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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To not breed my bitch

118 replies

FluffyMcnuffy · 26/10/2014 19:47

I have a 6 month old bitch who is a truly lovely dog, however I feel like I'm being put under a lot of pressure to breed her (by people interested in pups, family and breed "in the know" people).

She was the only bitch in a litter of four (also one bitch in previous litter of four - mum only had two litters) and so people are keen for the "line" from the mother (winning show dog) to continue. I've been told by breed experts that she's a really good example of the breed, and crucially she does have a "squashed face" in a breed that at the moment is typically being bred to be more braceycephalic.

She is a relatively rare breed (and in this particular breed, dogs of a "good standard" are very rare. She also is really well tempered (so far) in a breed that has a reputation for being aggressive; she's a great pet for me.

If I were to breed from her then I already have a double figures waiting list for pups and even if someone were to be unable to take/keep one for whatever reason I would be able to give it a home.

But the selfish part of me doesn't want to breed her, she's my dog and I don't want to put her through unecessary pain. Am I being selfish?

OP posts:
SqueakyChicken · 26/10/2014 20:28

If it was so important this bitch was bred from, why didn't the breeder keep her?

Original poster
FluffyMcnuffy · 26/10/2014 20:29

Ralth Sad Weimeraners are lovely dogs!

OP posts:
AlpacaYourThings · 26/10/2014 20:33

YANBU. I bloody love Chow Chows!! please post a pic

My vet looked disappointed when I said I wasn't breeding my bitch, I was Shock

Original poster
FluffyMcnuffy · 26/10/2014 20:37

Very good point squeaky, to be fair I never said I'd breed her when I bought her!

I'm pleased she's getting a positive reception, I thought chows would be on the "mumsnet hated list" Grin.

OP posts:
raltheraffe · 26/10/2014 20:38

It was a real shame for Zara. I really loved her and realized a lot of her behaviour was down to the abusers who had her before she ended up in rescue.
I am very limited nowadays with rescuing and fostering due to safety of our 3 year old son being number one priority, but hopefully when he gets older I will get to help more troubled dogs.

weaselwords · 26/10/2014 20:50

You aren't being unreasonable to not breed her at all! It's a massive gamble with a much loved pet's health. Equally, you wouldn't be unreasonable to breed her either as so many people want her puppies. Considerate people get put off breeding good quality dogs, because so many people breed indiscriminately for the money and with no care for their dogs or furthering the breed.

raltheraffe I have a screwed up weimaraner. They are easy to mess up and hard to manage afterwards. Mine wasn't abused as such, but her original family didn't socialise her and kept her in a cupboard under the stairs for long periods of time up to 4 months old. I'm her third home Sad

lljkk · 26/10/2014 21:06

We had a half-Weimeranner half Doberman semi-rescue who routinely bit strangers (totally safe with family, though), including a motor-cycle cop once. She was overtly racist and didn't like beards or bikes, so a black man with beard on a bike was doomed.

We called her Nazi Dog (very un-PC I know, I would do it again ).

It's all true, honest! 1970s another country. She'd have failed to make her 3rd birthday in modern-day Britain.

raltheraffe · 26/10/2014 21:32

My grandparents had a poodle that hated the smell of Indian food and bit only Indians and Pakistanis.

LoathsomeDrab · 26/10/2014 21:48

I'm now feeling unreasonably smug Grin

Given her breed and the fact she's not brachycephalic (which I believe is becoming a real issue in chow chows) I'm not surprised people are keen for you to breed from her but she's yours and it's entirely your choice.

If we want to keep existing breeds then it is important for new, responsible and dedicated people to take up breeding. If that doesn't happen we'll just be left with the puppy farms and BYBs. Even so, nobody should feel obligated to take up breeding just because they happen to have a dog who is a great example of the breed.

Original poster
FluffyMcnuffy · 26/10/2014 22:02

Loath unfortunately people seem to think "awww look at that cute chow with the squashed face" Hmm. It's not healthy and chows are not meant to be super squashed. It is becoming a problem I believe because of the demand for the "squashed face" chows Angry.

OP posts:
Original poster
FluffyMcnuffy · 26/10/2014 22:06

I can see the breed going the same way as pugs/Bulldogs and ending up with loads of health problems. Sad. This is where the AIBU comes in!

OP posts:
LoathsomeDrab · 26/10/2014 22:10

It's such a shame, you see some these days that more like fluffy shar peis than proper chows Sad

mrsrupertpenryjones · 26/10/2014 22:24

I want one, I want one!

MsAdorabelleDearheartVonLipwig · 26/10/2014 22:36

Well unless the breed is about to die out no of course YANBU.

DraaaamaghAlpacaaaagh · 26/10/2014 22:50

I love the translation of chow chow - 'puffy-lion dog' Grin

YANBU not to breed from her. We have a gorgeous springer from a very good working strain. The expectation amongst people with working dogs where we live is that you will let your bitch have at least one litter and sell the pups. I got her spayed after her first season. I didn't want to put either her or me through it and didn't give two figs about the working strain dying out if we didn't. My dog's welfare is much more important to me, and she is a wonderful dog & a great pet.

