WIBU to ask school if they take summer birthdays into account?

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And I mean just to enquire, not complain. I have a daughter in year 7, her birthday is 29 August. She does pretty well at school and left primary with 3 level 5s. Two of her friends achieved a level 6, they both have September birthdays.

Last month the more able children from her year were invited on a science trip, my daughter wasn't included even though she is working at the same level as some who did go. However, I am aware that they have to draw the line somewhere and if they are just pipping her then so be it.

I am tempted to ask the school if they ever look at the data for those invited on the trips for more able children, is there a notable difference between the number of autumn born and the summer born? I realise that there will be a lot of older children who struggle and summer born who fly but I'm taking generally.

I suppose what I'm getting at, is my daughter just going to miss out on these opportunities through her school life just because she is young? If she had been born three days later, she wouldn't have even done her SATS yet?

Read Outliers by Malcolm Gladwell

Husband is eldest of 4 brothers. The youngest - born in September - is least academic but most empathetic. The July born 2nd born is most practical. The January born eldest is most academically minded and the June born 3rd child is most athletic (and a pisshead).

There are so many more factors at play.

I'm a prem born August baby who struggled in my final years of secondary school. My twin on the other hand done reasonably well but struggled earlier

"I was a summer born child and never missed out on things for able children. I wasn't 'able' in every area of education but I WAS good at English and performing arts and the school recognised this accordingly.

I don't think it would of gone downhill"

Not that good at English.

"G&t is not pointless. It rewards all the smart children who are ignored the rest of the year. "

Seriously?! So those not classed as 'G&T' aren't smart?

And yes, month of birth is just one of a range of factors. And there are always summer born individuals who do well.

BUT, there are statistics that show at a population level, the average summer born does less well than the average autumn born.

www.ifs.org.uk/publications/4075

All children should receive the resources required to help them reach their full potential, be that average or gifted. Those who have a high level of natural talent should not be left to bimble along, achieving less than they are capable of.

Yes, I would agree with that TBF SoupDragon. The point I was trying to make (albeit badly and unclearly), was that a G&T child doesn't "deserve" a trip purely because they have used less money or resources throughout the school year than another child. And, indeed, that the presence of less able children in the class does not automatically mean that the G&T children are being deprived in any way.

I would totally agree, and hope, that the G&T child had still been given the resources required themselves.

All the statistics nationally show that there is a significant difference between autumn and summer borns all the way up to university. While the gap narrows over time it never disappears. Summer borns are 30% less likely to attend Oxbridge and less likely to attend Russell group universities (there are lots of other statistics I could quote). Summer borns are 80% more likely to be diagnosed as having SEN. The differences are so extreme that the GCSE and A-level exam boards have called for an enquiry and suggested scaling up the grades of summer borns. Grammar schools already scale up the marks of the younger students as they consistently under perform and without this scaling they would be filled predominantly with autumn borns.

I assume that the persisting difference cease to be due to development (certainly at university an 18 and 19 year old should not be significantly different) but due to persisting disadvantages of having started school too young.

Also just a personable irritation. There is absolutely no benefit whatsoever of quoting personal anecdotes - you can learn nothing general about them. There will always be smokers who like to 98 and people who swim 5 miles a day an eat healthily but die at 52. In order to actually draw a logical conclusion you need to look at large scale statistics.

There is a campaign to relax the strict cut off dates.

summerbornchildren.org/about/

Its led by Pauline Hull who is an experienced campaigner - her twitter is @paulinemhull

DS is a 1st Sept baby. We had a choice of Aug or Sept so will always wonder about the whatifs. We went for Sept over Aug partly because we felt it better as it was closer to his due date but also because of the school thing. We wanted him to be confident and physically mature; it was less to do with academic issues. If DS turns out to be like his father we may well regret that decision. DH is extremely gifted and ended up behavioural issues because he got bored and got no support. He was a June baby too.

So I see the need for catering for younger, less mature or less able children AS WELL as older or more gifted ones.

