To ask this question about Guide Dogs?

[MarvellousMarbles]

Did you know that you are not supposed to touch a working guide dog in harness?

I am asking because i am a new guide dog owner, and approximately 10 to 15 times a day, someone will come and pet my dog without asking me. I know they mean well, but it's really distracting/confusing for my dog, and that makes things more difficult for me.

Is it that they don't know? I thought nearly everyone did, but perhaps I am wrong!

CaT and Elements, it is sad that there is still such a level of ignorance.

As for store staff like that M & S lady, I just wonder how the hell she thinks guide dogs (or other assistance dogs) learn how they are expected to behave in department stores or supermarkets. Logic dictates that exposure and conditioning from an early age is key, or the dog won't have a clue later in life.

I see the occasional trainee guide dog puppy in our local Tesco. Clearly the store manager there uses some common sense on the issue and doesn't make an issue of it.

Some dogs look sad, some don't. That's part of the appeal of, say, basset hounds. Golden retrievers, on the other hand, always seem to look happy. I don't know if golden retrievers are actually happier than basset hounds. (Or how one would even try to answer that question, you can't exactly give a dog a questionnaire about how happy it is with its life. Well, you could, but it would probably just eat the questionnaire.)

Are most guide dogs in the UK Labrador retrievers? Yellow Labs seem to be the most common kind of guide dogs I see here in the US.

I saw a chap in the supermarket the other month with an epilepsy dog - I had only just heard of them, and was gutted he was too far ahead of me in the queue to collar him and interrogate him chat about it.

I didn't know the exact 'rule' but common sense has always dictated to me that you don't distract any kind of working dog.

Guide dogs mostly breed their own these days, lab x retriever are most popular, along with labs or retriever only, but lady near me has the biggest GSD I've ever seen, and she's only tiny! In France they seem to use poodles and collie too, but not come across these breeds as guide dogs in UK, although have as other assistance dogs

Geeky, many are Labradors or lab//golden retriever crosses here too. Often yellow, but not always. I knew of black and chocolate ones too.

Occasionally other breeds too. When in the vet's waiting room with my pet Labrador some years ago I saw an enormous German Shepherd which was also a guide dog. It was wearing the harness.

German Shepherds and German Shepherd crosses make excellent guide dogs, but aren't used so much nowadays, because guide dog owners are less keen on having them than labs/retrievers. Apparently that's because the general public react badly to seeing GSDs around, because they think they're dangerous.

That's rather a sad situation isn't it!

I knew, I think we might have done something about guide dogs at Brownies, maybe even had a visit. I actually haven't mentioned guide dogs to DD, we've not come across one since she's been born, but probably should find some video clips to show her and chat about it.

My son has a guide dog buddy dog (transitional for future guide dog ownership) they have don't distract me on their harnesses... In my experience a lot of people know you shouldn't pet/feed but they decide the dog has a crap life "working"and decide to piss the owner off on purpose in protest these dogs are happy and enjoy life, a lot of people also believe the dog is owned by the charity therefore everyone's to pet! Either way it drives me mad

I didn't know that but do now

I knew not to touch/disturb/feed them.

funny how people think they are unhappy dogs. In my experience the happiest dogs around are those who have solid routines, lots of exercise, good training and boundaries so they can always be 'good dog', and a job to do that uses their brains. I've always thought guide dogs must be very content.

I think you're right, reading. A guide dog would not work if it wasn't happy to do so, it's as simple as that. You can't 'make' a dog guide. One of the reasons dogs are rejected from training is if they're not happy doing it.

In my experience they are happy and it's sad to hear some of the stories of owners being abused by members of the public, told they are cruel for having one etc... They have great family and social lives in that they get to go everywhere

I have always understood that when the harness is on, the dog is working.

I regularly see a chap in my village with his dog, and sometimes when he hears me say to my own dog, no you can't play, come on, he will stop and take the harness off and let her have some down time playing.

We regularly got pups in training in the shop where I used to work too, and it was soooooo hard not to cuddle them to death!

I was a small girl when I read about Emma, the chocolate lab guide dog puppy.

The story was written by her eventual owner and her puppy walker contributed the stories about her puppyhood.

That's how I learned about never distracting a working service dog.

Oh, and I'm secretly squeeing over your dog, if I see your guide dog. I don't do it out loud, because I don't want to embarrass you or distract your dog, but I'm thinking "Squee! Cute doggie!"

I knew, my friend's mother used to train guide dogs so I knew from her and I would instinctively never touch one anyway, just would feel wrong.

