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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

AIBU to think that moving bf in will impact on tax credits?

47 replies

Johnogroats · 03/02/2015 15:50

Backstory...ex SIL shares custody of 3 kids with DB - 5/9 split. He pays c£1300 child maintenance, but clean break (she got over 80% marital assets) so no spousal maintenance.

The childcare arrangements are difficult mainly because she tries to move the goalposts. His job is not one where he can drop things at 5pm to collect kids all the time...he has suggested an AP ( to live with him, but look after kids at both homes ) which would have any advantages both financial and practical. She objects mainly because she will lose tax credits.

So, if she is earning c£20k pa, working part time, tax credits will boost her income significantly, and she can claim these in respect of after school club etc? Correct? The child maintenance is irrelevant as far as tax credits go I think.

But, if her new bf moves in (I think he earns c£80-100k), that would be taken into account. Am I right in thinking the tax credits would be lost? DB could then explain that his proposals do make even more sense.

If He doesn't get workable childcare he will lose his job, and the child maintenance will be impacted. He is financially stretched to the limit.

Thanks in advance.

OP posts:

fedupbutfine · 03/02/2015 17:50

Childcare tax credits get paid directly to the provider so its not like shes losing money in her hand

no, that's not the case.

Original poster

Johnogroats · 03/02/2015 20:26

The £1300 was agreed on the basis that it would cover all childcare, both when with her and when with him. All set out in the Order. He is on a decent whack but by the time he has paid for his own mortgage (wanted to stay close by so joint parenting was an option) and this maintenance, he has very little. Certainly not enough to conjure up another £500.

It should be very simple to sort out, but she is an absolute nightmare. Have posted before, but concerned will out self if I gave all gorey details.

I think once she realises that she will lose all this money, she will be more amenable to what is being suggested. No doubt she will tell anyone who will listen that it is all exH fault, but that's the way she is.

OP posts:

TheRollingCrone · 03/02/2015 20:41

Maybe your DB should seek advice.And you should leave them to it perhaps...I can see you' re a concerned caring sister, but the Road to Hell and all that.

kinkyfuckery · 03/02/2015 21:31

But he doesn't need to conjure up another £500 . He pays the maintenance that was court ordered and she organises the childcare? What's to change?

Original poster

Johnogroats · 03/02/2015 22:59

Kinky... The current childcare isn't working for them. He has a solution which she refuses to consider, while her solution is to tell him he needs to have kids on additional days at short notice ... He has a high pressure job, and while he has flex working sorted enabling him to WFH or have shorter hours when he has kids, his means he has to work stupid hours when they are with her.

Childcare should be agreed, but she refuses to discuss. In order to not risk his job (if she refuses) he would need to cough up the additional £500, but financially this isn't an option.

Rollingcrone...I hear you! He could go to court to amend order (no guarantees) or he could suggest mediation (didn't work last time). Plenty of lawyers in the family. Too many. He is at end of tether, she really is the most difficult person, hence seeking views of me / family members.

Anyway, thanks to all for your advice. Clearly her moving bf in is going to impact her adversely in financial terms, unless he is intending to subsidise her ( no reason why he should). And given the way she is, I am sure she won't have thought it through. Hopefully this will mean she has more of an incentive to compromise re childcare....

OP posts:

FitzgeraldProtagonist · 03/02/2015 23:13

Op your DB sounds very much like my boss. He us giving ex dw a good deal - but she is probably trying to find her feet out side Her marriage perceives she's lost her security and is trying to squirrel as much as poss. £20k is it part time admin job? She wants to use a registered provider so she can contribute to childcare in a familiar setting rather than AP? Which would host get more? Plus meals. Tbh leaving aside the fact she is being generously compensated for raising the kids-she sounds like a woman trying to protect her and Childrens interests in the event your DB proves unreliable. Why would she think that? Was he faithful in their marriage? The mistrust must stem from somewhere?

FitzgeraldProtagonist · 03/02/2015 23:14

*cost her not host get!

Original poster

Johnogroats · 03/02/2015 23:30

In the marriage he did everything. Too much. She was a spoilt princess who spent spent and spent. Then had an affair which nearly killed him - he adored her. She certainly has issues, but is the unreliable one. I rather suspect kids will end up with him ft, and she will go off rails. She is qualified professional, but yes shes doing an admin job now. Frankly I think DB was emotionally bullied by her and to an extent is still being bullied. He hates to say no, because he thinks it will impact children adversely. She takes advantage.

However, he needs practical advice now, and my original question has been answered and I think will mean he can put things to her calmly and factually.

