks that takes you to July so you could ask for the extra 4 weeks or so.

You may also show willing by offering any weekends or weeks which you could be flexible between now and then to start getting your DS use to the changes.

These things are give and take - but you need to show willing.

And they sound like they have been very reasonable already for the last 8 years

Probably because mid week jobs that finish at 3 are like hens teeth....

Unfortunately it's the way of the world that most people work sometime at the weekends. We're all consumers demanding service 24/7 so it stands to reason that there need to be people to serve us.

How can anyone do a job where you don't know which days you will work until four weeks before? That makes childcare impossible, surely? You can't shift days with a nursery or childminder every month. How can you make any plans for trips away or weddings or similar if you don't know which days you will be required to work? That's insane.

All I can think of is that it may be discriminatory against parents because of the impossibility of organising childcare. But presumably the union would have advised if so?

All I can think of is that it may be discriminatory against parents because of the impossibility of organising childcare

Are you being serious?

Lot of people in shift work juggle childcare, have to be creative. Friend who was air stewardess (with pilot husband) said the airport nursery was completely flexible about flexible booking with only 4 weeks notice, because they had to be for the airplane staff. She had her parents as occasional backups.

Would it be common with a nursery or childminder arrangement to have already booked & paid for childcare 3 months in advance (summer)?

My rota works a bit like this. In fact I haven't got my May rota yet, probably get it next week and I've worked in other places similar and manage just fine - although I get 2

It's just alien because you aren't used to it

sorry misposted

I get asked when I can't work each month.

I think asking until post august is reasonable; unsure if they'd go for it tho

Yeah. Based on some equality training ages ago that said something about employers not being able to impose shift patterns that would be impossible for parents on the grounds that it would be discriminatory. Perhaps I'm remembering it all wrong. I was told something on those lines, but maybe it was about not being able to change people's hours on their return from maternity leave or something?

Anyway, regardless of childcare, I think it's insane that they can announce people won't ever know which days they'll be working more than four weeks in advance. How does anyone plan their lives at all? Why can't they do a fixed rota?

You can change people's hours on return from maternity leave if you can demonstrate that the needs of the business have changed.

Well - sorry for you but really - I worked ten years solid opposite DH and his rota over which he had no control and I had minimal control over mine. Business needs came first. Childcare was a fucking nightmare - awful and sometimes hair raising in it's last-minuteness but we did it and came out the other side. I understand you have DS's extra needs to take into account but nothing is impossible, you'll just have to find a way round it. Or find another job - which you say you can't but you don't say why.