I'm not too surprised that lots of people don't know though, I can't remember being told it other than knowing a trainer. Although I may have just forgotten that I'd been told elsewhere.

Oh my gosh. I did not know that. I wouldn't approach one if someone was walking along, but if they were in shop standing in queue or something I might have done so. I haven't ever been in that scenario so haven't but didn't know...

Dizzy, I don't suppose your sons buddy dog is called Angie?

My aunt puppy walks and had the biggest dog ever to go into the London centre, he was like a small pony! We'll get to see number seven at the weekend, she's a black lab and very cute, but still a bit scatty.

I've always known not to disturb working dogs, but like others don't know where I was told.

I know this too. I think my Mum told me but I'm not sure.

I used to get the same train to work every day and got to know a woman and her hearing dog. That was a lovely dog, but I always asked her if I could give him a stroke first.

They stopped coming after a few years and I always looked out for them on the platform until I moved away.

Rebel but I presume you didn't engage with the owner before assuming that it was ok to feed his dog even though you knew he couldn't see you doing so? you said you feed your own dog titbits all the time, but here's the difference, it is your dog. this was not.

But let's just address this issue of feeding guide dogs to anyone who thinks that I am in the wrong for calling someone who feeds a guide dog an idiot:

So I have a guide dog. I take him all sorts of places. One of those places is an event where one particular person always gives the dog a titbit (or two) from the buffet. The dog becomes used to this ritual and gets to know this random individual. An individual who has never engaged with me but feeds my dog on the sly. One day we are out and about to cross an extremely busy road, and as we cross, the individual who randomly feeds the dog is crossing in the other direction. The dog knows him/her, they know that they always get food from him/her, they become extremely distracted, refusing to cross in the direction I want to cross because they have seen their friend with the titbits. And thus I am put at risk in the middle of a busy road because someone decided that it was ok to randomly feed my dog and create an association between themselves and the dog without either my knowledge or permission.

Or:

I go to an event where there is a buffet. someone gives my dog a quarter of a pork pie and he gobbles it down. Then someone else sees them doing it and gives the dog something else, and so the evening goes on with random people feeding the dog because they've seen someone else do it. And by the end of the evening I have an over fed dog who has had numerous random rich foods he is not used to, who then goes home and throws up on my carpet, or worse, in a public place where it causes much embarrassment and general tuts from the public... and is sick the following day meaning he goes without his regular food to allow his stomach to settle.

And it's the underhanded way in which people feed the dog. If someone asks "can he have a biscuit/chip/titbit," I will say no and explain why. But why should I be tolerant of someone who would happily take advantage of the fact I can't see them and feed my dog both without my knowledge or my consent?

The only person who is allowed to feed my dog treats outside of the home is my vet

as for why GSD's are not used as regularly, there are numerous reasons:

Firstly they are usually very large dogs, which makes them more difficult to accommodate e.g. on public transport. I have a friend with a gsd who is twice the size (and weight) of my lab retriever cross, his dog can't tuck under the seat for instance whereas mine can be almost hidden from view without being tripped over by the public.

And they are actually incredibly difficult to train with owners because in generl gsd's are one person dogs and thus they find it difficult to separate from their trainers during training and to then bond with their owner. My friend with his gsd still has to have his routine aftercare (where guide dogs come to assess whether the dog is still working safely) from a distance, so the trainer arranges for him to do a route and then watches from a distance so the dog doesn't see (it's not his regular trainer but the dog still has associations with guide dog cars, uniform etc) and then meets friend afterward to discuss how the walk went. And his dog has been with him for five years and is very much bonded.

And the public do find them more intimidating than labradors so dare I say it, the more gsd's there were the less people would probably donate. ..

Yes, I knew this. At junior school, we would raise money for GDBA and would visit the puppy training centre (or at least that's what I remember it being, the one in Leamington Spa) frequently. My 8-year-old bedroom was covered in pictures of cute little fluffy puppies that grew up to be guide dogs.

There was also a blind man who lived very near the school and he would come in once a year to give us a talk and explained the whole "in harness" vs playing on the field and how he coped with poo etc.

Slightly off topic, but I used to have a colleague with a guide dog. The dog would sit under the large table in meetings and often you'd feel his tail wagging between your legs in the middle of a meeting. :-)

I just asked my Ds ( 10) if there is anything he wouldn't do if he saw a guide dog. He said "I wouldn't go up and pet it" I asked why and he said "because it would confuse the dog". I then asked how he knew this and he said ( wait for it) "common sense" He is being a smart arse actually because I'm pretty sure I told him when he was younger!