To wonder if holiday revision classes for Y6 are really a good idea?

[DrSeuss]

The primary school where my daughter is currently in Y4 are running revision classes on three days of this week. Two hours a day by invitation of the class teacher if she judges that a child will be helped by this. I commend the teacher for giving up holiday time for free and am delighted that she cares so much but I am still unconvinced that ten and eleven year old children should be in school working while on holiday. The local secondary places children in sets from September using end of KS 2 results so I suppose they need the best possible results but I still don't like the idea of the pressure being placed on them, even though I am myself a teacher.

Are other schools doing this? Are people sending their children to revision classes? Does it not all seem a bit much?

Never forget who gains from decent SATS results. Not the child, who actually will be pretty unaffected either way, but the school, whose levels of progress depend on it.
Decent schools that are doing their job shouldn't need extra classes for SATS!!

Slightly off-track here, but in Australia, NAPLAN, similar to SATs is used to track attainment, though privacy laws prevent schools from accessing data form the primary school record .

However, to my point, addressed by MrsCake; one of my Year 7 students a few years ago said wouldn't it be in the school's interest for them to bomb in Year 7 so as to show improvement later.:o

YANBU

Sats results are for the benefit of the school not children.

Not like GCSEs which have a real impact on future outcomes for the children

MrsCakesPrecognitionisSwitched - no it's not bollocks that some predictions are determined partly by this… but it's a very poor teacher who sets their actual predictions wholly by this input and communicate that expected result to the student (and parents if appropriate) without explanation.

That makes laurierf, thanks.
I suspect that some my strength of feeling comes from my DCs classmates being under the impression (not sure if that is from parents or teachers) that failure to get a "good enough" SATs level will result in them not getting into their preferred school. When state secondary school (where they are all going) places are a done deal 2 months before they even sit their SATs...and SATs results aren't part of the admissions criteria . That sort of misinformation seems plain cruel to me.

My feeling is this: I agree that we in England/Wales (confess to not being knowledge about Scottish/NI systems) are test-based, test-focused, fairly rigid etc… would love to see a more Finnish-based style of education (but of course we don't have a society anything like Finland's)….so, you know what… that is the reality of the system we have here… So some kids need some extra help to get to grips with that paradigm and not to be written off as 'a bit slow' because they are bright and they have the knowledge and they don't know how to express that knowledge within the rules of the game… some kids are only getting taken to one side a couple of months pre-GCSE to be told they have the work ethic, and the background knowledge, but they're just not there with exam-taking technique… let's hope it's not too late..! Because that is the reality of GCSEs and I think it does matter to most people who took the time to post on this thread. If a teacher is offering up 6 hours for free to some kids to help them catch up outside of the large classroom environment… well, who can say for sure that their motivation is… but it's voluntary on their part and non-compulsory not the parents/students part… so…

(obviously unedited premature post!) so I'm not sure we can complain too much. I don't think all state primary teachers are offering extra help purely to boost SAT results (in fact I know that not ALL teachers are giving up their holiday time for that purpose).

I would support these extra tuition sessions wholeheartedly if they were aimed at the children who are struggling. Those, for example, who have the potential to do better but cannot focus in the busy environment of a class of 30; or those who missed chunks due to ill health. But it's never these children who get invited to the extra-tu. It's the children on grade-boundaries, particularly the higher boundaries, who get invited.

OinkBalloon, so then the best option is to have these 6 hours across the holiday available to all kids, but to have different sessions available according to ability/working style.. no doubt the idea of streaming at this age is going to be even more abhorrent than optional extra hours though!

I would be against these being compulsory, but having them available as an option has to be a good thing. I think it could help level the playing field for kids from less advantaged backgrounds. At any rate, the decision can be made between the teacher and parent.

laurierf, it's not about giving help to those in need, but selecting those whose predicted levels/scores can be tweaked so as to give the school a better showing at KS2. That's why it's only six hours and revision, not developing fundamental literacy and numeracy skills. That's why it's being offered now, far too late to have any effect on students with significant needs.

None of this offered is about the children or their needs. The issue of providing holiday support classes for those who struggle in primary has long been recognised as a real one, but it's expensive. This is not what's happening here, such interventions would need to be systematic, year on year and start far earlier.

These revision classes are all about the SATs results for the school. They don't have the interests of the individual child in mind and the teacher probably didn't have much real choice over giving upon his/her time either.

It is ridiculous about GCSE targets sticking to them because of SATS- they will teach to the pupil they have then, and not what they are at 11yrs old- it seems to make out secondary teachers are stupid! My DS rose from 3rd Maths group to top maths group in yr 7 and got top grades in GCSE and A'level. It is utter nonsense to say that he would only be taught to a lower level!
It is scaremongering.

