to be pissed off that DH has had a bonus cos tax credits will take loads of money off us

[FuckingTaxCredits]

have nc doubt the dm readers will be out in force for this one

dh has had an annual bonus of 2700

which should be awesome news but I nearly cried when dh told me

as this happened a few years ago as well, and i know that when I do our tax credits renewal they will end up royally screwing me up the ass and taking loads off us. even though dh will prob come out with 2k, max, of his bonus, if he is lucky, but tax credits will take the whole amount off us

so it will hit ME in MY pocket cos dh is doing well at work

bonuses should be just that, a FUCKING BONUS

so pissed off

So what is the answer? Going back to basics?

What does that mean Brain?

It's a tough one and I don't expect to win popularity contests here, but speaking as an anarchist here!

Taxes should be paid to provide an "acceptable" (whatever that means) standard of living for all...

Healthcare should be free for all....

Children have a right to free education and food....

Pensions must be guaranteed....

Holidays are a luxury and thus should not be covered by govt payments.

In passing - I earn a ridiculous salary and have never claimed anything from the state, but I despair on reading some of the attitudes about what people feel they are "entitled" to - you are "entitled" to nothing (as indeed am I)....

And yes, I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one....

The 'entitlement' notion was borne of expensive government advertising campaigns. So if some parts of the populace have taken that message on board and adopted the language, I'm not going to hit them with a big stick for it.

Holidays are a luxury and thus should not be covered by govt payments.

Some people will always be more gifted and parsimony and budgeting than others. I don't see how you legislate for that TBH.

In passing - I earn a ridiculous salary and have never claimed anything from the state, but I despair on reading some of the attitudes about what people feel they are "entitled" to - you are "entitled" to nothing (as indeed am I)....

It's certainly a more comfortable feeling earning too much to qualify. But I can't be smug about it.

Tax Credits stopped a hole in my budget when I was a single parent. They subsidise the inadequate wages paid to people doing vital jobs. If wages were livable they wouldn't be needed.

I don't understand why we would want to punish binmen, cleaners, carers, shopworkers for daring to exist by leaving them at the mercy of the 'market'. We need them.

(Are you my brother Brian? You sound like him )

Borne? Born.

m.youtube.com/watch?v=8dllkfKg7B4

Tax credits advert above

Other adverts at the time showed Holidays etc

That's the ones Six

Ha! Thanks for the rational reply FA - I fully expect to be heavily criticized for my "fascist" views...
And of course you are right (apart from me being your brother, Brian, though I'd be happy to meet him!!)

Tax Credits stopped a hole in my budget when I was a single parent. They subsidise the inadequate wages paid to people doing vital jobs. If wages were livable they wouldn't be needed.

This is exactly why we (and Google, Amazon, etc need to pay taxes) - as a society, we need a safety net to help people through temporary periods when they need help....

I don't understand why we would want to punish binmen, cleaners, carers, shopworkers for daring to exist by leaving them at the mercy of the 'market'. We need them.

I agree totally - and don't think they should be punished (apologies if my message came across that way)? We should value all roles in society and pay a fair wage (again, whatever that is)....

And please, I'm certainly not smug; I appreciate how fortunate I've been - but I've worked hard and had the wonderful support of a great family....

Bugger - and I know how smug that sounds.... But you know what I mean....

The thing is Brain the low pay issue doesn't exist in a vacuum.

Public Policy has contributed to the current situation where hard work alone doesn't necessarily keep people off the breadline, despite national wealth and economic growth.

NMW hasn't been uprated to keep pace with the cost of living. Huge decisions about how to structure our labour market as a psot-industrial, non-manufacturing nation have been made. The rental market was deregulated to encourage BTL investment, which has contributed to housing costs rocketing. Public housing was sold off. Employment rights weakened.

Lots of people and businesses did very well out of the above.

Your average hospital cleaner wasn't responsible for those decisions but she suffers.

I like clean hospitals. You can't 'offshore' hospital cleaning.

I think work should pay.

but I've worked hard and had the wonderful support of a great family....

And luck.

And an ability/skill that the market values above other abilities and skills, presumably.

And reasonable health?

So much of life is luck....

Pfft. It's all spin and perspective.

I just don't believe in the myth of lazy unwashed hordes.

People want to do well, to work hard, progress, provide things for their families.

And luck, so true... But kind of disagree...

At this risk of being told to "get a room" (!!) I don't disagree with anything you're saying, and yes, I work in a sector/have abilities that are (financially) valued...

Back to your "luck" discussion... I've never had investments or property or whatever - I'm a classic "two-salaries-from-meltdown" kind of person - and I grew up on a typical council estate in the 1970's with cliche-ed villains and rogues as well as aspiring (and inspiring) people.. The "luck", I guess, is that I chose to hang around with the latter rather than the former, but I never will forget my roots, or lose appreciation of the fact that society is a melting pot of skills, abilities and opportunities....

cliche-ed villains and rogues as well as aspiring (and inspiring) people.. The "luck", I guess, is that I chose to hang around with the latter rather than the former,

But you know, choosing the hardworking crowd, working hard yourself, having passion, doing your best etc, will still, for some, always pay sub £10ph. Because of geography, aptitude, local ties, sector or whatever.

See? You've proved my point

"But you know, choosing the hardworking crowd, working hard yourself, having passion, doing your best etc, will still, for some, always pay sub £10ph. Because of geography, aptitude, local ties, sector or whatever."

I think lots of jobs pay less than £10ph because there's no reason/incentive for organisations to pay more when they know their staff will get tax credits to boost their income. So the minimum wage has effectively become a maximum wage for large sectors of society (bank tellers, teaching assistants, shop assistants, office administrators, waitresses, taxi drivers etc).

According to HMRC's latest statistics 4.6 million families were tax credit recipients as at Dec 2013, out of 17.9 million families in the UK - i.e. 26% of families got tax credits. The vast majority of them were in work, so I think they would disagree with a PP's description of them as "on welfare". It's just the way work is paid now - some by your employer, some by the state. As a result, employers get away with offering very little.

It's not the way I'd structure the system; but demonising those who are tax credit recipients and suggesting they shouldn't take their families on holiday is IMO unhelpful.

I get min wage, I dont think my organisation could care less that I get tax credits, the thought that tax credits allows businesses to pay low wages is a myth, businesses will pay as little as they can get away, with so long as there's people out there who will take the job, like myself.

I think the cut of payment of £26k applies only to benefits for non working people. Working benefits don't seem to have a cap, The system is so complicated I don't think anybody understands it not even the people working out the amounts.

I think the cap is 26k for one child families and £34k for two child families

thats the amount you can earn before tax credits stop

that is, unless you pay out for childcare

just found this....

Child tax credit.

You can currently get some child tax credit if your income is roughly £41,300 or less. From 6 April 2012, for most people, this limit will dive to the following:

If you you have one child, the maximum income to be eligible will normally be £26,000 a year.
Two kids: £32,200
Three: £38,800
Four: £45,400
The figures are a rough guide provided by HMRC. The thresholds for some are different, say, if you pay for childcare, are disabled, or have more than one child.

Exactly, of course most households with kids earning over £45k can probably only do so because they do pay for childcare. Which I where incomes of £72k start qualifying.

Interesting; and am aware I'm hijacking this thread, but an income of circa 40K is not bad? Am I so out of touch, ssd?

See the table I'm looking at for the threshold doesn't tally with that one. Unless I'm looking at the wrong one?

www.which.co.uk/money/tax/guides/tax-credits/child-tax-credits/