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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

(Who)IBU? Me, Dsis or tenant?

41 replies

GoYourOwnWay · 06/03/2015 18:12

NC because i'll obviously be outed.

My Dsis rents a property which is a studio flat meant for only one person. In the past she has had a couple living there which goes against the contract rules but so be it.

The contract states that you cannot smoke in the apartment and u have to give 3 months notice if you intend to leave. The last person living there (single student) clearly smoked in the apartment as the walls had gone yellow and my Dsis caught her smoking (admittedly not in the apartment itself but just by the door when a new tenant was coming to inspect the place). And also, said tenant had not given her three months notice but 1 week notice that she was leaving.

At the final inspection my Dsis told her vocally (i.e. nothing written down) that she would refund the woman's deposit which is in the region of £800.

Now this woman (student) is arguing that Dsis has to give back the deposit as she verbally said she would. But Dsis is arguing that nothing was signed r.e final exit check and this woman broke the original contract anyway (Not enough notice and she smoked.)

I'm thinking that as Dsis had told her she would refund deposit she should still refund at least some of it but at the same time I realise the woman had broken the contract.

Just want to know who is in the right as I can't believe Dsis would steal from a student who already doesn't probably have enough money to buy a bottle of water!

OP posts:
19lottie82 · 06/03/2015 18:53

I think your sis is going to rent this flat out again she really needs to brush up on the legalities of being a LL, because from what youve told us, she really doesn't have a clue and is leaving herself open to a whole load of trouble.

fredfredgeorgejnr · 06/03/2015 18:57

unizoomiThis The 3 times is the maximum penalty (minimum is 1) I'd say by ignoring the rules, trying to grab it all rather than her costs and not being in a position to pay it into a scheme that the max penalty is quite likely. Haven't all the cases so far where it was never protected resulted in 3 times penalties?

And the penalty is just that a penalty, the original deposit also needs repaying although obviously she may be able to get some back, but as she can't protect it now, it's very unlikely...

OP, if you are trying to help your SIL, tell her to pay full deposit immediately, if you're trying to help the tenant, tell her to make a claim for a penalty.

Feckeggblue · 06/03/2015 18:58

My Understanding is the deposit isn't registered . It doesn't matter as such where the cash is held

Umizoomi- the terms of contract which are stated to have been broken here aren't legally enforceable. The judge won't give a fig.

It's unlikely she can claim for a full repaint from the deposit. The tenancy deposit scheme would be likely to recommend it's cleaned off (I had a judgement for a painting claim although not related to smoking- they didn't even come near awarding it)

GoYourOwnWay · 06/03/2015 18:58

Dsis is not subletting on the low. Just she sees that basic tenets of the contract were broken therefore anything goes.

The deposit wasn't secured afaik. The tenant was in a rush to leave her previous place which i guess smoothed things along but still. I know some money went into repainting and other things etc but I cant believe that would just be the end of things.

OP posts:
Feckeggblue · 06/03/2015 19:01

So has your sister already spent the deposit cash? Shock

CactusAnnie · 06/03/2015 19:02

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

londonrach · 06/03/2015 19:02

Seriously op your dsis could now be in serious problem. Tell her to give full deposit back and keep fingers crossed tenant doesnt take it further, unaware of law. Shes lucky if she gets away with this. (Dh is property lit lawyer as most of my post will show we rent (london property prices) but ll dont realise dh knows law inside out). We cant ever take it further as effect,affect dh job but anyone not linked to law....

YesIDidMeanToBeSoRudeActually · 06/03/2015 19:05

Amateur landlords. Sigh.

Sorry but she has been incredibly irresponsible and I hope the tenant gets clued up - your sis could be hit with a serious financial penalty.

I wonder if she even got safety checks done, or an EPC. Apart from the financial implications of fucking up the deposit, she is committing a criminal offence if she hasn't had safety checks. She could be in serious trouble if the tenant takes this further. And rightly so.

The sooner renting is fully regulated, the better.

pinkyredrose · 06/03/2015 19:19

Hang on does she own the property? Your OP stated that she rented it so gave the impression that she rented it herself and then sublet.

Did you mean that she lets the property not rents it?

HighwayDragon · 06/03/2015 19:57

Yeah if I knew my landlord hadn't protected my deposit I'd be putting a claim in

specialsubject · 06/03/2015 20:05

there is quite a lot of regulation for landlords (as there should be) and it sounds like this person has broken much of it.

gives the rest of us a bad name, and more ammo to those who want to bring in the wrong kind of regulation. Enforcing what there is would be good.

the tenant only needs to be aware of her rights to do just that.

UptheChimney · 06/03/2015 21:16

the deposit went into the landlords personal account. No intermediary

Illegal now, AFAIK. Your sister is walking a fine line in the legality of her business dealings.

It would be reasonable to withhold the deposit until, after redecorating & to compensate for the void in rent caused by not giving 1 month's notice. Then return the balance.

But if the deposit was not in an authorised secure deposit scheme, your sister could be sued. Big time.

holidaysarenice · 06/03/2015 22:13

The deposit can go into your own account as long as you register, it's called custodial versus non custodial.

Vycount · 06/03/2015 23:40

Out of interest Op, do you know if your sister has given the tenant a copy of an electrical safety certificate within the last 12 months?
If your sister has as vague a grasp of the law around letting to tenants as you seem to then she needs to walk away from this one, giving the full deposit back. Then do her homework before she lets again.

TheSmallerBadger · 06/03/2015 23:44

Is this in the UK?

PresidentTwonk · 07/03/2015 00:33

She can afford to smoke so she can 'afford a bottle of water'. Surely if the deposit in a scheme they deal with it? Not sure how it works but landlords can't 'steal' deposits from that kind of set up!

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