If we are being properly socialist about it we should pander to the needs of ALL children rather than strive to make all children average and in the process hinder some or to only be proud and interested in those who excel academically.

Every child deserves the opportunity to achieve their potential.

I think there has to be more done to be more flexible about education.

Also people say "there has to be a cut off" but there is actually not true. In most countries school starts significantly later so the developmental differences are less significant. They also usually allow a flexible system (In Scotland, USA, Australia, Germany and indeed most other countries) parents can elect to delay the year of school entry for their child. This tends to even things out since the younger kids who are most advanced (and would be bored were they to be delayed) enter school and can keep up with the older ones. The less advanced summer borns delay a year and become the eldest and are able to keep up with the younger more mature kids.

It is only the UK that has the "summer born" affect. Other countries with a slower entry to formal education and a flexible admissions system do not see the younger kids in the year disadvantaged.

Hi. I would definitely say something. The more parents speak up the better the situation will be for the younger ones - emotionally, socially and academically.

Not relevant to the OP but compulsory school age is the 1st of January, the 1st of April or the 1st of September after a child's 5th birthday, you do not legally have to provide an education until then, and can deferr school entry until legally required to provide an education.

Something for all parents to consider, especially those of late summer born babies.

They'll still go into Reception, enterthedragon. What advantage would there be in starting late, when all the other kids had already formed friendship groups, learnt phonics, etc? The child would still be the youngest in the class, as they have to stay in their year group irregardless of what part of the year they actually start.

Flogginmolly, there is no statutory barrier to a summer born child starting in reception at CSA (i.e. the September just after they turn 5).

You can apply to delay your summer born child to start in reception at 5. At the moment, it is very much a postcode lottery, but more and more parents are requesting and being granted a delayed start for their summer born child.

Equally, many are being denied a reception start and being forced into Y1.

The 'Flexible Admissions for Summer Borns' Facebook campaign has much more information about it.

I am REALLY against any change in the system to allow parents of DC born in the summer months the option to defer.

I would add the caveat that premature children whose due date would have placed them in the year below had they not arrived early should be allowed to defer into the 'right' year. Properly prem by definition - arriving before 37 weeks. There should also be flexibility for children with SEN.

But if the majority of summer born children are allowed the option to defer then I think we might see a situation where most do so, not a problem in itself BUT those who are doubly disadvantaged by their background won't be deferred so now they will be the youngest potentially by 15 months. It's these children who we need to protect otherwise the gap will just widen.

Yanbu,

Toobreathless

I was going to do a Clarkson but then I read your caveats, with which I agree wholeheartedly (my son is a deferral success story).

We requested a deferment, sheeplike, and were told no, under no circumstances. That was four years ago though; but I don't think it's changed since in our borough at least (West London).

To be fair compulsory school age is the term after a child turns 5.

So summer born children who start school in the September after they turn 4 are, by definition, starting early.

I also don't feel the majority of parents will delay their summer born children. A more flexible system works well in many other countries. Plus we have one of the youngest school starting ages in the world. I think it's this, combined with the new curriculum and focus on testing that is really failing our young children. In countries where they have an older starting age, more flexibility in starting age and better kingergarten provision, the youngest in the year do not perform significantly worse than the older children in the year.

Flogging - there was a revised admissions code in December 2014. Basically saying each case has to be looked at individually, and a blanket 'no' rule is unlawful.

Some authorities are allowing it (based on parents choice and headteacher agreement) and other parents are fighting tooth and nail in other counties.

It's been in the media a lot the last couple of weeks and there was an Education Select Committee about it last week.

Things have changed quite a bit in the last couple of years, albeit for some (but not all).

Anyway, I'm going off topic, sorry OP!

Ah, fair enough, sheep. Too late for us, sadly.

Surely she has had the same amount of education as her friends? As in started reception and carried on through school etc. she has also had the same opportunities and although wasn't picked for this trip I bet she has been picked for other stuff in the past when her friends haven't.