To squirel money away behind DPs back?

[SellyBW]

Situation is that we both work full time. He earns more than me.

The house is in his name only although we both contribute to mortgage and repairs/decoration etc. We are planning to get married in 2016 which will give me all the legal rights to the house that I need and aside from that, he says we can reapply for a joint mortgage once the current one is up for renewal (end of next year). He seems reluctant to try and get me on the mortgage before then).

I 99.9% trust his intentions but a small part of me is thinking "keep a plan B". Therefore I am 'secretly' saving money each month in my own account. If plan A works out and we get married/get the house in both names, I'll invest what I've saved back into the house. If plan B is required - I'll do one with the money.

AIBU?

Ordinarily I would say this was wrong but if you are contributing to the morgage but not actually on it then I can understand why you would do it.
Personally I would insit if he wanted me to pay the morgage he better well put me on it.

It's not unreasonable, it's the smart thing to do. I would even keep saving after you get married. A friend of mine is getting divorced after 14 months of marriage. Her ex kept the mortgage and all the bills in his name and my friend has been completely screwed over by him. She will get some financial settlement once the divorce is finallised, but at the moment she's sleeping on her sister's sofa because she can't afford the deposit for a flat to rent.

Why don't you just go and get married in your jeans with a couple of witnesses then out for lunch? Then have a party with posh frocks in a year if you want a weddingy wedding.

Not the same but DH and I have seperate personal and savings accounts as well as a two joint accounts. We also signed a prenup to protect both of us. There is nothing wrong about protecting yourself or thinking of your future.

I do believe in honesty though so I'd talk to him about your concerns and ask questions and if he can't give you any answers make it clear to him that "he wouldn't object then to you saving for the morgage or your future plans".

And like others say do not get pregnant to this man unless your prepared to do it alone if, god forbid, it goes tits up.

I agree for always planning for the worst.
So think keeping yourself protected is the right thing to do.

However I would not be doing this behind his back, do it in the open, why is there a need to be secretive in this situation?
To tell you the truth if I found my husband doing this I would end our marriage.

why is he so reluctant to apply for a joint mortgage? why does he not like the idea of a deed of trust? why does he never want to discuss our wedding plans? (of which we have none, just a year!)

Have you asked him why to any of these?
Mortgage could be because its on a set rate for a set period so does not want to occur extra charges, but there could be any number of reasons for these.
If you have not asked him and you are feeling this, I would say you need to think again about getting married.

Before we got married (after 8 years of living together), 'we' bought a house. DH applied for the mortgage in his own name as my wage at the time was so pitiful that it wouldn't have made any difference in how much we could borrow. So officially DH bought the house, we moved in etc and I contributed to the household costs - but nowhere near as much as DH did as I earned far less than him. What he did was have a spreadsheet detailing how much each of us had contributed each month to the house/mortgage and I had joint access to it (as an online document). He always said that once we were married he'd just delete the document and then pay for my name to go onto the deeds. We got married about 4 years after that, and that's exactly what happened. I can't remember how much it cost to put my name on the deeds but it wasn't that much I don't think.
We always knew we'd eventually get married but DH knew I wouldn't have kids unless we were married and he knew I wouldn't ask him to marry me. So he basically held off asking me to marry him until he was ready to finally have children. If your DP doesn't want you to go on the deeds until you are married then I can understand that but for him to not want to have a conversation about the wedding then I'd be a bit concerned. Did he ask you to marry him?

If you are contributing towards the mortgage then you should change to joint mortgage otherwise you are basically just a lodger and helping him pay his mortgage off. I think you should listen to that voice in your head telling you not to trust him, if everything was going well I don't think you would have such doubts. Just offer to pay half the bills till you are put on the mortgage. I think you are being very sensible btw.

You need to be on the title deeds as well as the mortgage (assume you meant you hope for both) and there may be an issue over what % of the house he wants you to have - might be 10%, might be 50%. You can register those percentages at the Land Registry once he agrees to put you on the house deeds if he agrees to do that. Make sure he also makes a will in your favour.

Also do you pay half the mortage or pay less than half

I've always squirreled money away and I'd advise any woman to do so, regardless of the earnings/housing/marriage situation. I'm married now but I have a separate bank account which is online only (if you're saving in an account which sends paper statements it's just too easy for him to find one if you're living together). I'm in a very happy relationship now, but I've had to leave an abusive relationship at very short notice in the past and was able to easily rent a place, pay for transport and emergency items. I'm staggered and saddened when I read Relationship threads about women who are completely stuck and don't have these options.

Also let us not forget many of us women now earn many multiples of our man. i earned 10x more. If I moved a lover in now no way is he getting a penny of my money or house (given I paid the children's father so very much on our divorce). 100% of my assets are going to the children. Not everyone who moves in a partner wants them to have their capital. This is why live in lovers and spouses are treated so very differently under English law.

What a bizarre and depressing set of responses. There was a similar thread recently from a woman who didn't want to share the equity she'd built up in 'her' house with her DP who the MN coven subsequently decried as a 'cocklodger'.

These odd double-standards aren't just hypocritical, they're damaging for women's rights and for feminism. This way of thinking is still underpinned by the assumption that the man should be the main earner and that if he's not, he's some kind of sponger or looser and that - conversely - a wife's role is to be a kept woman and a housewife.

Whatever happened to fighting for equality, independence and fairness!?

I've always been utterly consistent - adults should earn their own money and always work full time. The fact I got shafted by a man on divorce who got more than half my money is consistent with those principles and English law which unfairly favours the lower earner even if that person has always worked full time.

