To think this 999 operator will be the death of someone?

[MadHattersWineParty]

So, basically, at the age of 29 and out of the clear blue sky, on Saturday night I had a pulmonary embolism (blood clot in my lung)

I had had a few symptoms I should have listened to a bit more but I didn't, I continued as normal until on Saturday afternoon I found myself seriously out of breath doing things like taking a shower, and when I coughed, there was blood.

I was staying with my friend, she called the ambulance. She explained I was not able to talk for myself as was breathless and coughing up considerable amounts of blood at this point.

She's been put through to the ambulance department and basically she was told I was having a nosebleed, so I should pinch my nose and go to my GP in the morning if I felt I really needed to, and the breathlessness was due to me being anxious. My friend is very articulate. She stressed the symptoms several times, but was told an ambulance would not be sent.

We went out and flagged down a cab, while I'm in bits with chest pain and coughing blood into sheets of kitchen roll.

Things happened very quickly once at a&e, blood test then scan then on a ward to start anti-coagulant treatment. Everybody I've encountered whilst in the hospital have been fantastic.

It's all been put down to a contraceptive pill I switched to recently, but it was life-threatening, and if I'd followed the advice of the operator, things might not have turned out very well at all.

Now I'm a bit better, I am very angry. I have to complain don't I- do they still record calls?! Surely something has to be done, even if it's only more training. She could dish out that advice and someone might not go and get the help they need.

This was happening in London 2 years ago, knowing the crisis in the Ambulance Service happening right now, I suspect it is happening across the country.

Do complain OP and yes, the call will have been recorded, but won't be kept forever, so the sooner you lodge your complaint, the better.

I'm so sorry to hear this and glad you survived

On the opposite end of the spectrum a paramedic showed up at my house when I called 111 with rectal bleeding. Turns out it was piles, I didn't want the ambulance but they insisted.

How the hell did they not send one to you! It's mad!

Definitely complain and all calls are recorded, so if you can include the date and approximate time in your complaint, that will help, plus your location. Calls are audited too (or should be), especially with new staff, to improve their skills, but this sounds like it really does need highlighting.

Call handlers do follow a computer package to triage calls but experienced ones are very good at working this around the caller so it isn't frustrating. Chest pain and difficulty breathing are big flags for an 8min response.

Please, please complain.

Something has gone very wrong here - whether it was the call handler, the prompt sheet, a "computer says no" moment, it doesn't matter. The important thing is that it is flagged up and the problem or problems dealt with and quickly.

I hope you're starting to feel better, what an awful thing to go through

mommy2ash - I don't know if this will help but it might explain a little?
Asking to move patient is because we ask for unconscious patients to be flat on their back, so we have to ask
Unresponsive would be treated as unconscious hence above
Staying on the line is because the patient is unstable, and it's quite a hard thing to do, finding things to ask. So we might keep asking are they moving, are they opening their eyes, try to wake them again for me, and it's all to keep reassessing so we can update the ambulance crew

oh I do understand the reasoning behind certain things but this conversation was maddening . it was literally readying a script over and over again. I couldn't give any helpful information as the questions didn't match the circumstances and I was getting very agitated whilst already being in an awful situation.

to you OP.

I know - it can be like that sometimes
It's incredibly hard to stick to what you can say and not sound like you're reading from a script.
Even with loads of questions things get missed - imagine a call about a cut finger, standard thing. They never mentioned the chest wound (gored by a bull)

Contact the hospital PALs department and tell them you want to be put through to the ambulance PALs. They are usually governed by different complaints departments but the hospital information is usually easier to find. Putting a complaint in writing should guarantee you a written response, and you can request a meeting with a departmental manager if you want a face to face with management. I used to work in a hospital PALs department, so feel free to pm me with any questions at all

YANBU - complain. Except by your description of the call it seems that the advice was given to operator by clinician and they should be the one to blame.
Anyway - definitely complain.

I've heard horror stories about 111 but this takes the biscuit.

This needs to be investigated before someone dies