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AIBU?

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Original poster

£125 to review my contract on my flat?! What the fuck?!

74 replies

RestingFuckFace · 05/03/2015 11:37

Is this real?!

Ive lived in many properties, but never had this.

My agency just called me, said Ive lived here a year, do I want to renew for 6 or 12 months? I said 6. He said thats fine but I will have to pay the fee twice in a year.

What fee?

£125.

What for a piece of paper and black ink?

Yes, that's correct. Hmm

I told them Id get the paper and black ink. He said I was paying for a lawyer.

WHAT?! What are they on about, is this correct? I don't remember anything about this in my contract, but I supposed I must have fucking missed it. Im going to look after DC's lunch.

OP posts:
keepitsimple0 · 05/03/2015 15:16

rents in Scotland went up when fees to tenants were outlawed, because the agencies just doubled what they charged the landlords. Right idea, crap implementation.

did they really go up because of that? I would like to see that.

It's actually a good idea to make landlords pay the fee. The other way, you have the odd scenario where the landlord chooses the service provider (agency) but the tenant pays. Whenever you have a scenario like that, of course the landlord will be less price sensitive. This way, the landlord knows and pays all fees and is more likely to shop around.

specialsubject · 05/03/2015 15:21

re Scottish rents - see this (and many others). Survey done by a letting agent but rents are factual numbers, so limited scope for fakery:

www.independent.co.uk/property/tenant-fees-ban-has-speeded-up-scottish-rent-rises-says-report-9696298.html

would love to shop around for agencies; but as mentioned, in my area they all charge the same, the only difference is service and slime levels. Same in the area I came from.

so I chose the one that would enable me to give the best service.

LadyRainicorn · 05/03/2015 15:30

My landlord is an old lady who doesn't want to be bothered. I have a habit of expressing my situation badly when people make blithe assumptions about what I can do

NickyEds · 05/03/2015 15:47

Bloody hell, I'll have to tell my cousin about this. He's been charged £120 every six months for the last 4 years by his thieving bastard letting agent for renewing his contract. One year they didn't even re print it just literally put a piece of paper over the date and photocopied it. His ll is also one who really can't be bothered, he owns lots of properties and when my cousin got in touch he just said to let the agent deal with it.

specialsubject · 05/03/2015 16:01

there's no argument that there are crap landlords, who should be forced to do the right thing or get out of the business. The latter would be preferable as once a crook, always a crook.

the letting agencies should also be regulated.

that is what the government, of whatever colour, should be addressing. Removal of red tape and efficient systems to make things happen.

think we were promised that last time. Still waiting...

Crocodopolis · 05/03/2015 16:38

I had to pay £1000 last year to the estate agent to renew the lease with my tenants.

This year? I said the heck with it. I am going to find new tenants and let the house myself.

TheChandler · 05/03/2015 17:50

Regarding Scottish rents, particularly in Edinburgh, its well known that the current registration and licensing regime, which imposes far more stringent standards and requires far more local authority staff numbers to implement, is a large contributing factor to the rise in Scottish rents in recent years.

But the Scottish Government doesn't like facing up to that.

specialsubject · 05/03/2015 20:05

Chandler - has it improved standards/stopped crooks renting out dumps?

I hope so...

keepitsimple0 · 07/03/2015 10:44

would love to shop around for agencies; but as mentioned, in my area they all charge the same, the only difference is service and slime levels. Same in the area I came from.

does the study show correlation or causation? didn't rents rise all over the UK in that period?

Whether or not you shop around, the problem remains. A landlord isn't going to be price sensitive for something they aren't paying. If I had to guess, the fees the landlord pays to letting agents are going to be much more reasonable then 250 pounds for signing a piece of paper.

specialsubject · 07/03/2015 12:39

cobblers. The fees to the landlord are the same as those to the tenant so it is worth trying to get them down. If possible.

rents have gone up in much of the UK although it is all heavily skewed by the we-must-all-live-in-London heavy demand. You may notice that prices go up on most things. Scottish rental price growth has slowed dramatically, this could be due to the spike last year caused by the fees change, so by comparison it hasn't happened this year.

glad to see you read my other posts.

keepitsimple0 · 07/03/2015 23:53

The fees to the landlord are the same as those to the tenant so it is worth trying to get them down. If possible.

what does that mean? There are various fees that can be charged, some are paid by the tenant and some by the landlord. Does the agency charge landlords ridiculous amounts to sign a contract?

You may notice that prices go up on most things. Scottish rental price growth has slowed dramatically, this could be due to the spike last year caused by the fees change, so by comparison it hasn't happened this year.

So if prices go up on most things how is prices going up evidence that it was caused by anything in particular? it seems that a shock to the way fees are paid changed rents slightly, temporarily, maybe. I am not convinced that the conclusion is that they caused rents to rise (out of line with fees) or that it is bad to make landlords pay for fees by providers THEY choose.

the article itself doesn't compare this inflation to any other inflation for context, or even compare it to the rest of the country, so it's really hard to draw conclusions from it.

Huge renewal fees are just taking the piss. I can see fees for the initial tenancy as then the tenant can price that into the rental and comparison shop. But agencies have you over the barrel because very few people will move over a couple of hundred quid, as moving costs are much higher. I am surprised they don't ask for 400 quid. might as well take tenants for all they are worth.

SmillasSenseOfSnow · 08/03/2015 00:40

I LOVE the offer to knock the price down to £50. As someone else said - is the 'lawyer' OK with that? :D Good god they sound stupid.