My Gran once told me to always have enough money stashed away to run, she had been in an abusive marriage with an alcoholic and although I didn't know it at the time she knew my marriage was similar (the woman has some intuition it's scary).

I will make sure to tell my DDS the same if I had a DS I would tell him the same too. Have your rainy day fund, dip into it as and when you need it but I'd continue to top it up.

DH earns more, but I have more and I don't work full time or part time, just casual at the moment. We have things in place that states, we keep what's ours and what was shared (i.e joint accounts) gets put into the DCs' accounts.

If the house is his, he should be the only one paying for it. If it's both of yours, then your name needs to be on the paper. I would not invest in something that isn't mine.

I wouldn't hide the fund though, I'd be open about it and tell him why. If he's a quality guy, he'll be fine with it. I think the fact you feel you need to hide it is a little telling. You might want to think about why you're keeping a secret from him.

When I first met DH, I had money in my own private savings account. He was fine with it. When we got married we shifted with a joint account, but I might start my own private savings again anyway just because it takes a little stress off my personally to have a tiny nest egg of my own. I've told him, and again, he's perfectly fine with that.

Babycham, double standards are rife on MN.

If a woman doesn't want to work MN says of course it's understandable they want to stay home with the children, men on the other hand who want to quit work are lazy and workshy. Likewise when the SAHP is a woman she's there to do the childcare and the DH should come home and start the housework yet a SAHD is called all sorts if he doesn't do the housework as well.

Same goes for living together, the man is called a cocklodger where the woman owns the house and he doesn't want to pay for a house he doesn't own and has no share in whereas women are encouraged to stop sharing expenses in the same circumstances.

The old fashioned men work women don't is so outdated yet so many still pander to it. It's not something I want to teach my child. Why on earth should he grow up believing he has to find work so his wife doesn't have too. Why bother educating girls if that's all they intend to do or believe it's what they should do.

The OP would have to pay her own rent and bills if she lived on her own so of course should contribute to the household. If she wants to save then she can but hidden savings show a distrust.

I think whether to add a DP onto deeds etc (or to expect that) is rather dependent on the individual circumstances. Whether OP's expectations are reasonable or not in this case is irrelevant though as he is making promises and not following through. If he doesn't want to he should be upfront, not expect half the mortgage paid nor money towards improvements. This would allow the OP to build up her own investments / security.

OP I can understand your nervousness and would certainly be building up a nest egg. I'd also look at the current financial situation and consider if your contribution would be 'fair' without the promise of shared ownership.

I have always thought that everyone should save some running away money

What a bizarre and depressing set of responses. There was a similar thread recently from a woman who didn't want to share the equity she'd built up in 'her' house with her DP who the MN coven subsequently decried as a 'cocklodger'.

Except here the OP is paying towards the house, not just living there doing housework.

Regardless of gender, if you're paying for half of something it should be half yours. Investing in something that isn't yours, and you have no legal rights to is just throwing away money each month. I'd refuse. If he's happy to have me help pay for something, then he should be happy to share that with me.

Bulbasaur, it's not a case of 'paying for half of something' any more than renting a house is buying it. It legally belongs to the person paying off the mortgage (unless they default and the bank repossesses); anyone else is a tenant. And why not? The OP would still have to pay for rent and utilities wherever she lived, it wouldn't entitle her to a claim on the property she'd been renting!

How much would it cost to rent for one person in a shared room / house in your area? Or where you were living before moving in with your dp?

And how big is the difference between the rent and your contribution to the mortgage? That's the amount you need to be thinking about discussing saving...

Of course so much depends on the set up - there was a thread on here recently where a couple were buying a house and the dp wouldn't let the op have her name on the deeds despite expecting her to pay half the mortgage (and she was willing to do as tenants in common, balance for different amounts of deposit etc) - that was definitely unfair. If your dp has had the property a while and you moved in then I can see why he would wait to sort things - but he has to be fair in his treatment of you. And the reluctance to talk or make plans is worrying for the long term - even if he has good reasons for his thoughts he needs to be able to communicate if he wants to be married and for it to be happy and successful...

OP, in your position I would buy my own house and rent it out. Don't put yourself in a vulnerable position.

Also if he's not doing anything about the wedding, I'd move out. It might sound extreme but he said that before you moved in and paid half for everything - it sounds as though he doesn't think he has any incentive to change the status quo.

Yes, OP, squirrel it away. I wish I had, and I've been married 14 years.

Bulbasaur, it's not a case of 'paying for half of something' any more than renting a house is buying it. It legally belongs to the person paying off the mortgage (unless they default and the bank repossesses); anyone else is a tenant. And why not? The OP would still have to pay for rent and utilities wherever she lived, it wouldn't entitle her to a claim on the property she'd been renting!

No, she wouldn't own it if she was renting, but she would also have legal rights to her tenancy if she was renting.

If I rent a place, I have certain rights regardless of whether the landlord loves me or hates me. I can't be thrown out on a whim, I have to be given notice, and I have a contract that states how long I will be staying.

With a house, that's not the case. She is at the mercy of her DP. If he packed her bags and kicked her out with no warning, she has no legal recourse and he'd be legally allowed to do so.

So.. again. No, I would not pay for rent in a house where I was not getting renters benefits. If my DP wanted me to pay rent, I'd want a contract of sorts so I wasn't there merely on his good graces. Even people that rent out rooms in a random house have more security than she does right now.

Utilities I could understand since she does use half of those. But a house she has no legal rights to, or legal staying power, no way.

Personally, I had my own place until DH and I got a place where we put both our names on the paper. I wouldn't do it any other way.