to think you would say something?

[badlywrittengirl]

I work in a very small team of mostly women and I was pregnant at the same time as a colleague so we shared and chatted a lot about our future DC's every day.

Then I lost mine in very drawn-out, traumatic circumstances and we are now many months on from that - her child is alive and well. I wondered why everyone else had been in touch at least to say "I don't know what to say", but she hadn't. And now I've even seen her in person (without baby, in both social and work environments) and she still hasn't said a thing.

I've only thought about this twice in all this time - I have a lot more to be going on with. But, I just wonder why someone would completely avoid the entire subject when it had been all we'd talked about for so long?

AIBU to think you'd at the very least just send a text or FB message (as many did) to say 'thinking of you' or something, even if you really don't have a clue how to respond? I'm well aware of having felt crippled by not being able to relate to the severity of some of my friends' situations in the past, but I hope I've always tried to at least let them know I'm thinking of them.

I want to understand this person so that if we end up working together again in the future, I can get past this. I'm just baffled at the moment.

Thank you [please be kind].

Oh gosh, I'm so sorry for your loss.

I think sometimes people just don't know what to say. And she probably has a touch of that coupled with not knowing if you want to be in touch with someone who may remind you of what could've been. Sorry, I think that's a bad way of putting it, but hopefully you know what I mean.

My mum and aunt were both pregnant, my aunt's baby was still born. I was only primary school age and I can still remember my mother's panic when aunt and uncle came to visit after birth of my little sister. My mother was literally looking for somewhere to hide the baby as she felt so awful that her baby was alive and there's wasn't. It was resolved by my lovely aunt coming in and asking to hold the baby. She held her and cried and told my mum how happy she was for her. It was so sad.

I think she probably feels alot like my mum.

I hope your are OK, it is such a hard thing to go through.

I'm so sorry OP. I very much doubt she's done it for malicious reasons. Sometimes it's harder to say, "I don't know what to say," than saying nothing at all - but clearly she has got this wrong here.

If you felt up to it, would you bring it up with her in a private moment? It might open up the passage of communication if you said you felt a bit sad she hadn't been in touch... But the onus isn't on you. If you can't face it, just phase her out as much as possible.

Sorry for your loss. Some people just dont know what to say and unfortunately do not say anything. It could also be that she is worried she will say something that will upset you.

I lost my first dc suddenly. Most people were honest and said they did not know what to say. But some were like your colleague and did not say anything at all. Its times like this you find out who your friends are.

I think Tidy has the crux of it.

Terribly sorry for your loss op,

She probably just doesn't know what to say. She should have said something and knows that but is probably embarrassed at the amount of time that has gone on.
I wouldn't worry about it, sounds like maybe she's a bit socially awkward. Some people just don't know what to say

So sorry OP x

Is it possible that the other team members have been telling her what to say/not to say to the extent she doesn't really know what to say any more- so says nothing.

I was in a similar position to her where a close friend and colleague's daughter was sadly stillborn- I was only 2 months behind her pregnancy wise- and we returned from maternity about the same time.

In my return to work interview, I was given a list of things I was not to talk about, and her daughter was one of them; it was so strange and very sad.

My Mum lost a baby, a few months later their friend had theirs. They used to be at ours every weekend, the kids all used to play together. Obviously they stayed away for the first few weeks as they were adjusting to the new baby and needed their own space as you do. After that though we called them to see if they wanted to come round, us kids were missing theirs. They didn't know whether to come or not, it being mere months after losing my sister, they didn't want to upset us by showing off their new baby, weeks after we'd held the funeral for ours.
They were told not to be daft and to come round, we wanted to meet new baby and have cuddles. Yes, Mum got teary, as did my step dad and I (I was 13 and old enough to understand the situation) but we'd have been more hurt if they'd stopped coming than if they hadn't.

Maybe this is the case for your friend, she feels a type of survivors guilt. What do you say to someone who should be celebrating their baby at the same time as you. Someone who has suffered a huge loss and then has to see you with everything she should have had. She probably feels awkward and unsure of what to do or say, how you might take things?

If you want to keep your friendship, maybe reach out to her, tell her it's okay she still has her baby, and okay to talk about him/her. Tell her that yes, it hurts you and you may tear up, you may cry on her shoulder, but that you value her friendship. Tell her you are sad she didn't contact you, but you understand why. If you feel you can that is.

I'm very sorry for your loss. Be kind to yourself

I'm so sorry for your loss OP.
Clearly, it would be helpful to you if she acknowledged your loss and you could both move forwards.

However, some people seriously struggle to know what to say/do in difficult situations and they become paralysed with fear about not making things worse and end up trying very hard to avoid the person concerned.(!)

Personally, I just think it's their problem and its entirely up to you if you want to say anything to her directly.

