To post on bear to get more traffic, because 3day old Ds has tongue tie and won't latch on

[Allthenamesareusedup]

Hi

My dc3 was born weds by elcs, and we were discharged yest. He had been reluctant to feed much, but had had 3-6hrly latched on BF feeds of 5-30mins for the 48hous we were in. Last night though he just wasn't that interested after 11.30pm. At 3pm he woke but wouldn't latch on, at 6 he latched on for 10mins, then nothing. midwife came this a.m said he's lost 10.5% of birthweight and showing signs of dehydration (jittery/lethargic). So at 1pm we syringe fed 28ml aptimall with 4ml hand expressed BM. It am to wake him around 4 to try to get him to latch on, and if fails again syringe BM. DH went and got a breastpump and at 2.30 I pumped 30ml, so he will get BM.

Question is! MW says he has posterior tongue tie (Dc2 had this but they wouldn't cut it as she wasn't seen til 4wks by which time she was feeding fine,, none of this drama with her thank god). It am scared that by pumping and syringing he won't get interested in trying to latch on again (why did he suddenly stop?? Why wasn't it picked up in hospital, I did say he preferred to sleep and couldn't get a good latch!) And I know I am meant to wake him in an hour to feed, but my boobs won't have filed up again will they? And do I keep pumping to keep flow up, plus try to get him latched? Or is it over and should we just bottle feed??

Feel really gutted, am such a worrier and this is one problem I just never anticipated. I know it is not a big deal and I am hugely lucky to have three gorgeous healthy kids, but I want to BF again and feel really really sad and want any advice or experience tha anyone has!

Sorry for essay, and thanks in advance.

Keep feeding him as often as you can. Strip him off to wake him up, change his nappy etc.

Everytime you feed him formula make sure you breastpump even if nothing is coming out. Once the milk starts to dry up when you're pumping keep going for another 5 minutes to keep your supply up when you are topping up wtih formula.

Your breasts refill with milk constantly - make sure you have plenty of fluids. Things like porridge oats etc, make sure you are eating well (cake certainly counts in this circumstance)

I've had 2 babies, they both lost over 10% of their birthweight and we've had lots of advice about helping them.

Basic advice is always breastfeed-express-feed baby expressed milk. Then start the cycle again.

Both of mine have had tongue ties. Is your midwife back again tomorrow?

Hi there

First of all congratulations

I don't have any experience of tongue tie but ds1 didn't latch on til he was 3 and a half weeks old....then I had to prise him off at 18 months!

So if you decide to express for a few weeks and bottle feed til he can latch on it might still be ok to breast feed

I know it's hard and easy for me to say but it's not the end of the world if he don't manage to breast feed...he'll be fine and you will have given him the first few days which I understand is the important part

Good luck

Oooh and keep pumping

thanks Valentine and reindeer, really appreciate the positive messages. I am lying here with him next to me worrying! My lovely inlaws have ds and dd at the park and have left me with cakes and well fed! DH is bring great too tho I suspect feeling a bit redundant and frustrated. Fab re constant refill, an hour and a half should mean some in there when he wakes then, and wow re no latch to 3.5wks! There's defo hope! Yes, MW back in a.m, but we are under strict instruction to go to hosp if more feeding probs/signs of dehydration. Shall follow cycle Valentine.

Have you asked about getting the tongue-tie divided? Some of the more on-the-ball health authorities will do this quickly, but if yours is slow you could investigate getting it done privately - near me there is a lady who will come out and do it within a day or so. If it's sorted quickly he will probably be able to learn to feed with a bit of assistance. If you can, I'd go along to a breastfeeding support drop-in - they may be able to help with techniques to make feeding as easy as possible for both of you.

What's the plan to get the tie cut? is midwife referring to tongue tie clinic and will you have to wait a while? if so, might private be an option to get it done more quickly?

Best of luck. We also had sleepy/reluctant feeding due to DD's tongue tie, it is very stressful but the main thing is to keep them hydrated and fed obviously, and keep your supply up... other things can be remedied once you've had the tie cut.

We have been toLd we need a GP referral for tongue tie app, which echoes what happened six years ago with dd. I have called the private hosp in a Edinburgh, but need to call back on a weekday once I have a GP referral also. So no movement there annoyingly until Monday.

I had my sons posterior tongue tie cut at 5 days old and the difference was immediate, I got my referral through the mum 2 mum network who called and made if for me. Alternatively you could have it done privately. In the meantime oats and breast compressions whilst you feed are your best friends.

Allthenames I see you are in Scotland, I'm not sure on support there but there may be a charity like the La Leche League who you can speak to soon, they will certainly know where you can get the TT cut.

Please make sure you're drinking LOTS. An hour and a half is loads of time to produce more milk don't worry. The more your baby feeds the more milk you will produce as well so if you feed as often as every 30 minutes it's even better than just doing a big feed every couple of hours (although of course your baby gets a bit tired from feeding)

This website seems to be Scottish based? Try putting your postcode in and seeing about local services www.feedgoodfactor.org.uk/

The National breastfeeding helpline is 0300 100 0212 if you want to talk anything over the phone.

