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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

builders not working the longer hours they said they would do

28 replies

sPJPPp · 19/03/2015 17:31

I'm having some work done, was at home for the first few days to supervise and all was well. As I only get 20 days holiday I can't afford to waste time sat at home I've left them during the day. They said they would work 8-5 and in order to leave early on Friday, i said fine. But I have home security so can see they are working more like 9-3. There is two of them, aibu to expect them to be able to fit a small kitchen (laminate floor, some wall tiling and pluming) in a week and have time for extra tasks like hanging a curtain pole and a mirror? They say they haven't had time for this but I know they've been doing 3 hours less per day than they said they would so I'm pretty angry. I'm paying them 350 a day.

Should I confront them about this tomorrow or just chalk it up to experience of being didled out of a few hundred pounds of labour? Its their last day tomorrow. The job was to do the kitchen and a few odd bits around the house. Looks like all they will do is the kitchen, the bare minimum. I haven't seen them in two days, just had to phone them as they leave / arrive before me.

OP posts:
LaurieFairyCake · 19/03/2015 17:34

Next time pay for the job and not the daily rate

Yes, they've taken the piss.

steppedonlego · 19/03/2015 17:36

Work out the hourly rate and then pay them by the hour. Did you do a contract stating working hours?

Original poster
sPJPPp · 19/03/2015 17:52

Contract was per day. I guess I could do that, but I'm rather conflict adverse.

I'm actually quite upset, I've let them bully me about the design of the kitchen. Where they have plonked the dishwasher and washing units in the middle between the units they stick out a lot and ruin it. Should of stuck to my guns and had them put where I wanted and not cared a damn if it makes their life more difficult.

OP posts:
MinceSpy · 19/03/2015 18:00

They decided to work a nine hour day so they could knock of early on Friday so four days at nine hours equals 36 hours plus four hours for Friday, total of 40 hours.

They work 4 x 6 hour days + early Friday finish = 28 hours

40 hours at 43.75 and hour = £350 per day = £1750 for 40 hours

28 hours at £43.75 = £1225.

You can evidence the hours actually worked. I'd then pay a handyman to put up the curtain rail and mirror.

miniavenger · 19/03/2015 18:58

If they aren't working their contracted hours then it's not that tight a contract, surely? Especially if you have cctv to verify it. I think you should get this moved to Legal asap OP.

Original poster
sPJPPp · 19/03/2015 19:13

Thanks for that mince, looks like I've been had by quite a lot :( apparently they left at three to get some supplies, but no way would that take 2 hours as the shop is 10 mins away and they didn't return after

I kinda would be OK with it, if they had done what I wanted, but they have done whats easier for them, giving me not exactly what I wanted

OP posts:
MinceSpy · 19/03/2015 20:06

OP sadly it does. It makes me so mad as it gives decent tradespeople a really bad name. The builders that refitted our bathroom were brilliant and I was happy to give them positive feedback and recommend them to friends etc.

missingmumxox · 19/03/2015 20:46

Hahaha, just came to say they will tell you they went for supplies, but they already played that card.

My argument would be 2 are not needed to "get supplies" I would want to see the receipt as presumably they need it for their accounts.
What they supplies they got as if not for your job can't be charged against it.
Get difficult with them, too many trades people do this and think it's acceptable which causes issues with honest tradespeople who they undercut on quotes.

PurplePITA · 19/03/2015 20:58

I would ask them to make up the hours tomorrow. I usually pay day rates and haven't ever had a problem with it. I'm not shy to spell out my expectations though.

They are trying to take advantage of you.

kewtogetin · 19/03/2015 20:59

Never ever pay by the day, pay a set price for the job, however long it takes them is then up to them and you don't end up paying through the nose. Believe me, after renovating a 4 storey, Victorian house that used to be 14 bedsits I have learnt the hard way! Taken for a ride once, but never again.

Original poster
sPJPPp · 20/03/2015 06:47

Well thy did come from a recommendation, but that was by someone much older and who supervised them. I paid a lot more for them because of this recommendation and that they would be fine if I left them and went to work. I haven't seen them in three days and I'm sure bi won't ever again. I expected them to be here when I was back at 5 everyday, but they have just pissed off not bothering to work the hours agreed or to even have communication with me. Didn't answer mobile when I called.

I guess at worst I'm down 500 on labour and another 300 to fix what they haven't don't properly.

I might just have to chalk it up to experience and be glad I didn't waste 25% of my holiday to supervise them. Not the worst but still fucking pissed off with myself. Its the most I've ever spent on a single thing, after the house, so expected to be really pleased with the outcome, its 6/10 the kitchen they will have delivered today probably. No attention to care and detail, lots of the units don't shut well.

