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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To feel rage about what my friends employer is doing to her?

46 replies

MrsTawdry · 28/01/2015 23:22

She's a lone parent...in her 20s and works at an expensive private nursery part time. She does two days regularly and the nursery charge her for her DDs time there (in a different room to the one in which my friend works)

Anyway...she told me a few weeks ago that the manager offered her another day off the books and free care for DD that day...for...the grand sum of TWENTY QUID cash in hand.

AIBU to feel such rage?

This employer is taking the piss in the worst possible way.

She knows that twenty pounds is a lot to my friend...and she took the offer.

So she's working for 8 hours a day for £2.50 an hour!??

I think my friend regrets it now. She says she's getting the extra money at the end of the month...so it will feel like it was worth it as to her that's an extra 80 quid or whatever...but still...is this as wrong as I think it is? Exploitation?

OP posts:

UncleT · 29/01/2015 06:41

Yup, no way should she have accepted that - that's her look out.

I don't buy the suggestion that the employer was doing her some kind of favour - clearly they wouldn't offer if it wasn't in their greedy interests and they deserve reporting. They're also defrauding everyone in this country who fairly and honestly pays tax.

insancerre · 29/01/2015 06:52

She could have said no.
For the poster who suggested Ofsted, they wouldn't be interested. Its not within their remit.

InternetFOREVER · 29/01/2015 07:00

Is she working 16 hours a week usually to get the most benefit from tax credits, housing benefit, etc? That would be the main reason for keeping it off the books, as far as I can see, as working (and declaring) extra hours could mean a reduction in benefits. Be aware that reporting the nursery would also be reporting your friend - would that help her?

sebsmummy1 · 29/01/2015 07:10

If it's a regular thing tell her to say 'no, it's not working for me sorry'.

EhricLovesTheBhrothers · 29/01/2015 07:18

Presumably she gets tax credits to help with the official childcare she pays so it will cost her a lot less than £41 a day, she has been a mug to accept this, but she accepted it, so I don't know why you are so angry.

Chunderella · 29/01/2015 07:36

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

DoJo · 29/01/2015 18:07

For the poster who suggested Ofsted, they wouldn't be interested. Its not within their remit.

Ofsted seems to set down some requirements for appropriate insurance, so presumably they would want to know if a registered provider wasn't covered for times when there were children on the premises.

I don't know why you are so angry.

Because the friend's employer is taking advantage of someone who is desperate in order to save money.

ohbollocks2u · 29/01/2015 18:16

Would she still be insured if she officially shouldn't be there ?

insancerre · 29/01/2015 18:19

Of course their insurance qpuldnt be invalid
Insurance covers everyone on the premises
It doesn't matter if they are paid or not

Its not an ofsted matter

KatherinaMinola · 29/01/2015 19:08

It's an HMRC matter though...

DoJo · 29/01/2015 19:45

Of course their insurance qpuldnt be invalid

You seem very sure, so I will bow to your better judgement, but I don't think it's exactly obvious that their insurance would cover them.
Presumably if a claim were to be brought they would be claiming either that she was officially employed with them (which would not be born out by their records) or that she was self-employed (which she clearly isn't, but if they accepted that she was then surely she would need her own cover). I'm surprised that an insurance company wouldn't use this to attempt to avoid paying out, but clearly this is my cynicism at play.

ohbollocks2u · 29/01/2015 20:41

Thank you DOJO that was my thought

Original poster

MrsTawdry · 29/01/2015 20:51

They're breaking the law anyway.

OP posts:

PelvicFloorGoneSouth · 29/01/2015 21:44

They are breaking the law but is your friend above reproach in this? Is she declaring the extra income? If you report the nursery you will be dropping your friend in it too......................

earplugsahoy · 29/01/2015 22:46

The majority of nursery staff are paid 6.50 minimum wage, and most nurseries charge £4 per hour for a child (approx) so if they have paid her 2.50 per hour then they've not actually given her free childcare they've deducted it from her wages.

Original poster

MrsTawdry · 29/01/2015 23:48

Yes but they're not "wages" ...it's cash in hand...off the books. WHY?

OP posts:

ScrambledEggAndToast · 30/01/2015 06:42

Yes it's dodgy, however, if she was paying in full for the childcare, I doubt she would take home much more than £20 per day anyway. Childcare is so expensive.

ChippingInLatteLover · 30/01/2015 06:48

Why?

Because it's saving them a shit load of money!

I feel for your friend. It's awful to need an extra £20 a week so badly you'll accept being used in this way.

LikeTheShoes · 30/01/2015 07:59

if they're prepared to do it once I bet there are other dodgy things going on, I'd report.

TheGirlFromIpanema · 30/01/2015 08:09

Why Mrs Tawdry - exactly! They will be saving a days pay (less £20) plus the employers NI on top.

They presumably have the space for an additional child in the other room so no real 'extra' cost to the nursery.

Most nurseys offer reduced rates for staff anyway, it's already costed in to overall operating profits.

As a one-off it seems to be little difference, but as a cumulative effect, say 2 employee's x 2 days per week 'off the books' or more and the savings to the nursey soon mount up.

Also, regarding the insurance - employer liability insurance (rather than 'premises' insurance) is key. They most definitely wouldn't pay out if they had illegal employees involved in a claim for them. And illegal is exactly what it is

MrsT you are right to be raging. Some employers take the piss. I'd be helping my friend find a new place to work for 3 days a week so she could tell them to stick it. They seemingly have her over a barrell on this, shower of bastards.

Patsyandeddie · 01/02/2015 18:08

She can probably only work 16 hours a week legitimately or she will lose some of her benefits. She can only really do cash in hand work for the extra day, not saying it's ok but there are two ways of looking at this.

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