Breasts are actually magical things, I was able to re-establish breastfeeding after 6 weeks with my baby. Less magical are dopey babies who are a bit hopeless at feeding How the human race survived I do wonder sometimes!

sweet

I think mine was one of the dopey ones bless him

What a difficult first few days:( I can't see anything in your post that points to a definite tongue tie though. The reluctance to feed would appear to be the major cause of the weight loss (10.5 per cent is not terrible on day two to three, you know, though if he was showing signs of dehydration it's understandable they were keen to intervene ). Tongue tie could be the culprit for the difficulty but it could be one of a few things instead. Talk it over maybe with the mw.

DC3 had tongue tie.
Lost weight, struggled with feeding, MW said not to worry as people with tongue tie cope.
At 10 days had it snipped. Immediate change. Latched on before we'd even left the clinic!
Wish I'd done it before I left hosp.

DD has a tongue tie, she lost 15% of body weight, was FTT and topped up with formula through NG tube but still no one spotted it. Even some TT practitioners don't believe PTT impacts on feeding.

Can you get to see an IBCLC privately? It usually costs £60-£100 depending on where you live, and they will find someone who can release the TT in the next day or so.

In the meantime keep pumping, keep trying to latch, wake regularly for feeds (every 2 hours or so) and top up with bm if you have it, formula if not.

Just in case you hop on during a night feed, to make you feel a bit better I thought I'd share the very best times for feeding and pumping for your milk supply are between 1am-4am. Your hormone levels are at your highest, meaning you are at your most efficient

Hope you and baby are ok.

Flip your DS' top lip & check for lip tie too (Google pics of tongue tie to check which grade of tie he has if applicable). I have a 4 month old who also lost 10.5% of her birth weight. I have been EBF her & my nipples have been killing, frequent feeds (every 90 mins or so), silent reflux so on infant gaviscon etc.

Her LT & PTT went unnoticed for 4 months. I took her to our GP who agreed she had a LT & PTT but wanted to wait another month and see her again (why?!) as her weight is very good due to feeding her constantly for around 45-90 mins a time.

This past Thursday we took a trip to London and saw DR LEVINKIND. He diagnoses lip & tongue ties there & then and with your consent, will use a cold laser to cut the ties. No one else in the UK uses this method. Hardly a drop of blood, no anaesthetic, 5-10 min job. The consultation & procedure does cost £410 but you can be seen within a week, can feed baby straight after the procedure & see the benefit straight away. I'm feeding my DD now from my most painful side and I have very minimal pain.

My midwife who was doing a home visit when DS was 1 day old called the hospital ENT outpatients clinic and made an appointment for me when he was 5 days old. It was all done in about 10 minutes. It can really affect speech in the long term so well worth getting done.

I would cup feed as much express breast milk and formula as he will take and keep expressing to get your supply up. Its v early days. Just keep trying. I know how desperate it can feel.

I'm in edinburgh. We had DS TT seen at murrayfield hospital and I was able to make an appointment for next day so at least it's quick of you go down private route - £100ish i think. I do think I was able to make this prior to GP referral (I may have cried at booking lady) it's all done electronically so it comes across to them immediately - if you have a GP appointment you could try that.

Stick with it, we had a horrendous time but after a quick snip he went up a centile line each month and settled on 75th.

Congratulations on your lovely new baby :)

I can't offer better advice than on here but just support; my DS3 was born on Wednesday and we're also finding bfing tricky due to ptt.

I hope you find something that works well for you!

You are right PTT does affect feeding. Not all experts will be knowledgeable or helpful. Keep pushing. It is a fight for your baby and your right to BF without damage. It makes a huge difference to you. Agree with the oats and regular offering. Unmumsnetty hugs.

How is the feeding going? Sure you are already but I would make sure you strip feed and have as much skin to skin as possible. Try getting him to latch on when he's not hungry too as often they are more relaxed and enjou comfort sucking.

Both my DCs had tongue tie. My first wouldn't latch on at all to start with but we managed by expressing and syringe feeding along with continuing to persevere with getting him to latch on.

He eventually fed well using medela nipple shields which took about a month to get off. This was only after he had the tie snipped though when he was only a day or two old.

2nd DC had tongue tie that wasn't diagnosed until a couple of weeks in when he lost weight and was reluctant to feed - I was also in a lot of pain. He would fall asleep after feeding for a couple of minutes because it was just too much hard work for him.

Syringe feeding won't stop him from latching on, but I would try and get the TT snipped ASAP and maybe try nipple shields to get him latched on better.

I found an independent midwife in my area. She popped to my house the day I called and it was all sorted. Worth every penny. Cheaper than a private doctor too. Where are you?

Xmas, in our area (NW) TT snips have to be done in a hospital.

For what it's worth, my first son had a thick PTT, had it snipped, had a teeny amount of blood and fell asleep straight away (we needed to see him latch but he refused!)

www.breastfeedingnetwork.org.uk/breastfeeding-help/breastfeeding-support/

Lots of information and support available from the Breastfeeding network :) wishing you all the best in your feeding journey xxx