AIBU to want to send dd to an outstanding primary?

[DxbtoLHR]

Usually a lurker, first time posting in AIBU so be gentle with me!

DH has got a job in a new city, we've had a look around at some houses with our main criteria being close to an "outstanding" primary as next year DD will start reception.

The problem is that for our budget, we are getting places that are either tiny or are not in a great condition. Dh is suggesting looking at other areas, with better houses and the local primary being ofsted rated good.

Also because the deadline for applying for a primary school place is Jan 15th, I would prefer to finalize something in the next few weeks. However, estate agent have told us that this is a quiet season for them and things usually pick up after mid January. So DH wants to get a house after that time so that we would have more options and get something better. Lastly, dh plans on being in this job for about two years, so according to him, its not essential for DD to attend an outstanding primary and it wont make a big difference so early on in her education.

Am I placing too much importance on an outstanding school? What is the difference really between an outstanding school and a good one? AIBU to want DD to go to an outstanding school if it's "just" for infants?

Didn't realise it would be so long! Thanks for reading!

Unless you actually move before Jan 15th you may have no choice in the matter.

I would be conscious of an ofsted rating, but wouldn't base my decision solely on it.
Rather visit the school.
My dds school is, IMO, absolutely outstanding. It has an ofsted rating of good, because the brilliant ht has stacks of common sense and doesn't just tick boxes, she's more interested in the children's well being.

Yabu outstanding means little.

I'm a parent governor at a school that I would recommend to any parent. We are rated Good and I am very happy with that.

I think Good generally indicates that the school has given solid attention to some key aspects which are worth having in your child's education - although plenty of RI schools will be doing that too. Outstanding just says to me that the school has jumped through a lot of rather idiosyncratic, OFSTED defined hoops. What OFSTED considers outstanding may not be the education you want for your child.

Also bear in mind that once a school is rated Outstanding they don't get inspected again for ages. I was slightly horrified to realise that the Outstanding secondary school we recently looked at for DS was given that rating in 2008 and hasn't been looked at again since. That's an awful long time to trade on a single inspection.

Agree with other Pps - if you can possibly visit the schools, do so. Only way.

I presume you are talking about renting? Even if you want to buy eventually, renting is ago if idea short term in a new city.

If you were planning to buy you're unlikely to be in for the deadline aren't you? This may mean no choice as you're application will be looked at last after all the on time applications.

Check LEA admissions policy very carefully, whatever you decide.

In our LEA you are not considered to be 'in' the catchment area of a school unless you either live there or have exchanged contracts on a house. The chances of you finding a house and getting all the way to exchanging contracts by Jan 15th are very slim.

The same applies to oversubscribed good schools.

What is the difference really between an outstanding school and a good one?

A fluke, usually.

I think you have to use some common sense though. Imagine how you would feel if you buy a shoebox in the catchment of an outstanding school and a) you still don't get your child in as they're oversubscribed and too many siblings get places even though you live closer, b) it has its Ofsted and gets RI! You'll still have to line in the shoebox as you can't sell it as it's in the catchment of a crap school!

Many Ofsted inspections are not worth the paper they're written on. Visit some schools, ask some questions, look at the facilities, find the SATs results, check out the teachers/children/parents. That's more important.

When my DS started school the ofsted was satisfactory ( the previous label for requires improvement) The school always had a lovely feel about it. It the got requires improvement and the kids are pushed more.

A friend conversely her Dc's School has just got outstanding and she has serious issues about the school which were highlighted by changes that were made on the day of ofsted.

Honestly visit the schools trust your gut instinct. That's what parents did before Ofsted

Have you visited the schools concerned?

OFSTED cannot be trusted to make accurate decisions. Also, their idea of outstanding may be different to yours. I say thsi as a parent and a teacher!

My local village school, that my child will be going to, was graded outstanding only four years ago. Three years later it was downgraded to serious weaknesses (grade 4 - inadequate). Personally, I never believed for one moment the school was outstanding but nevertheless, thought serious weaknesses was harsh and totally disagreed with it. So to summarise, my child is going to an inadequate school from January and I am very happy with my choice.

I also agree, on the principal above, that today's outstanding school can be tomorrow's special measure school! OFSTED change their criteria of what makes a good or outstanding school every friggin' year, and quite frankly, schools cannot keep up with the pace of change and it also depends on the inspector inspecting the school.