The SATs matter to the school -I was astounded when a teacher friend told me that they had extra classes next week. They are having them because they are likely to be in special measures if they don't get good results. Nothing to do with the children- all to do with Ofsted.

I have twins so I see target setting, subject setting and their relationship to SATs results. From our perspective, comparing their reports, their targets are not related to their SATs as closely as some suggest. However their primary school still heavily inferred that their sats level would be crucial in determining their educational success
It's fairly obvious for a level 3 versus a level 6 will in all likelihood have different outcomes but I'm less prepared to believe that there is a significant difference on the outcomes between children who receive a level 4a and a level 5c - yet the school will spend lots of time attempting to get level 4a up to a level 5. Pity your level 4c dc because they will get no extra help, even if they have the potential. Dcs who fail to reach level 3 at our school were not taught at all during Sats prep, they hung out in other classes, so as to avoid disturbing the rest of the class.
This is a numbers game for the schools, to suggest otherwise is naive - why leave learning to Easter, Year 6, what was wrong with teaching properly throughout their years at primary? Some dcs will gain form this no doubt but they are the dcs who will boost the schools stats, that's the criteria that is being applied to their selection for extra tutoring hours.....it's a shit, shameful system.

YABU - It's voluntary so you don't have to do it! An optional 2 hrs a day for 3 days is hardly a sweat workshop.

Not offered at our state primary although my YR6 DS had quite a load of SATS revision homework set. I reckon it's taken approx 4 hrs but it's out of the way now and we don't have to take it with us on holiday tomorrow.
Literally, from half term onwards, the school has piled on the SATS related homework from having very little homework. I don't really mind since come Sept, YR7 will bring an hour's homework per night so doing 30 mins daily now should break him in gently without it being such a big shock to the system.

It would be interesting to hear the opinions of people whose DC sat 11+ entrance exams. DS definitely did between 1- 2 hr's work daily in the leadup. I commiserated with my BF who lives in SW London - her son spent 12 mths in advance and he sat 5! Both of us jokingly commented when we spent New Year together that YR6 SATS would be a walk in the park in comparison.

DD sat 2 11+ exams. She did about 2 hours a week additional work, none during school holidays. TBH she is finding SATs much more pressurised, probably because her classmates are getting so hyped up about them and the school is making them into such a big deal. 11+ preparation was spread out over the best part of a year, very gentle, lots of time off. SATs preparation is much more intense, much more stressful, lots of talking about it with friends, comparing results of mocks and practice work, who is doing which extra preparation breakfast clubs, who is doing level 6...but hopefully only over a 4 month period.

OP, why are you worrying about this now?

Your DD is in Yr4. Things may be completely different in two years' time. Even if they're not, your DD may not be offered the classes.

Are the Easter holidays really that boring already?

What isn't voluntary, is these kids being subjected to pressure throughout Year 6, to perform well in the SATS. As someone said upthread, it should be the measure of four years' teaching and learning but its not, its a few months of concentrating on pulling up the 3's to a 4, 'plugging gaps' in knowledge to make sure everyone 'performs'. Months of mock papers, tests... No wonder secondary schools view results with scepticism

sansou, none of this is about its voluntary nature, but its purpose, which is all about the school and nothing, absolutely nothing to do with teaching and learning. It's all about the school.

11+ is quite another thing as it least directly to a different school.

SATs don't do this.

Leads, not least.

Agree with other comments that it's nothing at all to do with 'helping kids'. It's purely for the SATs results. My DS's class has English and Maths 'booster classes' after school two days a week. He was invited for both but the one day meant missing football club, so I said no. He went to the other one twice but we (me and teacher) agreed by mutual consent that it wasn't helping him. Translation - they realised he wasn't going to get the higher grade they were pushing him to get, so there was no point doing it.

They have a maths 'booklet' to get through this Easter holiday. It came with a note saying, and I paraphrase, 'It's SATS week after Easter, and the kids are doing really well, but in our experience a two week break can set them back significantly, so could you please do a page a day to keep them on track.'

Luckily for my DS we are going away for a week and there's no way I'm going to make him do maths when he should be paddling in the sea and crabbing.

our school are doing this - 4 sessions after Easter from 9.30 until 12.30. Encouraged but not enforced, we have to pay but it is reasonable and school are transparent about what the money will go towards.
Most of the children want to attend - mine didn't want to until he found out his friends are going, so now he is going to 2 of the 4.
There is no particular stress attached to any of this..

So, is anyone on here going to take a principled stance and encourage their YR6 DC NOT to do any SATS based revision homework set this Easter holiday or indeed at all?

I also hate the fact that so much of Yr6 is taken up with practising for SATs.

However, we also see a great deal of angst on this site from parents who will do anything to avoid sending their DC to a school with poor results - even pretending to have a religious faith seems perfectly acceptable.

Where do people think those good results come from? You can't have it both ways.