OP posts:

YeahDamon · 04/02/2015 07:12

I find it hard to believe that a man on more than 5k take home (I assume from the maintenance figures) can't possibly compromise somewhere to find an extra £500 for childcare.

It's not up to her to fund his childcare out of the maintenance she receives. She doesn't sound lazy to me, she works and arranges childcare for three children as a single parent. That's the opposite if lazy.

YeahDamon · 04/02/2015 07:15

And I'm sure she's considered the financial impact of moving in with her parter. When I moved in with my now DH I lost around 2k a month in various benefits. We took it all into account but felt we'd rather live together and pool our wages than continue to let the state pay my childcare.

Chasingsquirrels · 04/02/2015 07:22

When was the consent order? Am I correct in thinking if > 12 months ago he can revert to CSA rates? And then sort his own childcare.

MinceSpy · 04/02/2015 07:33

If the current arrangement/order isn't working he needs calculate what his payments should be and pay that amount. Sort out his own child care for when he has the children. He may also need to stop enabling her behaviour and refuse to have children at short notice, which will be hard.

Original poster

Johnogroats · 04/02/2015 07:42

CO drawn up 6 months ago. To buy her out so she can live almost mortgage free he has taken on a huge mortgage and borrowed from family (not me). It can only be varied by going back to court. Yes CSA rates would be massively less, but he believes agreed amounts are fair and he will keep paying those. He really does not have spare cash as daft as that sounds. I have seen the spreadsheets.

The CO spells out that it is money to cover ALL childcare regardless of where kids are, so recent comments are incorrect.

Also I agree it sounds daft that she wouldn't consider financial implications of moving in with bf. however, if you knew her it wouldn't seem so daft. The word "entitled" x100 is applicable.

Anyway, the tax situation is likely to help resolve DBs issues.

OP posts:

Original poster

Johnogroats · 04/02/2015 07:44

MinceSpy - absolutely he is beginning to stop enabling her. It is hard, as he wants to see kids as much as poss.

But revising amount paid would mean going back to court....

OP posts:

MinceSpy · 04/02/2015 08:38

Maybe for the children's sake it needs to go back to court.

Original poster

Johnogroats · 04/02/2015 09:15

If they can't come to a sensible arrangement I think that is where it will end. Thanks x

OP posts:

Sethspeaks · 04/02/2015 11:06

What are the issues with childcare for him? I find it an odd arrangement to have set up - agreeing to give her the money to arrange the childcare but then not wanting what she has organised. I think she is perfectly right to choose the childcare set up that suits her, but if it isn't what he wants his hands are tied if the arrangement is that she arranges it.

How often does he have them? Surely he must have known what his childcare needs were going to be and how having them would impact upon his work 6 months ago?

Original poster

Johnogroats · 04/02/2015 13:41

Issues are that on his days he cannot be at work before 9 and after 5. When the kids are ill there is no back up. His job is at risk.

Agreed Seth. This was pointed out to him at the time and I don't think he should have agreed to it. However he did, which was barking and given her track record for financial irresponsibility. 100s of egs but don't want to get into them as v identifiable.

He has them almost 50% of the time, and she is trying to get him to take them on an additional day.

The CO does not say that she chooses childcare, it says "as agreed between the parties for the benefit of the children from time to time". There should be an adult conversation, but she is used to getting her own way. He acquiesced throughout the marriage and she expects him to keep doing so.

OP posts:

Sethspeaks · 04/02/2015 15:38

Well yes, that's what all lone parents who work are faced with. What is the arrangement at the moment - why isn't that working?

Original poster

Johnogroats · 04/02/2015 16:14

When they were together there was more flexibility. This has changed. She keeps wanting to change days, or rather send the kids to him more frequently and in breach of what was agreed. Emotionally he'd be happy to see them more often, but practically this is a non starter.

With an AP all the practical difficulties could be resolved, including the fraught transfer between the houses, at a financial saving, even if she loses tax benefits.

OP posts:

Sethspeaks · 04/02/2015 16:32

But they aren't together now, and if they are 6 months into the court order what has he been doing until now for childcare? If he can find a way round it for the next 6 months, then from what others say he can then change the agreement and pay for his own AP, if that is what is going to work for him.

FringeDivision · 04/02/2015 18:17

Maybe she needs it spelled out that if he loses his job the child support will cease and she will have to rely on her own income and the tax credits.

I think I would go back to court and get an arrangement whereby she sorts her childcare and he sorts his and the amount he pays her reflects that.

If he is paying more than the csa would make him pay can he reduce payments and finance AP from that? Or did the court insist he pays current level of child support? Wasn't sure from the post.

He seems to be paying a lot for someone whose ex wasn't a sahm and is employed and considering he has the kids 40% of the time.

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