Women who have vaginal/clitoral piercings.....

[TheFecklessFairy]

are, next month, to be classified by the Department of Health as having undergone FGM. What the actual??

In the words of one comment on the news story:

It's a bit like saying having you ears pierced is the same as being beheaded.

I suspect this has happened because the only way to actually, in legal terms, stop proper FGM is to remove the issue of consent and broaden the definition of "mutilation" to cover the appropriate types of surgical interference.

Look at it this way. How do you actually identify FGM? What needs to have taken place? Because if it is an opened Pharaonic (the most radical), the woman will probably have piercings through her labia (where the labia was stitched together) and removed inner and outer labial tissue.

So to recognise that instance as FGM, the definition needs to include labial piercing and tissue removal. Now what creates the difference between an instance of labial piercing in FGM and an instance of labial piercing for personal cosmetic reasons? It is consent.

But the problem is that if you recognise that "consent" matters and turns an instance of piercing from an illegal act into a legal act, then you will find women that have suffered FGM will be forced into claiming they consented ... hence you will struggle to prosecute cases of FGM and people will carry on doing it, because they know if the woman says she has consented, nothing will happen.

And so, the only way to stop FGM and prosecute it is to remove the issue of consent, which then means that any instance of removed labial tissue or genital piercing therefore becomes evidence of FGM, iyswim.

And to be honest, I think, as women, if we have to forego genital piercing and designer vaginas so that FGM can be prevented in this country, then I think that is a reasonable price to pay.

say you took it out (piercing) for the smear etc then couldn't some staff then jump to some conclusion that something has been done and as you say little blips start going on your profile.

I've had lots of smears and gynecological procedures and I'm pretty sure nobody has ever looked closely enough at the clitoral area to determine that I've had a piercing a VCH and have removed it for the examination.

Puzzled as mutilation means "To injure severely or disfigure, especially by cutting off tissue or body parts. "

Piercing does not injure severely, and if the jewellery is removed then the hole heals up. How is that disfiguring, injuring severely or cutting off tissue or body parts?

Piercing does not remove tissue, FGM does, it seems like a clear distinction.

Why muddle up the two, I'm still not convinced, but I do see how the consent can be hard to establish.

What I don't understand is why this proposed legislation is so sexist.

No, fuzzy thinking if you ever move from the terrifying mutilation that damages a woman's body forever... And a piercing which is just like ear piercing but on a different piece of skin.

And no. This is not a sacrifice we have to make otherwise we can't solve the problem of FGM, it just isn't.

Think about it. Rape is an issue of consent yes? So by one posters reasoning, remove the issue of consent so we can prosecute rapists? Does that sound right?

Eroding women's right to control of her body (oh and little things like her privacy & dignity) in the name of giving women control over their bodies... It makes no sense and its dangerous in that it gives away women's right to decide what happens to their own bodies, 'for the greater good'. Except it's not going to work as piercings are not FGM, so:

1. Women's rights have been swept back years (?centuries?) for an illogical reason that will not address the issue they are trying to address,
2. There can be no 'greater good' that involves taking away women's liberty.

So, I got my piercing a long time ago, and I went with a male friend to a specialist and reputable piercing place, and we both had a genital piercing. We both came out giggling and a bit sore but secure that we'd made a good choice for ourselves. I wanted mine done as a statement of my identity, for myself, to myself, and chose an area of my body that was intimately mine, and that would not show in daily life.

So why a decade on, is my male friend unaffected by his choice, and I am now in fear of having my rights as a human interfered with? Why is it just me who cannot get basic screening now for fear of the consequences? Is it just me who has been told by the government that my consent to having something done to my own body is irrelevant, and that the government have more power over my body than I do in this respect?

Can anyone tell me why it's not my friend going through this now? And why, exactly, this is not a massive breach of my civil liberties based entirely on being a woman???

And on a side point, does anyone know if a private gp would be bound to report me if I had a smear outside of the nhs?

Miscellaneous - an interesting post, comparing this with your male friend. A good point too about the private GP. These are questions that need answering otherwise a fear that tragedies are bound to happen. Women will decline smear tests and intimate examinations because of this, and that is going to have consequences.

So many people feel strongly about this, but it seems that we have little or no voice.

AnotherGirlsParadise
"I used to have 16 genital piercings, 15 of which I performed myself. Where will the law stand on THAT?!"

I'd say wherever it is standing, it is standing with its legs empathetically crossed.

at FickleByNurture. Mine were way less trouble than any other of my bits I got pierced. Ears never healed and tongue took 3 weeks of hell - swallowing felt like stabbing knives, I had a temporary lisp and every time I opened my mouth I jetted spit like a venomous snake (like you do sometimes when you're eating a toffee) and the dentist made me take that one out!!! Ooh you've made me wonder if I can still get the tongue one back in - took it out about 5 years ago. Will maybe have a go later!

Eww no - I don't think I'll try that again! I found my bars but it's been so long I can't remember what went where! Think I found my tongue bar. It pushed in so far but felt a bit weird so stopped!

I've "repierced" some of my sealed holes. Hurt like buggery.

FickleByNurture Not a desirable experience then

Isn't it possible to get your cervix pieced which really is horrendous if true?

Just checked - apparently cervical piercing is possible and anal.

Don't Google cervical or anal piercing....

Boak

You can also get a Princess Albertina piercing, which is a ring between your urethra and vaginas.

For some reason auto correct thinks I have two vaginas

WHY IN THE NAME OF GOD WOULD YOU WANT TO DECORATE YOUR CERVIX?

What next, hanging up a few pictures and putting up a set of curtains?

"WHY IN THE NAME OF GOD WOULD YOU WANT TO DECORATE YOUR CERVIX?"

A vision of ducks on a wall flitted through my mind....

Well, the entrance to the vagina is called the vestibule, so....

Mine's a bit like a set of curtains - could do with a good dusting

It's depressing, people are confusing their own personal feelings about piercings and their impressions of a fringe culture, with the basic human rights of women.

I mean in general, not on this thread :)

I like the idea of curtains and a dado picture rail ...

I have had major vulval surgery and have enough explaining to do everytime I see a doctor or nurse - including full medical history, why am I covered in scars, why are my labia slightly different, no I didn't waste nhs money, yes I did have it done in an nhs hospital - without having to explain I'm not a victim of fgm as well. For gods sake..

It's basically so that the official statistics will show big bad whitey as the group doing the most FGM and reflect negative attention away from the group that is actually doing real FGM.

Fickle

I once performed an anus piercing. First and last one. The guy came into my studio and asked how much I'd charge. I was so taken aback - this was quite early on in my piercing career - I said £300. I also told him about the massively high risk of infection, rejection, and gave him about 15 minutes of chat about why it was a Very Bad Idea. I didn't believe for a second he'd follow it through.

He fucking followed it through. He was very pleasant and very clean, and apparently he kept the piercing for quite some time, but NO I do not want to make a habit of piercing ringpieces. Twelve years and a vast amount of learning later, it's definitely not something I'd consider doing again.

Now I need some . And where's the [mindbleach] emoticon?