GERTI · 08/03/2015 09:19

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

wowfudge · 08/03/2015 09:31

Keepitsimple - agencies charge landlords a minimum 10% of the monthly rent amount for 'management services' and will charge both the landlord and the tenant for a renewal. There is very little transparency with a lot of agents - they don't tell landlords what they are charging the landlords' tenants on top of what they are charging the LL. I have been a LL and just didn't appreciate these charges were being levied on tenants too at the beginning.

keepitsimple0 · 08/03/2015 10:41

There is very little transparency with a lot of agents - they don't tell landlords what they are charging the landlords' tenants on top of what they are charging the LL. I have been a LL and just didn't appreciate these charges were being levied on tenants too at the beginning.

Of course. This is my point. LL aren't bad people, but they will primarily be interested in what they pay for, and can shop around for that. as you say, LLs may not even know about the charges tenants face, and they can easily be hidden because they LL is not paying for them. Unless the LL specifically asks, how would they find out?

if you are an agency and person A contracts out your service, but person B pays, of course you will overcharge person B. Why wouldn't you? Person B has no control over the service provider, so you should overcharge. Agencies do it not because they are evil, but because it makes complete sense to do so.

wowfudge · 08/03/2015 11:06

Actually - I think a lot of agents are exploiting tenants and shouldn't be allowed to charge a tenant for a renewal when they are already charging the LL. FWIW I didn't appreciate agents charged anything other than the initial reference check fees and asked those agents I spoke to about those. Perhaps that was naive of me. I think it's immoral to force tenants to pay for a renewal or make them move out. The practice of sending out a s21 notice with the correspondence on renewal and demand to pay yet more fees is particularly rotten.

It might make complete business sense but that doesn't make it right.

keepitsimple0 · 08/03/2015 23:51

It might make complete business sense but that doesn't make it right.

Of course it's not right. that's why it should be regulated. one easy way to do that is make the LL pay all the fees, and then the LL will pass them on to the tenant.

annielouise · 09/03/2015 07:58

LadyRaincorn - I suspect what your agency is doing is illegal. They're not allowing you to exercise your rights - i.e. your right to go onto a rolling tenancy. You have been made to feel under threat that they'll give you notice if you don't keep signing contracts (again illegal as could come under harassment). Logically why would they get rid of a decent tenant for the sake of it just because they won't resign for another six months? I bet they wouldn't as they don't know who they'd get next. The very fact they've put you in a position where you are worried about this is wrong.

They are bastards and I'm in the same boat renting but trying to buy. The whole private rental system needs a complete overhaul. I believe Labour plans to do this.

Suzannewithaplan · 09/03/2015 08:05

letting agents = parasitic rent seeking middlemen

specialsubject · 09/03/2015 10:06

as a landlord it really isn't hard to find out the fees that the tenants will be charged. All you have to do is ask the agency - assuming the tenant doesn't tell you.

Part of the decision in choosing an agency, as marketing the property through a more expensive one might put off tenants. Assuming they don't all charge the same, of course.

I am awaiting the bile-spewing at charges for mortgage arrangement, which are also often grossly inflated.

Toughasoldboots · 09/03/2015 10:24

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

annielouise · 09/03/2015 11:01

Not pushing Labour for any political agenda but on its website it talks about three-year tenancies minimum where the landlord can't get you out with caps on agency fees. Of course there's way round this but any measures are a step forward. I've been renting for 7 years and it's awful. The stress for families with kids at school is horrendous and of course each year you live under threat of the rent going up, often for no just reason, or the LL wanting the property back, which is fair enough but a family could be moving every year with all the extra costs associated with that.

keepitsimple0 · 09/03/2015 11:21

I am awaiting the bile-spewing at charges for mortgage arrangement, which are also often grossly inflated.

The difference is that people paying for mortgages aren't forced to pay for a mortgage that someone else chooses. that's the whole problem. LLs choose the service, and tenants pay. Tenants are not free to shop around for a contract signing fee.

The mortgage market is quite competitive. Anyone is free to choose a mortgage with a lower arrangement fee, and many are fee free. Of course, there is usually a trade off with interest rates. You just need to price that into your payments and choose the best product.

Ladyleia · 09/03/2015 21:58

A few years ago I worked in the renewals dept of a large firm. We were very scrupulous at not 'trying it on' so - there was always a renewal admin fee clause in the original Tenancy Agreement (unless the TTs had negotiated for it to be removed) and it was always £125, the LLs terms and conditions also had a clause for renewal admin charge (unless the LL had negotiated it out at the beginning).

We always asked the LL before approaching the TT. We let them know what the current market situation was like by getting a picture from the lettings negotiators and then asked them what they wanted us to do - whether to approach the TT or not. Probably 8/10 times, the LL wanted us to approach the TT to renegotiate the contract (ie renew) for more money. This could take a few weeks as we would have to put the situation to the TT without blatantly saying 'your LL wants more cash'. The TT always had the ability to negotiate through us to the LL (we had situations where the rent was reduced if there was building work in the street etc) and once the renewal terms had been agreed, the Memo of Agreement was drawn up, signed and exchanged to both parties as it's not legal if not exchanged. Sometimes, LLs wanted the property back and did not want us to approach the TT in advance and just wanted us to serve a S21 at the 2 month mark.

Anyway, I'm not saying I agree with any of this - just thought I'd share a bit of info around what should be happening when the contract is renewed and what the agencies should be doing to earn their fees.

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