Sadly, I'm guilty of this myself. A few years ago my DH was undergoing chemo and I vaguely knew one of the other patients receiving treatment. Later I bumped into her and her DH shopping where she told me that her cancer had returned and was terminal. I never got back in touch with her, even though I knew where she lived. I felt wretched that my DH was being treated and was going to be OK and I simply couldn't face up to her not being OK.

I totally regret not getting in touch. I wish I could have just visited her, gone for a coffee, hugged her, whatever and especially as I knew she was estranged from her family. Fear is a destructive emotion.

So so sorry for your loss badlywritten.

I have been in your colleagues position. Myself and a woman at toddler group were pregnant and we were due within 3 days of each other. At 37ish weeks she sadly lost her little boy and I went on to have dd.

It was heart breaking and whilst we weren't close we had shared a lot of our pregnancy and excitement and I spent her due date crying my eyes out.

We did all club together to send her some flowers. I admit I didn't message her on FB because we weren't that close and I think it would have been a bit awkward and I had no idea what to say. I also think she may have somehow thought I was 'flaunting' my healthy baby (although don't know why as I wouldn't have been insensitive enough to mention her). Maybe in hindsight I should have done.

I did see her at toddler group the first time I took DD. It was hard as she walked in as everyone was passing DD around and there was a split second of silence and I wasn't sure how she would react to me being there. She did sit next to me but I didn't say anything about DD but she did look at her and say something. I asked her how she was doing because it had to be acknowledged, I knew I couldn't ignore it but it is really hard to know what to say when you do think about how it could have been you looking at the other person who had their baby and you didn't.

I'm sure she doesn't mean anything by it. I would guess that she feels incredibly awkward and is not sure how you would react to her getting in touch. That's how I felt. People don't always deal with difficult things in the right way. Now she may feel too much time has passed so it would be even more awkward to bring it up, given how you have seen her a few times.

I do think it is a little insensitive for her to not have said anything to you though.

I guess I'd feel horribly guilty in her situation. I wouldn't have known what to say when my baby was born, and wouldn't have wanted to contact u incase it upset u. Then I'd probably get in the situation that I'd left it too long so didn't feel appropiate to bring it up.

If it's on your mind. You could try chatting to her about her dc, asking to see picture - letting her know your ok to have it out there. That would give her an opening

Exactly what Purplepoodle said

And I'm sorry for your loss OP

She probably has no idea what to do. If she had a baby about the same time you were meant to, she was probably dealing with newborn-ness when every one else was getting in touch with you. And now, a few months on, she probably feels that she should have said something then, but didn't, and it would be weird to bring it up now (and perhaps upsetting to remind you), so just ignores it.

Have you asked about her baby when you met? If not, she may think babies are a subject to avoid. Is there a third party you could pass a message through or something, that you'd be happy to hear from her?

Thanks so much.

purple I find it strange because she's a big character - very socially confident to say the least. But I know she's hiding her DC from me in various ways so that must be a conscious decision. Yes, I had considered that she doesn't want to wave her new baby around in front of me and she seems to have made an effort not to do that. In a way I'm thankful for that, actually. But not to reach out at all to connect with me in my grief just feels a little cold so the hiding is tinged with 'don't take away my joy', somehow.

granny I am that aunt! I have loved hanging out with my nieces and nephews although I've managed not to get weepy (difference in that they weren't due at the same time, so I really feel for your lovely aunt there, what a wonderful person).

Thank you editthis, I think if we are back in the same workspace I would try to raise it even though I'm a wimp because I honestly don't know how we could share such a tiny space for months or years without doing so.

thetroubleis I honestly doubt there has been any pressure of this kind, knowing my team. But thank you x

angelopal my loving thoughts to you.

chatty that's a gorgeous story. Thank you so much. I don't feel as close as that to her but as I said before I would reach out specifically if we were working together again or in a social circle, so thanks for that.

sparkly I have been in a similar situation, without the part where my life was so horrifically affected. But just not knowing how to approach a friend whose life was ending, staying away because I'd heard she didn't want people to see her in agony, yet agonising over not showing up in solidarity and friendship and love. I am so sorry that you've felt that too, with the added (unnecessary) guilt of surviving - at least by proxy.

CrapBag great name - haha! I think you did EXACTLY the right thing, just a small, casual acknowledgment is all it takes, surely? She knows you've thought about it and wondered how she is. That would be enough for me.

Sorry everyone, I just struggle to know how a big grown-up lady can not say, 'hey, I didn't know what to say but I hope you're alright'. The feeling to do something about that would have overcome me at some point. But I do take on all that's been said, so thank you all. I have found some new points of view here that have got me thinking and stretching the original ones I had imagined. Thanks for that.