Alisvolatpropiis · 26/10/2014 23:01

If you had said she was a Corgi I may have suggested you bred her, as the breed is now at risk or very close to it.

Not a "trendy" breed these days. A shame as they're lovely dogs.

JoffreyBaratheon · 26/10/2014 23:24

I doubt the pups would be worth that much, tbh, if your dog isn't herself Crufts qualified. (3 CCs). However rare she is.

My old dog was Crufts qualified when I got her, but we immediately retired her from the show ring. Her sister is the top example ever, it is thought, of her breed and only 170 odd, if that, of this breed are born in a year, in the UK. My dog did have one litter and her son went on to win Westminster (US equivalent of Crufts). That was maybe 10 years ago or so and he remains the most prestigious winner in the history of the breed, in the US.

I bred from her once and she only had 3 pups. Largely because I only got her on a contract with the breeder if I agreed to let her have one litter. We never did again despite her pup, as I say, winning Westminster.

If your dog has good blood lines it means nothing unless your dog is itself at least a champion. Not sure who is telling you otherwise but I suspect they're wrong. Spay her. Spay her now.

I had mine spayed after the one litter we were contracted for, and she was like a different dog. Her seasons had always made her depressed and stressed. Without them, she was so much healthier and happier.

Only ignorant people/backstreet breeders want to use a dog that is not itself a champion, for a stud or as a breeding bitch. No matter how 'rare' the breed is.

SlowlorisIncognito · 26/10/2014 23:41

Could you afford to pay for an EMC if she needed one? Could you afford to be out of pocket due to medical expenses? Often, breeding expenses are not covered by pet insurance, and in the worst case scenarios can run into huge figures.

Equally, there is always the chance that she could face life threatening health complications, and one or more puppies could be still born. This can be very distressing, even if you think you are prepared for it.

I would say that if it was so important to breed from her, the original owners should have sold her to a breeding home. I also think there are a lot of people associated with the kennel club and breed associations who's main concern is not the welfare of the dog.

18 months is a good age to get her spayed from a health point of view.

I do think breeding (of any animal) is something you should only do if you're totally committed to it. I also think there's no moral obligation to preserve breeds of artificially created domestic animals.

SplatTheScaryCat · 26/10/2014 23:58

we've had the same thing with our dog, he's a gorgeous, healthy animal who hits all the breed particulars, and because of the care/attention that went into choosing him, has a breathtaking pedigree, and his breeder does show and he's got more champions than most dogs in his immediate lineage, and crucially (as a king charles) his line has very little incidence of MVD or syringomyelia.

We bought him as a pet, he was sold as a pet, he was never KC registered. He was the only one from a little of 4 sold as a pet, the rest were either kept or passed on to show people.

Yes, we could make a small fortune putting him to stud if we wanted to, but he was never bought to make money out of, so we continue to refuse all offers!

in a nutshell, yanbu, if the breeder wanted a litter from her, they should have put it in the contract!

iggymama · 27/10/2014 00:00

YANBU.

Sounds like she is lucky to be with you. Her life could have been very different as a breeding machine.

SurfsUp1 · 27/10/2014 00:15

Go to your local animal shelter and then tell me there's any good argument for purposely breeding more dogs. Sad

No one should accept money for puppies IMO.

JoffreyBaratheon · 27/10/2014 00:23

Doesn't matter how many red CCs are on your dog's pedigree if your dog itself has none it is worthless as a stud or breeding bitch.

LoathsomeDrab · 27/10/2014 00:31

Only ignorant people/backstreet breeders want to use a dog that is not itself a champion, for a stud or as a breeding bitch.

That's a bit of a sweeping statement. It's unnecessarily restrictive to only use champions and is a very quick way to narrow already closed gene pools.

There's a only a finite number of dogs that can become champions because there is a finite number of shows to compete at. It can be very difficult to gain champion titles in very populous breeds because of the sheer number of dogs competing. That is why the KC has different stud book bands for different breeds, if the requirements were the same across the board only a very tiny proportion of popular breeds would ever gain their stud book number.

JoffreyBaratheon · 27/10/2014 00:40

I was trying to counteract that idea that "My dog is quite a rare breed - I could make a bomb from it at stud" which is precisely how backstreet breeding starts. If your dog is not a winner in itself, why breed from it?

Iliveinalighthousewiththeghost · 27/10/2014 01:01

Adore dogs and double adore cute little pups as much as the next person but I don't know enough about this subject to have a valid opinion, but I can't help thinking isn't it cruel to not let them have at least one litter.
I know I'm letting my heart lead rather than my head, but imagine if someone dictated when we were born whether or not we got to breed. We wouldn't like it would we. Animals get broody like we do.

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