OP posts:
Nospringflower · 20/03/2015 06:55

Don't pay them it all until you get things fixed to your satisfaction. I don't like conflict either but would try and assert myself when paying so much and feeling ripped off..

antumbra · 20/03/2015 06:57

Big mistake paying them a daily rate. No pressure there then- in fact it's in their interests to spin out the job. I have learned through expereience.

Only agree to pay for a set piece of work- it's up to them how long they take. Funny though tey seem to work very quickly this way!

MinceSpy · 20/03/2015 06:59

Having read your updates I wouldn't pay them anything. They need to finish the job to your specs and sadly that may mean taking time off to supervise.

TeaOneSugar · 20/03/2015 07:05

Do you have a trusted trader scheme locally, I always find someone from ours, you can see comment from past customers and add your own, they don't want bad ones so it's a bit of a guarantee of not being ripped off. Better than just one personal recommendation.

miniavenger · 20/03/2015 10:04

Speak to the CAB OP, don't pay them anything more than you have- you owe them nothing. They haven't worked for the money they've been given in quality of quantity.

Sadly, recommendations can be great but not all fantastic at times. My DH was shafted by customers he was recommended to.

LaurieFairyCake · 20/03/2015 10:10

If the units don't shut well I'd prepare a snagging list and hand it over and ask what day theyre coming back to fix it.

Never 'if' they're coming back to fix it. And say nothing else. Obviously you don't pay them until youre happy and I would say to them that obviously you won't be paying until this list is completed.

PurplePITA · 20/03/2015 12:15

Did you pay the whole lot in advance. All the builders And tradesmen I use I pay by bank to bank transfer after the work is completed by and when I have an invoice. Did you pay in cash? And did you get receipts?

If they have ripped you off then you could consider the small claims court. Keep copies of your security tape and photograph everything.

Adjusting the unit doors is the type of thing you would often leave until the end of the job. It's often quite easy - try youtube.

Zilverblue · 20/03/2015 13:10

They're starting too late. Most builders/roofers etc I've ever had start at 8am or earlier, and leave at 4 or earlier. That seems to be their standard sort of hours. They start really early. Perhaps one of them could confirm.

Never pay a daily rate.

Original poster
sPJPPp · 20/03/2015 17:48

Thanks everyone, thank god I haven't paid them a penny yet! I sent them a list of all the things they had done wrong and said I need them fixed asap else I will deduct the cost of getting another person in to do it plus the cost of me taking unpaid leave. Surprise surprise they have fixed 3/5 of them and said they will be back tomorrow.

I'm so glad I was assertive about this, was so upset at the amount of money I've spent on it and then not being put in well. Now just to test the pluming they redid and make sure it works!

OP posts:
miniavenger · 20/03/2015 18:02

Ask thm for a total breakdown of costs too OP.

LaurieFairyCake · 20/03/2015 18:05

Really well done you Smile

I also hate that sort of confrontation

MinceSpy · 20/03/2015 18:43

Well done, just don't cave in. Grin

Fannydabbydozey · 20/03/2015 20:45

I'm seeing red for you. We had a builder do our bathroom and cloakroom along with some other stuff and by the end of it I wanted to KILL him. I couldn't supervise all the time and I knew he wasn't working when I wasn't there. One day i went out but waited in my car on the street and he left ten minutes after I did and didn't come back. After that he promised to be more reliable... but he was in wickes every other sodding day. One day I saw him on the hill opposite my house with his lover - he was supposed to be in Wickes again. I ended up suing him as my bathroom was a huge fire and electrocution risk and he plumbed the shower pump into the mains causing a massive flood. He was a total cock. He disappeared to France after we won the case refunding nothing, natch. He came HIGHLY recommended on another parenting site, by various people allegedly. After I made them investigate, it turned out all the recommendations were from his wife. Yeah the wife he was cheating on in my sodding paid time. It has put me off having anything done to my house ever again.
We're supposed to be having a double height extension done. I. Cannot. Face. It.
Well done you for standing up to the lazy bastards. Can people keep posting good experiences please as two people I work with have just had extensions done and both times it has ended in tears with builders. These are nice people with realistic expectations. Surely it doesn't have to be this way!

Original poster
sPJPPp · 21/03/2015 09:25

Gosh fanny that sounds awfulFlowers maybe try taking others advice and getting tradesmen from personal recommendation s?

Mine is no where near as bad as that they are just finishing off now, probably got all the hours I paid for. Things aren't perfection, a few things could be better but seeing as I left them and went too work can't blame them too much, they just should of called for every little decision and they didn't.

These builders are OK, they've done a decent job, they just took a few shortcuts while I was not there. They really needed someone to crack the whip! Ive gone from being in tears to pretty happy. Looks like in total its cost about 2.5 k for everything (kitchen units were donated). I've known people pay 3-4 times that for a pretty ordinary kitchen tbh. It all worked out and I have learnt a lot!

OP posts: