"if they hit you hit them back"

[solidussnake]

TAAT in a way. why do parents teach children to hit the other child if they've been hit? AIBU to think it's not the best way to go about it?
My mum told me exactly the same thing... why?

I'm on about out and out bullying. I could go on and on about it but thats not what my OP is about
yes but does it set them up for later life?

I've never told this to my children but a friend of mine often did. One day, she confided in me her ds, who is 3, was hitting other kids and lying to her.
Two days later, our ds's were in the toilet at nursery and the teachers heard a scuffle and found them fighting.
Said friend sent me a series of nasty texts accusing my son of strangling hers (my ds had scratch marks on his neck so I think they strangled each other) and hasn't spoken to me since.

I think her ds was too young to interpret 'if they hit you first hit them back' as anything other than 'if someone upsets you in any way you are entitled to hit them'. It makes me sad as the boys were good friends, but my ds is now scared of hers and as she won't talk to me they can't play anyway.

It is something you should only say if your DC can understand it properly.

An added problem, I think, is that fear often drives parents to teach their children how to hit other children. And, when fear is a factor it's unreasonable to expect wise teaching, because fear is already irrational.

I thinked sustained teasing is a form of bullying. And where you draw the line is very much in the eye of the beholder. Which is tricky when you are dealing with youngish children who always see their classmates role in a disagreement so more vividly than their own.

Ds2 (6) got bitten on the hand the other day. After dealing with his indignant outrage it transpired he'd been winding his 'arch-frenemy' up doing the slow-mo fake punch to the face thing so popular at our school at the moment . Should the other boy have bitten him. No. Do I understand why he did - absofuckinglutely. Should ds2 have hit him back (he certainly felt victimised)- no.

The worldis just so more complex than 'if they hit you, hit back'

I was a physical child who enjoyed rough play and even then the boundaries of what was a truly fun 'play fight' and what was an out-and-out 'fight' were quite clear.

My boys are rough but know that a play fight is only a play fight when everybody involved is having fun.

I agree that the world is a complex place and standing up for yourself is far more complex than hitting first/second/last.

IME some parents do the same wrt bad language/swearing.
I have had a 6 yo brought to me in my professional capacity because of his horrible swearing with mum saying "I don't want him to grow up a sissy" and "I don't' know where the fuck he's got it from"

I tell dd to verbally tell them and walk away but if she can't then to hit back as a last resort.

Ha ha I have a post about something similar at the mo

What a conundrum!!

I think ALL Dc should be helped to learn to control their emotions and deal with a situation appropriately from a young age NOT to use violence to begin with....therefore no bullies=no need to hit back....simple

As far as I am concerned bullies need more help than a punch in the face, it may stop them from bullying that one Dc but they just move on to the next Dc.

There were several in my year at school and my parents always told me to hit back but I also knew a lot about these bullies before they started to do what they did...and I wouldn't of wished their lives on anyone let alone want to punch them......BUT that's just me.

Nothing pisses me off more than hearing an adult tell a young child to inflict pain on another child.

Schools run a social pecking order, hit the bully back and you take back control. I can vouch for this personally, there will always be a order and I would rather be at the top than at the bottom (or somewhere in the middle).

Whenever I see people commenting on bullying and how bullies are misunderstood with their own underlying issues. It makes me laugh, we have the same institutional rules and regulations in all different institutions. What ever makes people think they don't exist in schools I'll never know.

In my experience bullies won't pick on those who are prepared to give back as good as they get. Once I learned that I stopped getting bullied...

If ds ever gets bullied we'd prefer him to tell the teacher/ playground supervisor at least 5 times and to have told us so that we and the school have a chance to deal with it before he needs to.

If after that he still needs to hit back then fine I'm all for it as it would be fairly obvious at that point that said bully won't stop with teacher intervention. He starts karate next year with his dad :-)

It worked on the shit of a boy who gave me endless trouble. About the 20th time he'd barged into me in the dinner queue and taken the piss out of my accent, I lost it and swiped backwards and knocked him over. He was too embarrassed to admit that I'd done that. The girl I hit back, nowhere near as hard, though I wished I had, just whinged and got her parents in. And kept it up for another 3 years.

I was thankfully never severely bullied in school but I was a bit of a goth in secondary school so I did come across a bit of silly name calling which I never minded and one particularly rough girl pushed me all the way down one street on the way home. I didn't react, at all. Just kept my head held high and pretended I hadn't noticed her. She never bothered me again so clearly ignoring did the trick. That's how I dealt with any nastiness really, totally blanked it and they do get bored and go away. They do it for a reaction. The softer ones will be scared away if you whack them back but it will spur some of the tougher ones on to target you more often and more ferociously.

I don't hit people, it's not my way of dealing with things at all. I very rarely get angry either. I've found over the years that being passive aggressive and purposely ignoring unreasonable, mean people is the best way of dealing with it and getting to them rather than retaliating. An eye for an eye isn't the answer and I wouldn't want to be reduced to their level either. I'll teach my DC to be the same.

"Never throw the first punch, but always throw the last."

Exactly what I taught my children and what my parents taught me.