I have also heard of some outstanding schools being completely inadequate when it comes to communication and focus on the academics than the personal well being of the child. My local village school was totally inadequate when it came to inclusion and SEN. Many parents were disassatisfied because children with learning difficulties were ridiculed, not helped, given work too hard and even some who weren't good with sports were excluded from the sports day and parents only realised when they turned up to watch!

What I am saying is, take OFSTED reports with a pinch of salt. We all want the best for our children but grades and levels of attainment aren't always the best way to judge if a school is outstanding.

Try to make a list of what you want for your child when she goes to school, what expectations you expect of homework, extra curricular activities, after school clubs, breakfast clubs, educational visits, creative curriculum etc, etc and look for the things you want and base your judgements on that.

Personally, parents are much better equipped to decide what is best for their child, not OFSTED.

Also, remember that some schools with outstanding ofsteds were awarded them years ago-before the goalposts changed, when the old good become a satisfactory etc so if they were to be inspected again now, it's quite feasible they'd only be a good but they've just escaped being watched for so long.

We moved to be near a good school that absolutely everyone said was amazing, heads amazing, results amazing etc. I find the mums a bit pushy and I'm disappointed at the play facilities and emphasis on formal teaching. Wish I'd had a think about my own and ds priorities first!

Good point about living in a shoe box.

Your child will be at the school 6 hours a day, you will be living in that house 24/7. I bet they would rather have a decent amount of space to play in and a nice garden than an outstanding school!

You will all be iiving in the house not at the school. Will DD being at an "outstanding" (whatever that may mean) primary school make up for the fact that all of you are miserable at home in something too small or inadequate for your household needs? And who can g'tee the school will remain outstanding. Get the house you want. Screw the school.

Bogey You said it better than I did but we both agree.

You, rather than Ofsted, are best placed to decide if a school is right for your DCs.

I sent dd to a good primary rather than the outstanding one that is our catchment school. I considered it far superior and dd enjoyed her time there immensely. I wouldn't rely on OFSTED reports but would visit the schools instead as what might be important to you may be different.
As it is I think our catchment school relies on the largely MC catchment and their willingness to use tutors to support teaching. Dd's school was in a deprived area and the fact that 100% of children made 2 levels progress, and almost half made three in ks2 was solely down to the school itself.

I agree that an outstanding rating is not everything. You really need to visit the schools and find out whether you feel comfortable with them, and whether you like the area and the people generally, before you commit to buying there.

I would say find the school you like first, rent in that area to get your child in, then look at buying somewhere nearby that is a sensible travelling distance but not necessarily in catchment afterwards.

If you are concerned about house prices getting out of control then find the right school first, rent in the catchment area ASAP to get DD's name down before the cut off, then focus on finding a house to buy with the intention of renting it out in the short term, and only move into it once your DD is settled in school.

We bought a smaller house in order to be near to our preferred school, but it wasn't rated "outstanding" at the time - just "good". We looked at a few schools, and chose the one we liked best - as it happened, it was rated "outstanding" a couple of years after dd started, while the previously "outstanding" school was told that it had to improve.

I would definitely say that it's worth having a smaller house for the sake of a good school, but I'd use my own judgement of the schools, rather than relying on ofsted ratings.

Near me the outstanding schools vary, one is in a very expensive area, top of league tables but consists of parents giving large donations to the school and private tuition from reception age.
Another is in an area with a mixture of house prices, parents don't give large donations, it's probably has about 20% having private tuition compared to 100% in the other school and it is mid range in the league tables.
It show's how you should look at the schools and go with your gut feeling as they can vary a lot even though they may both have the same Ofsted result.

I've work in 2 good schools, and 1 outstanding school. I would send a child of mine to either of the good schools, but certainly not the outstanding one. OFSTED grades aren't everything.

Thank you for all the responses. Clearly the consensus is to not be so easily swayed by ofsted ratings! Yes I was definitely too focused on what ofsted had said about the school. We live a while away from this place, it's not practical to go on a weekday so we have only had viewings on a Saturday so far. But will try to go on a week day so I can visit some schools.

Yes we are planning on renting, so it would only take a couple of weeks if the house was empty. Then we'd have the tenancy agreement in hand to apply for local schools.

From what I understand, if we apply after 15th Jan then the LEA could allocate any school place available to DD. (Is that right?) I think we will still aim to find a place before then, but not aiming for one close to an outstanding school.

thanks once again.

DD school used to be good school and now it is OFSTED inadequate. It went from being a good school to utterly awful school really quickly. The quality of the head makes such a difference. If I was you I would consider "good" schools.