[And thanks for being so kind so far - my heart hurts a lot and you heard that]

I guess nearer the time, her first few opportunities she thought it could be too raw for you, she didn't want to upset you when you were doing well returning to work etc. She might not have wanted to knock you back.

Then as time goes on she realises it is weird to say something today because she didn't say anything the last two times. Then she decides to say something during an appropriate moment, when you two are alone because it needs a bigger conversation - she also needs to apologise for not saying something sooner. That will be even more upsetting for you she imagines, so maybe not today because of xyz.

Eventually it has been too long to not say anything and she is ashamed of herself.

I am confident she is dreadfully sorry for your loss, and she hurts too.

She probably didn't know what to say the first time and was waiting for you to say something or for there to be a right time to say something - then when it didn't happen it would have been too late iyswim

I'm very, very sorry for your loss.

How could anyone not be kind . YADNBU and its such a sad situation.

I'm glad you think I did handle it right because it is tough to know what to do for the best.

I think maybe you are going to have to be the one to bring it up in some way as I doubt she will now. If she has consciously kept her baby away from you then she is clearly thinking about you and from the sounds of it, trying to be sensitive to your needs.

She will probably be glad if you say something first.

Okay, I might be having a small teary moment because you are all being much more kind than I would expect on AIBU!

Yes. The newborn-ness, the lateness after, the inappropriateness or lack of opportunity after that... I get it. Of course I do. This isn't a close friend so I find it hard to know how to approach but for sure if we were back in the workplace I would not feel right leaving it unspoken. I would try to make it as easy as possible for her to open up a little and connect with me again.

Meanwhile, we're only 'connected' via FB since we don't usually socialise together. Could I send a little message saying it would be nice to see pics of her LO (obviously still blocked from me so far)? Or would that just come across as weird? I honestly don't know. But I really don't think I would mind seeing them IYKWIM.

I am so sorry for your loss

One thing for sure, being a mother, she will not be ignoring your traumatic period and your stillborn baby out of malice. She probably cares deeply about what happened.

I too gave birth to a baby who had died and I encountered a couple of people who never referred to our baby at all. It really hurt. Looking back I can see from a different perspective that they perhaps didn't feel strong enough to support me in my grief or want to "make me cry" by mentioning him. I can see that now. At the time I was all consumed with my baby and my loss and sadness and disappointment.

For you

Could I send a little message saying it would be nice to see pics of her LO (obviously still blocked from me so far)? Or would that just come across as weird? I honestly don't know.

I don't know about you but I just wanted my baby, not anyone else's. I know seeing other baby's would be a reminder but I didn't need a reminder, at all.

Merry I'm sure of that, but I've had so many other baby bombs now it pales. I have a fairly small group of FB friends and it seems like they've all sprouted tiny people since I lost mine. At least I knew that one was coming. (Although it came right after mine, so I wouldn't have been as receptive then).

I'm so sorry Merry I also wanted to say that I'm sad for your loss of your little boy. I hope you've had lots of love and support in RL to help you with losing him. I'm so, so sorry. You have my loving thoughts too

I'm so sorry for your loss OP.

Some good friends of mine recently lost their baby and I'm sort of in the position that your friend must be in. When they first told us I was devastated for them (still am) and sent a text just to say that I was really sorry for what they've gone and are going through.

Since then, though, I haven't spoken to them much. Like some PPs have said, I almost feel a sense of guilt that my DC is healthy and happy when they've lost so much. There is definitely also the feeling like seeing our child would just be a painful reminder. DH and I decided that although we desperately want to be there for them, perhaps we weren't the best people to be offering help. Maybe we're wrong? Of course, I can't speak for your friend but I didn't in any way feel like speaking to them would take away my joy, just that I didn't want to hurt them in any way.

I do feel like if she/he said something to me or wanted to chat I'd feel reassured about speaking to them. It's not fair to expect them to make the first move, I know... :( I just don't know what to do/say otherwise, though, or if I'd make things worse...

Not everyone can say it with words. Sometimes the words are so inadequate compared to the feelings that they won't come. So they try to show by actions instead. She sounds like a nice enough person. She isn't avoiding you. She is trying to be as considerate as she thinks she should be by not making her baby too 'in your face'. At the same time, what is probably making every word unspeakable for her is that she is the one person who knows the anguish you are going through as she will feel it every time she looks at her child. In other words, she is more emotionally engaged than the other people in the situation so it is easier for them to say something out right. Whereas she is running everything through her head on a how would she feel in that situation and double guessing herself to the point she's pretty much paralysed when it comes to saying anything.

And there is the survivors guilt too.

This isn't your problem at all of course. Except that it is bothering you. It could be that she has no idea that she should say anything. If you'd like this resolved then just say to her one day that you have noticed and appreciate her trying to keep the baby stuff quiet but she really doesn't need to. And then see what she says. It might be that she just needs some cue on what to do next.