I was a shy child who was relentlessly bullied by one particular girl in junior school. I'd be pushed, shoved, pinched and be far too meek to do much about it. One particular day I'd had enough after she'd hit me and I walloped her so hard I split her lip. I was 8 at the time and 30 something years later I still recall the look of absolute shock on her face. She never bothered me again.

I've never said this to my kids. ED had a really hard time through middle school with a group of thoroughly unpleasant girls and it got to the point where she didn't even confide in me any more as I was impotent to help her: they never hit, it was always verbal. We got through it by widening her social circle so when she got to senior school she would know more people. Then at Senior school these girls teamed up with the older bullies there, and several of them travelled on the same school bus as my ED. It was hell for weeks, until the evening they turned on Ed's dyspraxic friend, and gave her enough of a push 'to hurry her up' on the bus stairs that she fell down the last six steps. ED, the shortest kid in the school, turned around and punched the ringleader in the face. School got involved. I was never called in but had pulled her out of school the next day and called to let them know why so they didn't have to call and tell me.
result: ED and her friend were told to sit downstairs on the bus, her form tutor high-fived her on the corridor and she has had a full year of bully free schooling as these girls never approached her again. Five years of misery erased in a single punch.
I don't know if she had lashed out five years earlier that it would have been the ultimate solution it has been, but I wish I'd been able to tell her it would have been OK.

When my DH was a boy he was physically bullied at school and his dad told him to hit them back - which he did. The bullying soon stopped.

My DH said it's a lesson he will be teaching our DS too.

If some random woman starting physically assaulting me I would give as good as I got and fight back with no qualms!!

Like a previous poster said - it's about not being a doormat. Bullies trend not to hurt people who fight back.

Never hit first son, but always hit last advice from my Dad when I was going to "big school" is a dodgy part of S London in the 1970s.

*in a

My niece was badly bullied at school. Until the day she walked in and punched the bully in the face.

Sometimes it works. I would tell my children to hit back. What's wrong with it? Someone hits you, thump them back!

When I was at school, hitting bullies back did no good! All that happened was they would recruit friends to join in! Personal experience.

My DCs school on the other hand clamps down hard and firmly, from the very start.
This also covers verbal bullying, such as calling my v. Skinny DD - "fat". As a result, bullying stops pretty quickly. The only real issues are when staff don't take the bullying seriously enough eg. Bullying a boy about being "Ginger".

In adult life if you hit someone you can end up in prison, regardless of their provocation.

This was my grandads advice to me about a boy constantly picking at me, one day he slapped me so I smacked him as hard as I could in the nose and broke it. He did leave me alone after that but carried on being a general twat until he was jailed a few years back

"Hit them right back" it's then just a never ending arms race to hit the hardest ffs. No. I don't encourage fighting of any kind, this is just teaching them to not be responsible for their actions. When I was 5 I'd figured out "but they started it" was hardly a solid defence.

DoraGora

I think the problem with using violence in the home is that you'd really need to be an expert if you're going to do that. School is a public place and conflict doesn't go unnoticed (even if the teachers then do bugger all). At home, if hubby has a propensity to hit and she hits back, then it's going to become an all out fight with one coming out on top. A little bit of martial arts knowledge (and courage) is no good then. You need all of it.

There is a MASSIVE problem with using violence in the home....it is called DOMESTIC VIOLENCE.

I have done martial arts for 20 years. I have never hit DH and never would, no matter how annoying he was being. You just do not raise your hands to someone no matter what.

I was once involved in a DV relationship, if you can call it that as I was only assaulted once and I phoned the police and had him arrested. Even then I used the absolute minimum force necessary to end the assault. I could have done him some serious damage but martial art training is NOT about kicking the crap out of people, it is about being calm and controlled in a combat situation and doing the perpetrator the absolute minimum harm to end the assault.

I was raised with DV and only started karate at 12 to defend myself and my mum against my dad who was 6 foot 3 and could really pack a punch.

Most Muay Thai boxers I know, including Sandy Holt are not thugs, they are peaceful people who like the sport and like getting fit. If any thugs did turn up at Sandy's gym they would not be allowed to train there and he makes it very clear if someone does start a pub brawl he will be the first to give a statement to the police.

One boy constantly whipped Ds around the face with his sweatshirt in the changing rooms after PE. How I wish DS had lamped him one.

Taught mine to never not but if hit to hit back and hit harder.

It's not nice but bullies are cowardsis the absolute truth.

I found it easier with my lads as the bullying is usually physical.

With girls it can be far more subtle and far more insidious.

However my dd did grab one particularly nasty specimen who had been calling her mate 'a fat cow' dd slammed her up against the wall and then loudly called the other kids to 'look this is what a nasty bitch looks like. It's just Ugly'.

She got whoops of applause as this girl was a huge bully.

Dd is 15. That's my girl.

Sorry but that's exactly what I told my ds last night as a boy has been picking on him in school. We live in an estate so the same people who go to his school are our neighbours and I'm not having this boy then carrying it on outside school. He needs to stick up for himself before he becomes a doormat. DM was the 'tell an adult, don't hit back' type person and that never worked with the ones who bullied me.